apex26

I just became aware of a potential disaster for those of us who tow in the Northeast. A guy on another forum towing a race car in an enclosed trailer got stopped by the NYS troopers. They were stopping everyone towing and harassing the heck out of them. His truck, even though rated to haul 10,000 lbs, was not REGISTERED to haul that. They forced him to open his trailer, searched it, and inspected his racecar for commercial signage. They found stickers on the car, and deemed his rig "commercial". This led to checking bearings, tire pressures, checking if he was hauling gas across state lines--(illegal!), and demanded his log book--which of course he did not have. He was forced to park the trailer for 10 hours at a rest stop, and come back to retrieve it. The fines are typically THOUSANDS because the registered capacity of the truck is below the towing capacity, making the entire rig severely overweight. NY, Pa, and NJ, all big spending bankrupt states, are in on this gotcha shakedown. In my case, I bought a certified Tundra from a dealer, and they "did everything" for me, but technically it's not registered properly, even though I specifically told the guy what I was towing and how heavy it is. Crap, the truck is 5490, the trailer is about 2,900 and the car is about 3,100, so way over the magic 10,000lbs that triggers a disaster in NY. Maybe someone could chime in and add info about what triggers a disaster in NJ and Pa, so innocent people don't get whacked with massive fines. BYW, in **** NY, gas has to be in a red container or it's another fine, and diesel a yellow, but you are only allowed I think ONE 5 gallon jug, purchased IN NY, and can't cross state lines with it.

froggy47

Guess they have rounded up all the illegals & terrorists, so have nothing better to do.

phxcobra

Glad I lI've in az

Olitho

Actually I hear AZ is really bad for this, too. That is why I removed all the graphics from my enclosed race trailer.

duramaxsky

If you crossed a state line, And are not commercial under federal law, You only need to be legal in the state you are licensed in. And you are not commercial under federal law. In WA the private trailer is licensed for weight or as an RV. The truck weight only needs to cover the truck and it's contents. My tuck is at 10,000 and my flat bed is at 18,000 pounds. 3 6,000 pound axels so I licensed it for that. That would be commercial under some circumstances because it is licensed for over 26,000 gross and the trailer is licensed over 10,000. But as long as it is not used by a company it is still not commercial. No DOT number is needed or log book. If it was over sized or had more than 1 trailer then those are some cases where private use would trigger that. For example I thought about getting a fifth wheel and pulling a car trailer behind it. I have a CDL with a double triples endorsement. But it would require a DOT number. And all commercial laws followed. And commercial insurance. And the truck licensed for enough weight plus the trailers licensed as combination units. Way too much money for a few times a year. But when I retire I am planning to do it to travel the country and take my Vette with me. Still cheaper than a large motorhome.

duramaxsky

Why are graphics a problem. If you own everything and are not a business it is still private. States may have their own vehicle laws but they may be no more onerous than the DOT laws. The feds have taken over all that with the DOT FHSA laws. Including cars. When it comes to what is commercial the Feds have spelled that out. So states can not go any further. That's why a fifth wheel can have another trailer behind it anywhere in the US. As long as you have a DOT number and follow the DOT laws. Including log books and drug testing. Have the correct insurance. And the trailers are not over 61' in length combined. Even if private.

Olitho

It has not happened to me personally, but from what I have been told and read it goes something like this.

You roll into AZ from CA hauling your race trailer. You have some Hoosier stickers, et al on the trailer. Two miles into AZ the highway patrol pulls you over for not stopping at their weigh station/commercial truck inspection site. They ask for your commercial license and you say "I don't have one." I am a private driver. They ask about the stickers on the trailer and ask what is inside. A race car is the answer. They ask do you get prize money, do you get contingencies, etc. If the answer is yes, then they say the rig is a commercial vehicle and it is not going anywhere until you get commercial insurance and a licensed commercial driver.

PSU_Vette

I cannot speak to a lot of the issues that the individual ran into, but I know from experience, that PA is restrictive with towing weight. When the truck is registered with the state, you basically choose a "towing capacity." For example I have a GMC Sierra that is registered as a "Class 3" which allows a GVW of up to 9,000lbs. The truck qualifies for Class 4A and 4B, which would allow 10,000 and 11,000lbs respectively. Therefore, if I'm pulling a heavy camper or my car with extra weight, I may go over the truck's registered limit and would be liable for a fine. I personally don't tow enough to require the higher registration. As for the gas container, stickers, etc I have no idea...

C5 Hardtop

Dayum That just fvcked up. They might as well stake out people in the bar and nab them for a DUI after they leave.

