klodkrawler05

Hi guys,

My bone stock (besides headers) LS6 suffered a spun bearing several weeks ago, I have managed to track down a crate LS3 at a price I couldn't say no to.

I've heard all the horror stories about LS3's not holding up on the track without a dry sump and am well aware of what I'm getting into from that standpoint.

The motor WILL be getting a dry sump over the winter however there are 2 more Optima USCA events this year that I want to attend and a dry sump system isn't in the cards for me in such short notice financially. I'm looking to make the LS3 as reliable as I possibly can to get through the next 2 events.

I've purchased a Setrab oil cooler as well as a Radium 1qt catch can.

Now my question centers around the valley cover, my car is a 2002 which I believe is the old style LS6 cover? should I stick with the LS3 valley cover/PCV system or should I use my LS6 one?

the second question with regards to the oil pan, I am running long tube headers and from my mockup they don't seem to have any issue clearing with the LS3 engine and LS6 batwing pan, I believe from my mixed findings that the LS6 pan would be the preferred oil pan is that a true statement?

Thank you in advance for any advice!

Z06TWT

I am in the same boat....just grenaded my second LS6 motor on track, so the shop is putting in a modified crate LS3. To deal with oiling issues they are installing a EGM-464 Improved Racing Complete baffled oil pan. If you read through the data on their website it looks like a real improvement over stock...GLWTB

klodkrawler05

Great info!

Are you going to be data logging oil pressures at all? I'm going to run the stock batwing pan at least the first event so I'd be curious to compare!

ErnieN85

this is a old problem the oil starvation occurs in long Hgee left sweepers
anything over 10 seconds around 1.5 gs and the oil pools in the heads.
The pan goes empty and BANG its over
the Bat wing and or baffeled pans help but will not fix it
so the cure is either go slow in long lefts or Dry sump with at least 10 qts
( the early Z06 sumps were not big enough)

klodkrawler05

10 seconds at 1.5 g's seems relatively high, I know I'm able to sustain over 1 G on 200tw street tires but don't know that I can sustain 1.5 for that length of time at any of the local tracks. Hopefully I'll be ok this year until dry sump over the winter!

Thanks for the input!

jtmck

In my opinion, that is what happened to you from turn 7 thru turn 10a at Gingerman. The oil sloshed out of the pan for maybe 6 to 8 seconds.

I would suggest an accusump before you run this motor. If you run an air override, you will have as much oil as a dry sump.

Just my thoughts.

klodkrawler05

Jim thats my plan I need to give you a call today to get a few more details from you on the setup you're running.

SouthernSon

Jim, by air override do you mean eliminate pressure switch of accusump and use a manual cable to open and close? That is the setup I have so that the oil is always open to the pressurized accusump while running.

96CollectorSport

Defiantly look into the Improved racing solution, it does two things it has a crank scrapper so excess oil isn't getting flung upwards towards the RH cylinder head and it has a trap door baffle that keeps oil around the sump.
You would have to run the C6 oil pan (they don't have a set-up for the C5 batwing pan). I think the scrapper and baffled pan are about the best insurance you're going to get south of a dry-sump. You can get the whole set-up for around $650. At the very least give them a call and talk it over with them.

jtmck

Yes, I have the manual control.
But, the air override is a separate can to hold the air.
Approximately 3 to 4 quart separate container with an air line teed into the air fitting on the accusump.
You will have 30/35# air pressure with a full 3 quarts of oil in the accusump. When it is released, all three quarts will go to the engine and you will still have 20/24# of air in the air container.

I have 9.5 quarts in my wet sump system. Anything below 30# oil pressure and oil starts to go to the motor. Should oil pressure drop to 20/25 all three quarts will be in the engine. If that does not save the engine, I have something else wrong.

SouthernSon

You will have to show me the plumbing on that the next time we get together. I am simply running 30# in the 3 quart accusump. It has been okay so far but no doubt you can help me improve it.

edge04

any chance you have a diagram of this set up? thanks

strano@stranoparts.com

I carry Accusump stuff if that's a way you are leaning. But again, I'd warn you to run better oil no matter what you do. I think that's the main issue, seen it time and again. Listened to an LS6 spin bearings while idling in grid once... that wasn't a starvation issue.

Dan H.

What engines is this a problem with? Is it all LS motors? I have a stock LS6 and run 200TW tires. I'm guessing I don't hit the lateral G level yet that is the danger zone, but over time I probably will. My modifications are all around safety, handling, and cooling and I'm wondering if this is something I need to add to the list?

strano@stranoparts.com

Brad has an LS6 on 200TW tires and *bang*.

klodkrawler05

Yup, amsoil from here on out for me. once the funds recover from getting this motor in I'll give you a call about the accusump stuff


yup, and a relatively stock setup at that, still stock leaf springs and mostly 275/35/18 re71's

The motor blew up the very first track session running a mixed bag of 275 re71s and 18x12 335/30/18 Rival S tires.

Ramo7769

Define better oil. With my LS1 C5, I run a cooler and Mobil 1 5w-30 for example. Seems to stay under 250F throughout a track session.

I think those cheater tires would have a different treadwear rating if 200 wasn't required for so many different competition classes...

JeremyGSU

Interesting. I think this is more track dependent than anything else or the car had issues prior. I can't imagine it should have grenaded on street tires.

Were you running the 7.5 quarts of oil in the system or 6.5?

I've done about 24 track days in my '04 Z running all at the advanced level. Half on R-comps and the last half on slicks. From Sebring, VIR, to Road Atlanta.

Car is still running strong no issues.

edge04

so you run 1 qt extra> I've been running .5 qt extra in my C6

klodkrawler05

Thats what both I and the previous owner have used the cars entire life. my oil temps even with the vented hood have gotten closer to 280 during a timed session though.

Stories like this are the reason I'd never cracked open my motor to build it for more power, stock LS6's are supposed to be bullet proof.

I was running 7.5 quarts of 5w30 as I always do at the track. Car and its motor only had 32k total miles, compression and leakdown tests at the start of every season always showed well within spec and it was running strong all the way up until "low oil pressure" flashed across my dash.

Have you done any datalogging or timing for your sessions? curious what sort of peak/sustained G forces you are seeing in comparison to what my car is seeing, I can't believe on street tires I'm exceeding what you're able to generate.

After doing more research on oil's and lots of reading at bobistheoilguy.com I think a large portion of my issue was A) the oil and B) the temperatures the oil reached, at tracks like MIS the car would hit closer to 290-300 degrees just doing 1 warm up lap 2 timed laps and 1 cool down lap.

The plan moving forward with the LS3 is to use the batwing pan/oiling system like the LS6, and the LS3 valley cover/pcv with a Radium Engineering catch can. I'll be upgrading to an accusump or dry sump oiling after this season when the funds free up.