WNDOPDLR

Tell me more about the flat spring. Mine is a dedicated track C4 used only in DE's, so I can toss out the rule book. Does the flat spring change the ride stance? Does it allow for corner weighting? I may be interested in buying yours and we do not live all that far apart.

RAFTRACER

Flat spring from Vette Brakes and Products can be had in many various rates , is completely dead flat ( no arch) and has C5 type screw jack adjusters on each end to have a large range of ride hieght adjustment and also enables you to finer corner wieght your car. Call Pattie for further info at VBP (800)237-9991

Or buy Johnny's............................

Johnny, going to Sebring ???? I am still trying to decide.

FB#1

Andy, I think you need a boat anchor in your hatch to slow you down.

I just finished installing the fuel cell and new brake lines, pads and rotors.

my weights ended up pretty good for an old C3

2780 total

lf 748 rf 735

lr 670 rr 647

50.2% crossweight

with me in the car it got to 51/49 front to back.

I'll get up with you at the next event we both make it to.

Carolina C4 Racer

Just to clear something up here since there has appearantly been some misinformation spread around:
The VB&P adjustable spring was NEVER legal in (NCCC) Group 2 for 84 to 96 model years. The rulebook clearly states that the springs "must be stock configuration" & having an adjuster on each end was clearly, in my opinion & in the opinion of the competition directors, NOT stock configuration. However some people, like Don Smith & Johnny, for whatever reason chose to install these springs on their cars anyway.
So when I (Anthony Marlar) started running in Group 2G in the spring of 2005. I asked for a "rulebook clarification" to find out if this was a legal part, if it was I would purchase one, if it wasn't (like I suspected) then anybody using one would have the opportunity to change the spring or change classes. I could have filed a protest and had someome disqualified at an event but I chose to give everyone the benefit of the doubt with the "rulebook clarification". That is NOT a "witch hunt". That IS treating your fellow competitors with dignity & respect & that IS the way I do business.

For Raft, although we have never met, I respect your opinion & your ability. The above story is the Facts from the original source not some second or third hand story passed along to you by someone that was mad adout having to purchase another set of leaf springs.

Anthony

69autoXr

Nevertheless, I think it's an old school rule that should be updated to allow easily adustable front ride height in a C4. I mean, what is so wrong with that? Whether you shim it or use bolts to change it, is there really any difference other than one way is easier than the other? Particularly since C5's and 6's are configured that way. It's not such an evil thing and really doesn't offer a performance advantage.

RAFTRACER

I also agree that the ruling is a little strange when you can have the same spring without the adjusters , but instead pads and then shimmed at the frame mount for ride hieght and corner wieght. Or you can have VBP build a spring that has the same rate , but configured with arch and have more pain in the a## trying to achieve ride hieght. End result the car is just as fast as the flat spring with adjusters............ All of this out of an organization that receives money from VBP as sponsorship/advertising dollars. I enjoy running NCCC events , but some of their rules across classes and groups are absolutely archiac. Original configuration is met simply in the fact that the spring is still a composite monoleaf. A coil spring wouldn't be an original configuration. People are scared of what they don't understand, I fully understand that if I were driving a Group 2 C4 , I would be no slower without the adjusters, just more of a pain to get car set-up right which still equals spending more money..............................

Yes, I did hear some of this information 1st,2nd and 3rd hands, but I think I heard about this before you were involved in this and If Johnny and Don were "sought out" for this and rule clarification , it was because they were probably faster than others , I am sure. I am also sure that these two individuals were not cheating intentionally, they interpreted the rules the way they did, which would be the same way I would unless there was a clarification like this ( albiet not an outright performance advantage, the spring rate will help way more than the adjusters). In the SCCA this spring is legal and judged as being the "original configuration".

I am sorry if you think you were the one that created the witch hunt, but I believe it was someone else in 2004. I am sure your competitors were very appreciative that you handled this situation the way you did, very friendly indeed.

I'll have to look again at the rules, but if Johnny is right and that bumps you all the way to RP, the competition directors need to have their hands examined. When you are allowed to play with spring rate , the only thing that is gained with the adjusters is ease of setting the car up.....take that to the bank.

Need to come down to play with you guys in the South sometime, sounds like you have a blast.

racerwannabe

i never believed there was a witch hunt..just sounded good to say i was pointed out..rules is rules..i never really read that part...took it off when it was pointed to my attention ...
johnny

RAFTeRACER

That sounds like witch talk to me! If I ran a beef jerky mono leaf in the stock configuration and won races someone would contest until the price came down on beef jerky mono-leaf springs, then everybody would have one and no excuse for losing.

Vetracr

Not to hijack the spring thread but you can autoX a C4 without fuel starvation. Think like Smokey Yunick and read the SCCA SP rules

"Fuel lines and pumps are unrestricted except as specified herein as long as they do not pose a safety hazard. Fuel lines may be no larger than 1/2" i.d. and may only connect to the original fuel tank or allowed fuel cell. They may be no longer than necessary for reasonable and safe installation, and may serve no other purpose."

Larry

DALE C

How do you figure a "spring adjuster" changes the configuration? I take stock configuration to mean a transverse spring not a coil spring or coil over config. Does a higher spring rate (thicker spring) change the spring configuration? What about a monoleaf spring installed on an early C3?

I know that the ruling by the committee makes it gospel but I think that is as ridiculous as the situation on the C4 bushings which would not pass for the C4 guys who did not have an option in bushings but as soon as the rule was ammended to include C5s it passed.

I do not run a C4 so this does not directly effect me but there are some serious problems with the NCCC rule making procedure

RAFTeRACER

And I do drive a C-4 and it may or may not be black.