HPDE Tires
01-12-2017, 04:13 PM
#21
My progression has been from the Bridgestones to Toyo R888s in 275/17, 305/18 (pretty good hpde tire) to Nito NT01 in the same sizes (slightly better than the R888 in my opine) to Hoosier R7 scrubs in 295/18 square, this is pretty hard to beat for HPDE only purposes. Again, simply my experience with a mostly stock C5 Z06 over the last 4 years.
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BigMonkey73 (01-12-2017)
01-12-2017, 04:32 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
Member Since: Oct 2013
Location: Dallas TX
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St. Jude Donor '15
I'm moved up a couple of notches since 2 years ago, so I may try these again. Don't think I could go wrong with either...but the Bridgies do have a 200TW rating vs 300TW of the MPSS.
On the other hand, the MPSS seem to be lower priced now that they're on the way out. TireRack has them for under $1k which is the first time I've seen them at that price I think. Same price as the RE-11's. Hmmmm....
Last edited by BigMonkey73; 01-12-2017 at 04:33 PM.
01-12-2017, 05:25 PM
#23
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
My progression has been from the Bridgestones to Toyo R888s in 275/17, 305/18 (pretty good hpde tire) to Nito NT01 in the same sizes (slightly better than the R888 in my opine) to Hoosier R7 scrubs in 295/18 square, this is pretty hard to beat for HPDE only purposes. Again, simply my experience with a mostly stock C5 Z06 over the last 4 years.
So, I picked up a new BRZ in 2013 and rode with every instructor I could at a variety of tracks...and am now faster than my friends who have been doing HPDE's for the past 10 years or so. Slow cars are an excellent way to learn.
I went through multiple sets of RE-11's on that car, which were extremely consistent to a couple sets of RE-71R's that were faster for a few laps, but quickly fell off pace and then wore down extremely fast. 
01-12-2017, 06:17 PM
#24
Pro
I have personal experience with both RS3s and Pilot Super Sports. The Hankooks are faster but much more inconsistent and can't handle a lot of heat well. OTOH, the Michelins last and last . Like any tire though they need some neg camber to prevent chunking etc.
01-12-2017, 08:29 PM
#25
Burning Brakes
I'm stuck deciding between hankook rs4 (release date 3/17/17 per tire rack) or going r comp for the first time on the R888R for this year on my stock c5z wheels. I am planing on 4-5 track days this season and a bunch of local auto x events. Trying to find a tire to fit the bill for track and autox . Never drove r comps so I'm a little intimidated. should I be? The new r888r's are supposed to come up to temp faster then the old r888's making them a better possible autox candidate. I'm leaving my ccw's with nt05's for street duty. Any insight?
01-13-2017, 10:20 AM
#26
I'm stuck deciding between hankook rs4 (release date 3/17/17 per tire rack) or going r comp for the first time on the R888R for this year on my stock c5z wheels. I am planing on 4-5 track days this season and a bunch of local auto x events. Trying to find a tire to fit the bill for track and autox . Never drove r comps so I'm a little intimidated. should I be? The new r888r's are supposed to come up to temp faster then the old r888's making them a better possible autox candidate. I'm leaving my ccw's with nt05's for street duty. Any insight?
01-14-2017, 04:09 PM
#27
Pro
The NT01 (which I much prefer to the 888) is an easy tire to drive and not intimidating in the least. OTOH, it is not good in the wet.
Certainly the NT01 is more stable when hot than any street tire although compared to some of the new "street" tires, it is only minimally faster if at all.
Hoosier R7s OTOH are more difficult to drive and can be very intimidating so when your say R comp, it really depends on which ones.
Certainly the NT01 is more stable when hot than any street tire although compared to some of the new "street" tires, it is only minimally faster if at all.
Hoosier R7s OTOH are more difficult to drive and can be very intimidating so when your say R comp, it really depends on which ones.
01-15-2017, 07:05 AM
#29
I have been frequently tracking my '03 Z06; about a dozen track days a year.
The best advice I can give you is to buy some Federal RS-R's. You can buy them on eBay (4 285/18s) for $540. That's about a third of the price of Hoosier R7's. (I would also recommend junking your front wheels and buying two extra 18'' wheels so you can rotate tires easily.)
