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[ANSWERED] Clear up the oil confusion regarding aftermarket DEXOS 2?

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[ANSWERED] Clear up the oil confusion regarding aftermarket DEXOS 2?

 
Old 03-13-2019, 06:25 PM
  #41  
AzDave47
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?? the link says I am not authorized to view the page?
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Old 03-14-2019, 10:56 AM
  #42  
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Old 03-16-2019, 02:47 AM
  #43  
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Most any high quality 0w-30, 5w30,0w-40 etc, etc given it matches the conditions the vehicle is driven will likely not harm the engine. But non Dexos oil in a blown motor being claimed under warranty is not a prefered situation for an owner. I do believe some of ESP 0W-40 formulation could possibly reduce cam phasing issues with AFM as it has caused engine failures costing GM MONEY. As well as reduce carbon buildup on intake valves that DI engines experience. Much of the "Dexos" formula is based on the ability to help reduce emissions and allow use of emission reducing devices that some non DEXOS approved oils may not allow to function as efficiently . Why the emissions matter so much? Emissions compliance required by government to meet current and future tiers and phases of clean air act and many more reasons. Can cost GM MONEY and future changes could earn tax credits. Another part of Dexos formula is to aid fuel economy. GM has earned billions in tax credits (MONEY) for their US CAFE rating. Fuel economy & emissions are submitted to the EPA with a factory filled specific oil and EPA test cars with the factory fill specified oil. GM is a publicly traded company, and the #1 priority of a publicly traded company is MONEY. I don't say this as a bad thing. Just that GM's primary justification for DEXOS approved oil might not be that it is the best performance oil for your Corvette. I'm not an engineer for an auto manufacturer or oil manufacturer so I can't back my opinion scientifically. I have never been told any of this info directly from a GM employee or representative. I do have a bit of experience with the brand though. From 2006-2017 I was a sales manager & finance director for a GM dealership. A finance director for another GM dealership in 2005 and sales manager or sales person for another GM dealer from 2000-2005.
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Old 03-16-2019, 07:39 PM
  #44  
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As of March 16, 2019, there are no Chevy dealers in metropolitan Orange County California that have the 0W40 Dexos 2 Mobil 1 to sell to me, for use in my 2019 Stingray. And two dealers told me they are using the european formula 0W40 Mobil 1 to do oil changes on 2019 Vettes. What's an owner supposed to do when their car needs oil?
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Old 03-17-2019, 01:07 PM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Patman View Post
Do you honestly think you'll get the same level of performance from Walmart's Supertech synthetic? It is dexos1 certified but I bet you it won't give you the same level of engine cleanliness in the long run as a high quality oil like Mobil 1, Pennzoil or Castrol will.
I don;t know what is in Walmart oil, but I said a high quality brand. I wouldn't run Walmart oil in my lawnmower.

My point was between good brands like Penzoil, M1, Castrol ect your engine isn't going to last any longer or shorter by using something other than M1, because M1 is only recommended due to a marketing deal, not because there is anything special about it.
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Old 03-17-2019, 04:00 PM
  #46  
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Originally Posted by Yamoto View Post
I don;t know what is in Walmart oil, but I said a high quality brand. I wouldn't run Walmart oil in my lawnmower.

My point was between good brands like Penzoil, M1, Castrol ect your engine isn't going to last any longer or shorter by using something other than M1, because M1 is only recommended due to a marketing deal, not because there is anything special about it.
I'm not trying to kick the hornets nest, but Mobil is actually one of the suppliers for Walmart oil, depending on region. It would say XOM on the bottom of the container.

To that end, if a brand is on the GM list of Dexos 1 approved oils, then they meet the minimum specified requirements for the engine. I'm not using Supertech either, but, by definition, it shouldn't hurt anything over a normal street-use oil change interval. The better brands will certainly have more additives for additional protection. From there, it goes back to gbizel's post #43...
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Old 03-17-2019, 05:46 PM
  #47  
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Supertech synthetic is supplied by a few different oil manufacturers depending on the region but NONE of those manufacturers are ExxonMobil. So youíre not going to get Mobil 1 in a Supertech jug for $17
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Old 03-17-2019, 06:13 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by Patman View Post
Supertech synthetic is supplied by a few different oil manufacturers depending on the region but NONE of those manufacturers are ExxonMobil. So youíre not going to get Mobil 1 in a Supertech jug for $17
You are correct. They are one of several suppliers for the conventional oil. I wasn't trying to imply the oil was comparable to M1. Just attempting to say the brand itself isn't garbage.
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Old 03-18-2019, 06:14 AM
  #49  
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Itís definitely a good enough oil for running in a daily driver but for a high performance or forced induction engine I would be hesitant to recommend it
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Old 03-18-2019, 11:17 PM
  #50  
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azdave, i respect your insight. you use 0w-40 fs or esp?

I live far north and really don't track my car any more, but I still use 0w-40 as I still tend to only start it if it is going to get a long drive in. My car is not under warranty or an LT, it is a LS7 with some valve changes... Looks like the esp is "thicker" than the FS. I agree with your assessment (statement of fact) that 0w-40 is thicker than 5w-30 at nearly all street temps. It runs higher PSI in my ls7 until about 180F, then, to me, it runs the same or negligible difference than the 5w-30 i used to run. But I assume it still protects better and lasts longer when hot.

