talon95

It's probably too early to ask, but has anyone put enough runs/laps on a set of A7's to find out if they're any more durable than the A6 like Hoosier claims???

If I don't get much response now I'll try to remember to bump this thread in a couple of months.

Grabbed_Crow_Mobe

heavychevy

When they say more durable does that mean grip lasts longer or the tire construction is better? I found the A6 very durable from construction already. If they mean grip lasts longer does that mean over the course of a session, better heat cycling or better in hotter temps?

I have no problem with the A6 but improvement is always welcome.

talon95

All good questions. I was assuming they meant longer life. Either wear and/or resistance to heat cycling. I mainly do autox and the #1 complaint I have is how fast they fall off in performance. Just curious if that has improved or not.

In full disclosure, I'm trying to decide what class I may run this year. Either choosing between street class (on 200TW tires) or going back to SSR if the A7 should happen to actually have better durability (resistance to heat cycling). Just weighing my options. I have several choices between the 2 classes and having a C5Z and C6Z.

froggy47

I have some coming any day now, but it'll be a while b4 I can post my impressions.

Been on a6 for a few years.

strano@stranoparts.com

I'll bite. I have not run A7's yet but will early in the year vs. A6's. I have them rims and the A6's, but not the A7's yet.

I expect better tread life because all of us would wear the centers out, and the new tread design won't have the issue with the buckling at the first groove the way it's designed.

As for the drop-off in performance. I've never had the issues that others claim. Sure I typically run newer tires at bigger events, but not all the time. Sometimes I'll run an older set at a Pro until the later sessions and more than once new tires didn't go faster. I've won more than a few National Tours with fronts that were road race take offs, or last year's Nationals set that I already had.

I can tell you this, SSR would love to have you back.

froggy47

My experience with a6's is also that I never had a big complaint with drop off in performance due to heat cycling. They definately drop off as the working layer of the tread gets thin.

strano@stranoparts.com

Yep, I agree. There is some drop off, but that's the case with any tire. Rubber gets harder with age/use, even street tires.

It really pissed a bunch of us off one day two years ago when a person so hell bent on being the fastest guy at a local event actually bolted on sticker A6's for the second session of a day, late in the year. Mind you it was this guy who got himself on the Solo Events Board and wanted street tires rammed through because Hoosier's cost so much... meanwhile he's bolting on stickers for a local event at the end of the year.

I and another guy were there running on older tires, and didn't change. All 3 of us went about .5 faster in the afternoon. Mr. Sticker tires said that proved his point, he put on fresh tires and went faster. Didn't even register that Dan and I also went the same amount faster too. It's clear to me the course cleaned up, but sometimes people see what they want to see.

froggy47

That is very "funny" as I got beat out this year for the region jacket by a (friend) competitor who showed up next to last event on new a6's (I didn't get a friendly heads up). I was on the same tires as all year. We were dead even going into the last two events. I had figured we would have great fun going right down to the last run of the last champ event.

fatbillybob

Conspiracy theorist here:

I ran the A7's in a race at the Runoffs in October 2014. They look mildly different in the tread. They have somewhat less groves. They feel exactly like A6's. There was no difference that I could tell in any way but I was racing and it was my 1st time on them. I guess the marketing guys at Hoosier need to find a way to justify the higher price!

cwikstro

I bought these as scrubs and am interested to see how I like them when NW racing starts in May. Oh yeah from fatbillybob!

redtopz

The compound is the same as A6, but the construction is different/better. So yeah, not a huge difference but an improvement. In my 45 minute nasa national championship race I ran 1 heat cycle A7's in back that I had already raced on once and sticker A6's in front. This was because Hoosier was in a transition period going from A6 to A7. I chose to run scrub A7's in back over sticker A6's and if I had to go back I would make the same choice.

froggy47

The set I ordered was about the same price IIRC maybe a few bucks different. I heard they are square shoulder and 2-3 mm wider at the tread due to this.

Grabbed_Crow_Mobe

Where are you guys getting your A7s? I noticed that tire rack doesn't have the 315/30/18. Any suggestions?

talon95

My experience with the A6 is that performance fall off is very dependent on how they're used. Some of which is under your control, some isn't. Storing them properly, not overheating them, etc... helps a lot. OTOH, the ambient temps you run them in is also a factor.

All of these different factors I think contribute to the somewhat varied opinions on how well they hold up to heat cycles. I've had sets that fell off a lot more than others, usually when I've run them in the hot summer months here in KS.

Because of this, I never feel like spending $$$$ on travel, etc... to go to bigger events on older tires which necessitates buying fresh sets. OTOH, buying fresh tires for local events is just silly IMO.

Unfortunately it doesn't sound like the tire has changed much.

fatbillybob

LOL! I hope you are right. I paid the "new" hot tire "AT" the Runoffs price! I drained the bank account that week anyway what's another set of tires? A6/A7 it isn't going to matter because I'm sure soon enough A7 is all you are going to be able to buy. I'm just really glad Hoosier did not make the tire worse like they did with those terrible Aso4's. Man those things stunk.

talon95

With the sizes I compared, the price only went up $1 which is negligible obviously. Hoosier hasn't raised prices significantly for at least a couple of years.

strano@stranoparts.com

I don't store mine "properly" unless you consider an unheated building in PA winters proper. And I run them plenty hot. 100 degree days aren't unheard of, on really dark black asphalt which is often 130+ on a pyro, with 2 drivers. And DC region, we basically end up hot lapping 2 drivers it's rare the full 5 minutes is used between runs.

Look I'm not saying that it's unwise to be on the best tires you can be for National events. I am saying that unless you are on junk the difference is within noise. And frankly I wear them out before I heat cycle them out and they just get hard.

froggy47

You need to go to an official regional distributor, there is a list on the Hoosier site.

theseal

the last time i really ran seriously was on A4's. So thats a bit obsolete. But the people who really thought they were contenders had gentlemen's agreements on fresh tires or no for the next pro, and everyone ran new at nationals.

i farted around in ASP in 2013 a little, and my experience was about the same for autocross. sticker tires are consistently .2 on an autocross ahead of 3 run tires with a 24 hour busted cherry.

3 run tires with a 24 hour busted cherry are about .3 ahead of last weeks tires, which are .5 ahead of last months tires. which are 2 seconds ahead of last years tires. which are 3 seconds faster than 2 year old tires.

Not an exaggeration. last years tires were so bad that they were not even useful for practice or testing. literally.

however, on track or when really hot out, the differences are much less significant.

Now, if you run warm but not baking hot weather, and store properly, i expect your experience to differ quite a bit. not disputing sam's results, but just reporting what i see in texas in asp.

also, on track, you could get heat in the tires and the differences were much less significant.

i think the other top drivers in this area would agree.

people are not winning classes by bolting on a new set of stickers each day or even each run because they are stupid.

i personally resolved that i was not going to spend any more money on hoosiers, even though i was winning 2-4 tires every main event.

if the A7 is the same compound, i expect the same results.