These tires are not very sticky, but they won't chunk. They are a great tire to get seat time in. I've gone through, like, I don't know how many of them.
I have run Hoosiers on my car as well. The difference is pretty big, of course, but if you're just trying to get seat time and learn your car, it would be a waste to run expensive tires. Also, I wouldn't buy any lesser tire than a Hoosier if you are trying to achieve a great track time. The other tires aren't that much cheaper.
Remember, it's all about seat time. Minimize your costs in order to get as much experience as possible. You will find that even with the Federals on your car, you can beat just about anyone at your typical track day if you are the better driver.
The best advice I can give you is to buy some Federal RS-R's. You can buy them on eBay (4 285/18s) for $540. That's about a third of the price of Hoosier R7's. (I would also recommend junking your front wheels and buying two extra 18'' wheels so you can rotate tires easily.)
These tires are not very sticky, but they won't chunk. They are a great tire to get seat time in. I've gone through, like, I don't know how many of them.
I have run Hoosiers on my car as well. The difference is pretty big, of course, but if you're just trying to get seat time and learn your car, it would be a waste to run expensive tires. Also, I wouldn't buy any lesser tire than a Hoosier if you are trying to achieve a great track time. The other tires aren't that much cheaper.
Remember, it's all about seat time. Minimize your costs in order to get as much experience as possible. You will find that even with the Federals on your car, you can beat just about anyone at your typical track day if you are the better driver.
01-15-2017, 10:04 AM
#30
Drifting
I have been frequently tracking my '03 Z06; about a dozen track days a year.
The best advice I can give you is to buy some Federal RS-R's. You can buy them on eBay (4 285/18s) for $540. That's about a third of the price of Hoosier R7's. (I would also recommend junking your front wheels and buying two extra 18'' wheels so you can rotate tires easily.)
These tires are not very sticky, but they won't chunk. They are a great tire to get seat time in. I've gone through, like, I don't know how many of them.
I have run Hoosiers on my car as well. The difference is pretty big, of course, but if you're just trying to get seat time and learn your car, it would be a waste to run expensive tires. Also, I wouldn't buy any lesser tire than a Hoosier if you are trying to achieve a great track time. The other tires aren't that much cheaper.
Remember, it's all about seat time. Minimize your costs in order to get as much experience as possible. You will find that even with the Federals on your car, you can beat just about anyone at your typical track day if you are the better driver.
The best advice I can give you is to buy some Federal RS-R's. You can buy them on eBay (4 285/18s) for $540. That's about a third of the price of Hoosier R7's. (I would also recommend junking your front wheels and buying two extra 18'' wheels so you can rotate tires easily.)
These tires are not very sticky, but they won't chunk. They are a great tire to get seat time in. I've gone through, like, I don't know how many of them.
I have run Hoosiers on my car as well. The difference is pretty big, of course, but if you're just trying to get seat time and learn your car, it would be a waste to run expensive tires. Also, I wouldn't buy any lesser tire than a Hoosier if you are trying to achieve a great track time. The other tires aren't that much cheaper.
Remember, it's all about seat time. Minimize your costs in order to get as much experience as possible. You will find that even with the Federals on your car, you can beat just about anyone at your typical track day if you are the better driver.
01-15-2017, 11:53 AM
#31
Racer
I have been frequently tracking my '03 Z06; about a dozen track days a year.
The best advice I can give you is to buy some Federal RS-R's. You can buy them on eBay (4 285/18s) for $540. That's about a third of the price of Hoosier R7's. (I would also recommend junking your front wheels and buying two extra 18'' wheels so you can rotate tires easily.)
These tires are not very sticky, but they won't chunk. They are a great tire to get seat time in. I've gone through, like, I don't know how many of them.
I have run Hoosiers on my car as well. The difference is pretty big, of course, but if you're just trying to get seat time and learn your car, it would be a waste to run expensive tires. Also, I wouldn't buy any lesser tire than a Hoosier if you are trying to achieve a great track time. The other tires aren't that much cheaper.
Remember, it's all about seat time. Minimize your costs in order to get as much experience as possible. You will find that even with the Federals on your car, you can beat just about anyone at your typical track day if you are the better driver.
The best advice I can give you is to buy some Federal RS-R's. You can buy them on eBay (4 285/18s) for $540. That's about a third of the price of Hoosier R7's. (I would also recommend junking your front wheels and buying two extra 18'' wheels so you can rotate tires easily.)