Ace Hardware had a 5 gallon yellow diesel container for $19 and a 2 gallon red gas container for $17. Instead of buying two 2 gal containers to put my gasoline in, I bought the 5 gallon yellow diesel can and put gas in it. That decision may cost me down the road. I didn't realize this is a legal issue.

As an aside, Ace Hardware also had a cooler packed with microbrew and commercial beer plus wine and booze

phxcobra

Good to know, though I haven't started towing anything yet. At least I can own and carry a firearm out here. Try that in the NE.

PSU_Vette

PA is actually very lax in regards to firearms laws. You'd be quite surprised. I bet it's on par with AZ, with the exception of open carry, which looks ridiculous to begin with.

Solofast

First make sure they stop you for a reason. Suspicion of being a commercial trailer is not a reason to make a stop if the trailer has no stickers on it. If they ask what you're hauling tell them it's your car. If they ask what kind of car tell them it's an autocross car you know the kind that you use to run around parking lots on pylon courses.

If they ask if this is being used for commercial purposes tell them no it is not. If they ask about any stickers on the car tell them that those are sponsors for the series and that there is no prize money or contingency money available in the series you race in. Tell them that you are required to run the stickers to run in the series, but that there is no payout directly to you ever, and there are not contingency prizes for running the stickers.

Then they have to rule you as non-commercial. If they ask what series you run just tell them it's a local autocross and this is all done purely for beer mugs and pleasure. So long as you are non-commercial and you are within your weight limits there is nothing they can do.

This is like a test where you have to know the magic words to get off. Say the magic words and they can't do anything. Don't open your mouth and say anything unless it is a question and don't let them even start to think that they can call your rig a commercial rig because it isn't. Know what they are trying to get you to say and make sure you don't say it and you can most likely skate. Say the wrong words and they'll screw you every time.

fatbillybob

Maybe the best ploy is to be legal. Hire the commercial driver who has commercial insurance and keep all documents of my new legal commercial branding. Then my other business can sponsor this real commercial race business declared by the State and the race business doesn't have to make any taxable income for several years before deemed a hobby by the IRS. Then armed with an IRS determination letter that "Oily Oli Racing" is a non-commercial hobby I can tell any state trouper to go pound sand. I think one would come out ahead on that deal.

apex26

No magic words work here with these brownshirts. I had a local cop brag to me that he can stop any vehicle any time. He just says your left brake light is out. If it isn't when you check, he says you have an intermittent problem, better get it looked at. As for the commercial issue, the whole point is that THEY DECLARE your rig commercial by virtue of ANY advertisement, even in an enclosed trailer. If you tell a cop any lie, it's a misdemeanor. If they ask where the autocross is, and it's a track event instead, or worse there is no event, you risk a criminal record, and the heightened suspicion will make for a very bad day. And of course you go into a massive data base that records stops, even if no ticket was issued. Most of the problems seem from people innocently not properly registering their vehicle for enough weight. But, a couple years ago State Police were ticketing every pickup with a hitch mounted in a receiver, which sticks out farther than the bumper. My son moved to Texas for obvious reasons, and I have to tow his open rig down half way and meet him, but with the truck bed full of heavy stuff, painters tape is going over every decal on his car.

Dennisscars

Some states require a B non commercial for trailers over 10,000 gvwr no matter what's inside or outside. Most times the don't mess with grandpa and their big ole 5th wheel, but they can.

Oh wait until we get into overall length which is easier for them to relieve their boredom.

Most states are 65' combined. My rig is 40+25. When we went cross country to Watkins Glen I was totally paranoid about IL. They are 60' and lots of stories of them pulling RV'rs over and having to have a "convenient" tow truck tow your trailer to the state line.

oh1vette

#racecartrailersmatter

rustyguns

remove and replace all the capacity stickers with ones that make you legal lol

rustyguns

read the e NAFTA treaty agreement in regards to DOT registration. you will be pleasantly surprised.

C5 Hardtop

I'm curious about this. Where in the NAFTA are you referring to?

Bill Dearborn

Tow with a SUV not a truck. When I moved into NC friends asked me why my Tahoe didn't have a weighted license plate on it since I towed a 7K lb trailer. After some research I found that SUVs didn't need them even though they were towing heavy trailers. If I had been registering a 1500 Silverado short bed (basically the same towing capability of the Tahoe) I would have had to have had a weighted tag and declared what weights I would be carrying and towing. Not sure at what weight I would run into trouble with the Tahoe but I doubt the Tahoe could tow that heavy of a trailer very far.

Bill