BrianCunningham

http://www.autoblog.com/2011/07/21/f...ntent=FaceBook

ALMS make them shutoff the engines during refueling.

I wonder for F1 engines will respond.

Zoxxo

Enough people in F1 (and out here) think this is an issue that needs more thought. Personally, I think it's lame. Are they going to install cow bells on the cars so that the folks in the pits know a car is coming? Maybe they can have a mechanism that sticks playing cards into the wheels for the pit lane

I'm sure Bernie will think it's a negative. "How am I going to sell $7000 per person Paddock Club tickets when the cars come by sounding like a sewing machine?"

I suspect that this rule will go away. It serves no purpose whatsoever and degrades the spectacle.

I *do* like the idea of (finally) having starters on board. Since they'll have all that KERS battery power available, why not?

Z//

rfn026

I heard the other day they won't actually be starters. When a car spins the computer will activate the clutch so the engine won't stall. It seems that Indy car might use the same system next year.

I would love to know more about this system.

Richard Newton

Jason

Another trial balloon

The Panther

Pointless

Zoxxo

That's a different thing. That's a stall prevention system which is optional. The only mention of this in the proposed regulations is that *if* the car has this, it has to automatically shut itself down after 10 seconds (a safety issue for track workers.)

Since it's not defined by the rules the teams will be free to implement their own designs (which means that you and I won't know how they actually work )

The starter rule says:

5.18 Starting the engine :
It must be possible for the driver to start the engine at any time when seated normally at the wheel and without any external assistance.

The pit lane rule says:

5.19 Electric mode :
The car must be run in electric mode (no ignition and no fuel supply to the engine) at all times when being driven in the pit lane.


You can read the actual regulations at the FIA website:

http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/A0425C3A0A7D69C0C12578D3002EBECA/$FILE/2014_F1_TECHNICAL_REGULATIONS_-_Published_on_20.07.pdf

It's a 3 megabyte PDF. Interesting reading!

Z//

RC000E

I think I'm gonna roll in here and oppose the crowd on this and say that I like this idea. F1 is a platform that I love to watch because of the ingenuity and constant high end technological developments. I think this will be yet another step that will work it's way into higher performance hybrid vehicles in the years to come. I have always like electric propulsion and just like to see it included in some part of the race solely.

Who cares....I like it. Only issue is like someone pointed out....noise is a great warning a car is approaching. Electric cow bells it is!

Jason

If you want to see electric technology advanced, don't MAKE them use it in a limited way, simply LET them use it any way they want.

Zoxxo

That really means "making them" regardless since if any one team did it, the others would have to in order to compete. It would mean an instant arms race that only a select few of the teams could afford to pursue. There's big money involved in developing these things. Remember that while "the world" might gain from the development of these technologies, the teams wouldn't really, unless they spawned secondary companies to develop the stuff independently for use outside of F1 (like Williams has done with its flywheel KERS system that Porsche is playing with.) But *making* the teams have to spend many millions of dollars just in order to compete at all, isn't the way to go. Racing teams shouldn't be forced to be high-intensity Silicon Valley startup companies, as well.

The race series that have allowed "unlimited" tech development have always priced themselves out of existance (See Can-Am & GTP.) Even in F1 over the past 5 years, the world economy forced Honda, BMW, and Toyota out of F1 because they couldn't justify the cost - and F1 was/is already *hugely* restricted in order to contain costs. A "KERS/electric arms race" would be expensive to the point that only the auto manufacturers could afford it. And whether they would want to is a whole other thing.

It really would be fun to see unlimited F1 budgets and see where that went (an engineers dream,) but it's not going to happen. Ever. There would quickly be no F1.

Z//

Zoxxo

I have no problem with that idea but I think it ought to be meaningful. This "must be a golf cart when in the pit lane" thing is silly. We all know that the tech exists to power a car 300 feet down a driveway. The world has had that for a century, at least (!) Nothing new here. So what's the point? Is it to pretend that auto racing can be "green"? Kind of a sad and transparent pretense, I think.

They can do better than this. And should.

Z//

RC000E

Hahaha....yeah...I know what you guys are saying. I just think this may be what precedes using the system in a more meaningful way. Small steps is what this appears to be, even though most will perceive it to be a very large step.

The tech exists to do that all day long, but combining that technology with the current car may break barriers to eventually make all speeds below a certain level electric powered or something along those lines.

dfinke23

I don't mind if there is a purpose, but with the teams no longer refueling it just doesn't make sense.
Maybe I'm missing something...

Rednels

How lame will it be when they pull out of their pit stop with electric mode and they cant even spin the tires....

BrianCunningham

there's a pit speed limit anyways, so the engine's full potential can't be used anyways, but the fuel saved while in the pits can be used out on the track.

With a hybrid drivetrain you need to add the power of BOTH engines together. Electric makes best torque @ zero RPM, F1 engines are all about top end so they should compliment each other.

KERS takes energy the brakes just through away in the form of heat and transforms it into something they can use.

If they want to make it relevant, they should run pump gas

Zoxxo

It pretty much is. Like everything else in F1, it gets "optimized" but the rules regarding the fuel chemistry are very stringent and meant to keep the stuff "petrol" as the general public understands it. They used to use some scary stuff (they actually had to mess with it wearing hazmat suits!) but they decided that was over the top.

You can read the fuel specs in that same PDF I liked to above. Article 19.

Z//

rfn026

I don't know about all the Indy Car teams but the Ganassi and Andretti teams already have cars with electric motors. Both teams have built cars with electric motors to use for pit stop practice. If you're going to practice pit stops during the week you certainly don't want all the noise and fumes in the shop. Electric motors are the answer.

I'm not sure if NASCAR teams use electric motors for pit stop practice. I suspect they do.

Richard Newton
Race Cars 360

RC000E

Electric motors produce 100% torque the instant they turn so they can spin some tires easily. Since pit times are so critical, I can guarantee they'll have a motor that gets them moving quickly so they should have the torque to get them rollin nice. We'll see though I guess.

KrispyZ06

I bet this doesn't make it into the 2014 season.

As others have said it seems a little against the lure of F1.

As for the safety aspects of not being able to hear a car entering the pit lane, that is already addressed with the current sirens that sound as a warning of approaching cars.

My opinion on the whole engine regs is this: Put in inline fuel restriction in the fuel system. Let the teams do whatever they want with the set maximum fuel flow. We would then see teams employing hybrid systems, and any thing else they can think of to chase efficiency.

This could hopefully find its way to road cars.

BrianCunningham

would definitely be a lot easier to have a spec fuel pump

sperkins

I don't really care one way or the other, but the ability to refire the car while on track after a spin etc. is meaningful.