These tires are not very sticky, but they won't chunk. They are a great tire to get seat time in. I've gone through, like, I don't know how many of them.
I have run Hoosiers on my car as well. The difference is pretty big, of course, but if you're just trying to get seat time and learn your car, it would be a waste to run expensive tires. Also, I wouldn't buy any lesser tire than a Hoosier if you are trying to achieve a great track time. The other tires aren't that much cheaper.
Remember, it's all about seat time. Minimize your costs in order to get as much experience as possible. You will find that even with the Federals on your car, you can beat just about anyone at your typical track day if you are the better driver.
1) Adding more grip in front with about the same grip as stock in the rear may make for a rear-happy car. For a 2 or 3 event /year guy like me, under steer is a bit safer and more manageable than oversteer. Of course I'm looking for a neutral setup. I'm not sure which way is easier to dial into Neutral with adjustable sway bar in the rear and coilovers. Dial out oversteer or dial out understeer?
Second, my understanding is that the stability control system is looking for a slight differential between the front and rear rotation given the 17" vs 18" wheel setup that comes from the factory. Some have had issues with the stability control "freaking out" in a square setup. I will not turn my stability control completely off so i need it functional. I don't want to spend all the $$'s for (2) 18" rims and tires and then have the Stability control system say "no way"
That is why I am leaning toward just keeping the stock wheel set up.
All please lend your personal experience in these areas.
aaronc7, I don't know what Vette your driving, your handle indicated a C7. for a C5Z (like I run) 285's all round is more tire in the front than stock and less tire than stock in the rear. For a high power rear wheel drive car, that sounds like a recipe for snap oversteer??? What is your experience, is your setup biased toward oversteer or understeer? Or is it the perfect balance, NEUTRAL?
01-15-2017, 12:32 PM
#32
I have never used stability control on my car, and I also have never spun my car (except on skid pads). I realize that that doesn't mean much since many drivers of big-horsepower cars like Corvettes don't drive at the limit...but believe me, I drive my car to it's full potential.
It sounds like I'm bragging and I wish I could say that I was and that I had incredible car control skills, but the truth is that the Corvette engineers have sprinkled some kind of magic dust on the C5Z and made it into just an incredibly forgiving car.
The funny thing about the C5Z is that when you first drive it, you notice that it oversteers quite a bit, and you think, "Ok, this car doesn't suffer fools, and so I'm gonna have to be careful." However, the more you drive it, the more you realize that it's like a big friendly bear.
It sounds like I'm bragging and I wish I could say that I was and that I had incredible car control skills, but the truth is that the Corvette engineers have sprinkled some kind of magic dust on the C5Z and made it into just an incredibly forgiving car.
The funny thing about the C5Z is that when you first drive it, you notice that it oversteers quite a bit, and you think, "Ok, this car doesn't suffer fools, and so I'm gonna have to be careful." However, the more you drive it, the more you realize that it's like a big friendly bear.
01-15-2017, 01:25 PM
#33
Racer
I have never used stability control on my car, and I also have never spun my car (except on skid pads). I realize that that doesn't mean much since many drivers of big-horsepower cars like Corvettes don't drive at the limit...but believe me, I drive my car to it's full potential.
It sounds like I'm bragging and I wish I could say that I was and that I had incredible car control skills, but the truth is that the Corvette engineers have sprinkled some kind of magic dust on the C5Z and made it into just an incredibly forgiving car.
The funny thing about the C5Z is that when you first drive it, you notice that it oversteers quite a bit, and you think, "Ok, this car doesn't suffer fools, and so I'm gonna have to be careful." However, the more you drive it, the more you realize that it's like a big friendly bear.
It sounds like I'm bragging and I wish I could say that I was and that I had incredible car control skills, but the truth is that the Corvette engineers have sprinkled some kind of magic dust on the C5Z and made it into just an incredibly forgiving car.
The funny thing about the C5Z is that when you first drive it, you notice that it oversteers quite a bit, and you think, "Ok, this car doesn't suffer fools, and so I'm gonna have to be careful." However, the more you drive it, the more you realize that it's like a big friendly bear.
I've had a Boss 302, STi and a Z4M, all had some sort of Competitive Mode for track use and I have always felt it enhanced my driving experience. Maybe its just all in my head.