Frankly, I'd go back to 5w-30 (or more likely 0w-30), but I just feel the 0w-40 has a better base stock and is a "better" oil even if it is too thick for my needs nowadays. (note the subtle difference in Mobil's description of the two oils)

(As for why not use what GM recommends, as is always asked during these discussions, the above reasonable positions are one example, the other is all the LS7's that didn't make the warranty mileage before exploding on 5w-30 (or failing inspection like mine). Clearly there is room for improvement. Many people smarter than me feel 5w-30 has no place in most engines when longevity is primary concern.)

I am just not sure I want to go even thicker with the ESP, if I'm reading the specs correctly (higher vis at 100C, lower VI, and higher HTHS than the FS). These were from specs from UK Mobil 1 site...

Are FS and ESP going to both be available going forward??
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Old 03-19-2019, 01:31 AM
  #51  
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I use 0w-40 fs, primarily because I do some track events but don't want to use 5w-30 on the street, change to 15w-50 of a track day and then back to 5w-30. For street use 5w-30 is fine except for temps down below 0*F, where the 0w-40 would be thinner and get circulation more quickly. Not too many people drive their Z06's below 0*, especially since the factory supplies them with summer only tires that get slippy at 40* and should not be driven below 20* (PSS) or 40* (PSC2).

5w-30 isn't good for road course work as we see 280-290*F oil temps and that is too high for 5w-30, whereas 0w-40 will be good up to/over 300*F.

The new M1 5w-30 esp is not readily available yet, even some dealers claim they cannot get it. For my HCI car with OR x-pipe, I'd prefer higher Zinc/phosphorus than in the cat-friendly oils.
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Old 03-19-2019, 05:48 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by 80atez View Post

Are FS and ESP going to both be available going forward??
Mobil 1 will most definitely continue to sell the FS (European Car Formula) 0w40, as it serves a different purpose than the ESP Formula 0w40. The FS formula has a lot of European car certifications for cars like Mercedes Benz and Porsche and is not only popular here in North America but is very popular (obviously) in Europe. It's one of their best selling oils actually. So it won't be going away any time soon. It also has a higher starting TBN so it is geared for longer drain intervals than ESP Formula. Because ESP Formula is a low SAPS oil with a lower starting TBN, it's really not meant to go much longer than about 7500 miles, but European Car Formula is generally good for about 15,000 miles (which is important since Europeans prefer those longer intervals)
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Old 03-20-2019, 01:12 AM
  #53  
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What about using 0w40 ESP in a C5 LS1
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Old 03-20-2019, 10:13 AM
  #54  
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Originally Posted by Zedred View Post
What about using 0w40 ESP in a C5 LS1
Why not just use M1 0W-40 FS, if your driving justifies it, like very high oil temps >260* or you drive in sub-zero conditions. Otherwise 5W-30 should be fine.
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Old 03-20-2019, 02:47 PM
  #55  
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Just had the dealer perform an oil change on my 2016 Z06 with Callaway SC757 upgrade. Total cost was $139.88 which included 10 quarts of M1 0W40 Dexos Gen 2 (GM Part Number 19353135) at $9.30/quart plus filter and taxes.

The difference between men and boys is the price of the toys... and the maintenance costs!
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Old 03-23-2019, 10:13 AM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by Patman View Post
What I'm curious about (and I am rather confident I'll be ok) is if GM would approve of my using Mobil 1 5w30 ESP Formula in my 2018 instead? It is dexos2 certified, like the 0w40 ESP Formula, but the 2019 manual recommends a 0w40 dexos2 oil and my 2018 manual recommends a 5w30 dexos1 oil. So the 5w30 version of ESP Formula partially covers both of those manual's requirements. (FWIW, 5w30 ESP Formula has now been replaced by a new formula simply called 5w30 ESP, although I have 5 oil changes worth of the older formula and will probably buy up more of it as I have been buying it on clearance at a lot of Canadian Tire locations up here)
Sorry about the necro quote - have you or do you know of anyone who has done an A-B VOA on 0W-40 ESP vs 0W-40 European formula?

Reason being I had 2 jugs out of CT last fall - thought better of it and took them back the next day...
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Old 03-23-2019, 12:02 PM
  #57  
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I have not seen a VOA done on ESP Formula 0w40 yet, but there are plenty of VOAs for European Formula 0w40.

There are a few UOAs now for ESP Formula 0w40 so that can give you a rough idea of the additive makeup in comparison to Euro 0w40.
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Old 03-25-2019, 07:02 PM
  #58  
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Still awaiting wide-spread availability in 5 quart jugs or 1 quart containers at auto parts store retailers, Wallmart or equivalent store. Buying 10 1 quart jugs from sparse distant dealers each time I change my oil is wasteful and an inconvenience, not to mention double the average price for Mobile1 0W-40 Dexos 2 vs equivalent mobil1 5W-30 dexos1/2 the dealers are charging. We are talking about $30-$50 vs $100 oil changes for the competent do-it-yourselfers...however my point stands.

Thankful there is a one product dual-application GM recommended oil for street and track use but it shouldn't take 2+ years to hit the mainstream market for an oil that has already been in production for a long time.................................... ............................
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Old 04-12-2019, 08:01 AM
  #59  
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I will not go over xW40 with a dry sump engine... xW50 stays far too thick at high temp and will not circulate fast enough in the engine. That is why GM and Tadge do not mention any viscosity over 40.
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Old 04-12-2019, 09:35 AM
  #60  
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Originally Posted by Fastmikefree View Post
I will not go over xW40 with a dry sump engine... xW50 stays far too thick at high temp and will not circulate fast enough in the engine. That is why GM and Tadge do not mention any viscosity over 40.
Eh, You realize that 15w50 is track spec in the owners manual for these cars?
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