Last edited by Bossdog; 01-15-2017 at 01:29 PM.
01-15-2017, 01:25 PM
#34
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
I have never used stability control on my car, and I also have never spun my car (except on skid pads). I realize that that doesn't mean much since many drivers of big-horsepower cars like Corvettes don't drive at the limit...but believe me, I drive my car to it's full potential.
It sounds like I'm bragging and I wish I could say that I was and that I had incredible car control skills, but the truth is that the Corvette engineers have sprinkled some kind of magic dust on the C5Z and made it into just an incredibly forgiving car.
The funny thing about the C5Z is that when you first drive it, you notice that it oversteers quite a bit, and you think, "Ok, this car doesn't suffer fools, and so I'm gonna have to be careful." However, the more you drive it, the more you realize that it's like a big friendly bear.
It sounds like I'm bragging and I wish I could say that I was and that I had incredible car control skills, but the truth is that the Corvette engineers have sprinkled some kind of magic dust on the C5Z and made it into just an incredibly forgiving car.
The funny thing about the C5Z is that when you first drive it, you notice that it oversteers quite a bit, and you think, "Ok, this car doesn't suffer fools, and so I'm gonna have to be careful." However, the more you drive it, the more you realize that it's like a big friendly bear.
I would think it would hard to have the "competitive mode" slow your lap times because if it is intervening, your way out of shape anyway and operating in a less than optimal lap time mode? Just curious?
Last edited by Quickshift_C5; 01-15-2017 at 01:28 PM.
01-15-2017, 02:11 PM
#35
Burning Brakes
once you exceed beginner speed I have found using competition mode will quickly ruin the rear brake pads. I found out the hard way the first time I tracked my car.
01-15-2017, 02:13 PM
#36
Racer
My stability control hasn't even worked in the past 3 years, I have the steering wheel position sensor disconnected. I've had no issues at 638rwhp also driving pretty hard. Street, drag, 1/2 mile, autocross, and track days...never a single issue.
It's being used as a crutch. It's not necessary. If you're relying on the computer to save you, you're learning the wrong way in the first place and should slow down.
It's being used as a crutch. It's not necessary. If you're relying on the computer to save you, you're learning the wrong way in the first place and should slow down.
That mentality is like insisting a hack golfer use Blade golf clubs. Sure , an excellent golfer can really work the ball with blades but a hack golfer can't hit them for $hit. So why shouldn't I use the big fat cavity back with tons of forgiveness, improve my scores and enhance my enjoyment? Because not hitting pure Blades will hamper my efforts to be the best possible golfer I can be??? I don't have the time, skill or desire to practice hitting blades until I'm good at it. And Driving a car fast is much more consequential than hitting golf *****. (and more fun too!)
last, I just spent 2K completely revamping my stability control, repaired the ECBM and replaced the BPMV with a new one. You can bet your $ss I'm going to use it! Plus I drive the car on the road, I try to avoid rain but sometimes I get caught. I want my Active handling system to be functional.
I get it, Some guys what to improve their skills and the best way to do that is turn off the nannies. This is perfectly fine! I too continue to improve my skills with instruction and practice, but a low level Nanny is what is best for me.
Last edited by Bossdog; 01-15-2017 at 02:16 PM.
01-15-2017, 03:07 PM
#37
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
I get it, Some guys what to improve their skills and the best way to do that is turn off the nannies. This is perfectly fine! I too continue to improve my skills with instruction and practice, but a low level Nanny is what is best for me.
Do whatever you're comfortable with. My only point was that a lot of people never turn the things off and think they are getting faster and faster...when the nannies are actually doing all the work. That's when people should slow down and take some instruction on their driving technique/habits. Not to mention the extra work it causes for the brakes as the above guy mentioned.
Last edited by Quickshift_C5; 01-15-2017 at 03:17 PM.
01-15-2017, 10:22 PM
#38
Drifting
My main concern running a 18" square setup (305's all round) is 2 fold:
1) Adding more grip in front with about the same grip as stock in the rear may make for a rear-happy car. For a 2 or 3 event /year guy like me, under steer is a bit safer and more manageable than oversteer. Of course I'm looking for a neutral setup. I'm not sure which way is easier to dial into Neutral with adjustable sway bar in the rear and coilovers. Dial out oversteer or dial out understeer?
Second, my understanding is that the stability control system is looking for a slight differential between the front and rear rotation given the 17" vs 18" wheel setup that comes from the factory. Some have had issues with the stability control "freaking out" in a square setup. I will not turn my stability control completely off so i need it functional. I don't want to spend all the $$'s for (2) 18" rims and tires and then have the Stability control system say "no way"
That is why I am leaning toward just keeping the stock wheel set up.
All please lend your personal experience in these areas.
aaronc7, I don't know what Vette your driving, your handle indicated a C7. for a C5Z (like I run) 285's all round is more tire in the front than stock and less tire than stock in the rear. For a high power rear wheel drive car, that sounds like a recipe for snap oversteer??? What is your experience, is your setup biased toward oversteer or understeer? Or is it the perfect balance, NEUTRAL?
1) Adding more grip in front with about the same grip as stock in the rear may make for a rear-happy car. For a 2 or 3 event /year guy like me, under steer is a bit safer and more manageable than oversteer. Of course I'm looking for a neutral setup. I'm not sure which way is easier to dial into Neutral with adjustable sway bar in the rear and coilovers. Dial out oversteer or dial out understeer?
Second, my understanding is that the stability control system is looking for a slight differential between the front and rear rotation given the 17" vs 18" wheel setup that comes from the factory. Some have had issues with the stability control "freaking out" in a square setup. I will not turn my stability control completely off so i need it functional. I don't want to spend all the $$'s for (2) 18" rims and tires and then have the Stability control system say "no way"
That is why I am leaning toward just keeping the stock wheel set up.
All please lend your personal experience in these areas.
aaronc7, I don't know what Vette your driving, your handle indicated a C7. for a C5Z (like I run) 285's all round is more tire in the front than stock and less tire than stock in the rear. For a high power rear wheel drive car, that sounds like a recipe for snap oversteer??? What is your experience, is your setup biased toward oversteer or understeer? Or is it the perfect balance, NEUTRAL?
2.) I think it is only TC you need to be concerned about with on the C5 and square setup. With a larger diamater/slower rolling front wheel, at some point (triple digit speeds), the car thinks the rears are spinning and TC kicks in. I don't think AH is affected, and I run comp mode (AH on) on track, 150 mph no problems. Normal interstate speeds no issues with square setup and TC either though. I drive to the track on my track set/square setup.
1.) I don't have a lot of time on the square setup but I like it. Think of it as gaining traction in front-- you're not losing any in the rear. In my case I went from NT05 275/295 to RS3 285/285-- 285 RS3 > 295 NT05. I felt like the setup was very neutral, it was not some scary oversteer monster by any means. 275/295 NT05 would push and push, especially after a quick lap. Like anything else, take the first session and get a feel for it and then it will be second nature. Big plus for me is the ability to rotate tires and swap tires as needed. I'm a only-a-few HPDE a year kinda guy as well, but I like to save $$ where I can. I have an adjustable rear sway bar as well, but I haven't started messing with that yet on the square setup.
Hope this helps-- don't be afraid of square setup.
01-16-2017, 05:08 AM
#39
If you feel comfortable keeping the stability control on, then continue doing so.
I have never used it, and I think that if I'm going to crash my car, it's more likely a situation where I go off at the end of a braking zone, or if I go wide and get onto wet grass. In either of those situations stability control won't be able to do anything to save me.
Getting back to the original topic, I really recommend running a cheap tire in order to get seat time without spending a great deal of money. The Federal RS-R and RS-RR (silly names!) are what I use. They are about $500 a set. Does anyone know of similar inexpensive track tires? These tires don't grip much when they get hot, but they don't chunk. I think they are an excellent value for track days.
I have never used it, and I think that if I'm going to crash my car, it's more likely a situation where I go off at the end of a braking zone, or if I go wide and get onto wet grass. In either of those situations stability control won't be able to do anything to save me.
Getting back to the original topic, I really recommend running a cheap tire in order to get seat time without spending a great deal of money. The Federal RS-R and RS-RR (silly names!) are what I use. They are about $500 a set. Does anyone know of similar inexpensive track tires? These tires don't grip much when they get hot, but they don't chunk. I think they are an excellent value for track days.