C7s

Beat my best time by 5 sec! This was 9/13/2017 trackday. See my YouTube channel before for more videos!

duk007

Yep, every chance I can, I didn't set any personal bests that night but still had a good time as always.

C7s

^^^Nice! I was in Intermediate Group. What overlay software do you use?

needmoregarage

I have not been to a Track Night in America event.

Do either of you run with other clubs? If so - can you compare/contrast how things are run with Track Night?

PittRace is my home track (I'm SOOOO lucky - like you), and I have run with Chin, Hooked On Driving, Viper Club, PCA clubs and done the PittRace DE's.

duk007

I used Race Render to Overlay Data from a SoloDL over GoPro Data. I bought the DL for my C6Z, but since the C5Z has a very basic ODBII interface I don't get get nearly as much data. It does give me lap times and speed so at least I can compare laps.

duk007

I agree, this track has really come a long way, we have a thank Jim & Kathy Stout for their efforts, it really is a great track.

The TNIA experience is really a great way to get your feet wet if you have never been on a track before and don't want to make the financial commitment of a two day school or club event. Novices are limited in passing locations . Intermediate has more liberal passing zones with a point by. Advanced drivers can pass anywhere with a point by.

It's also great way for intermediate and advanced drivers to get more seat time, which is what I use it for. They discourage pure race cars as it's meant for street & purpose built track cars.

They start ay 3:00 and are done by 7-8 and for $150.00 it's a great way to spend some additional time at the track.

I've been to a lot of the events you have listed, it's no better or worst than any of them , just different. There are no instructors, no drills and no real classroom discussions, just a novice download to discuss who did something stupid during that previous session. Your not going to learn anything like those other club events. During a TNIA they discourage 9/10's, two wheels off driving, but they also don't say much else unless you are unsafe , won't let anyone pass, or don't have the skill level to be in the group you are driving with . John from SCCA is pretty cool and handles any mishaps very well as long as you come to him and address them right after they happen.

We have seen a lot of intermediate drivers in the advanced group all of a sudden when the intermediate group gets booked up. That can sometimes be an issue, especially when you come into a corner 2 wide with someone that probably has never done that before at speed.

Other than that it's pretty chill, there are always a guy with a 1K hp GTR or some other high horsepower car that flys by everyone on the two straights and then parks it on all the corners, but I guess that happens everywhere . You generally see a good mix of people and cars and it's a good opportunity to help a more novice guy gain some experience .

Come on out and bring a friend who has never driven his car on the track before, it's a great opportunity to get someone on the track with very little commitment , they can even rent a helmet, and you can get some cheap seat time between more structured events.

needmoregarage

^duk007 - that sounds a bit like the 'wild west".

I recently met someone who did a TNIA and he didn't like it. He was a newbie. Zero experience. He ended up going out solo without any instruction and was floundering around. He felt it was unsafe.

I would encourage people who want to learn to do a PittRace PDE (Performance Driving Education). They are usually held at least 1x/month and often at least 2x/month. I think it's $225 and it begins at 8 am and is done by 12:30. There are two groups divided (usually evenly) and a max of 30 cars (15 per group). There is an instructor in everyone's car unless you are solo'd. There are passing rules. There are two classroom sessions and three track sessions roughly 25 min each. It's a great way to get some track time and still have the advantage of classroom which can be critical to understanding the basics. And even more important is an instructor in the right seat to keep you safe and help you build the skills needed to go fast (safely).

The season is coming to a close. There are lots of clubs running events and I agree - committing to a full two day event may be too much for some. I know the local Porsche club is looking at adding "Taste of the track" which would be a one day event, with classroom and right seat instructor, and several track sessions - for a reduced price". Some clubs around the country do it very successfully as a way for people to "dip their toe in" without a 2 or 3 day commitment. And most PCA regions (including the local Allegheny Region) accept all marques - not just Porsche. We have plenty of Corvettes in our events, and several of our "senior" instructors drive Corvettes (and Lotus / BMW / etc)

duk007

Sorry to hear that your friend felt unsafe. I'm never heard that from anyone in the Novice class, they generally just "follow the leader" for the first two sessions and don't really get up to speed till the last session. Most of them aren't driving any faster than they would on public roads. Heck there isn't even passing allowed until the last 2 sessions. Now the intermediate group, I can agree, it would seem dangerous if he had no experience and signed up with the intermediate drivers. Still, it's rare that there is an incident, but it can happen.

I agree everyone should be doing DE's as well. I see the TNIA program as an introduction to DE if you just want to get your feet wet , then i you like it go to a DE and come back as a intermediate after you have a bunch of days with an instructor. Most of the guys that show up for TNIA are "track guys" that have done lots of different DE events.

It's just another (well run) program that gives you an opportunity to get more seat time, but maybe not for everyone I guess.

I'm just happy there are options.

I'm sure we will see each other at one of them.

needmoregarage

Some great points^ - thanks.

I guess the biggest concern is that even if it’s safe - without classroom or a right seat instructor - you can follow someone who hopefullly shows you a good line, but your braking technique may be incorrect, and the timing of braking and shifting (if you are shifting) is critical, and being smooth is critical.

Anyone can drive around a race track “safely”, but to build the skills needed to go fast safely and get the most from your car - IMO instruction is necessary. Classroom can give basics and some theory, and visually show the line on a track map, or with videos. And someone in the right seat can literally FEEL what you are doing, and offer suggestions to improve in a methodical way, without overwhelming the driver.

In the beginning it can be sensory overload for newbies. I’ve ridden with countless newbies (my fave type of student) and they are typically doing many things wrong, but we focus on a few basics, and as they master those we add more. Baby steps. There are very few people who are “naturals” that can get in a car and intuitively drive fast and safely employing the proper techniques.

I think it’s great that a variety of programs are available. I’d love to see more people get into the sport. It’s great fun and I’ve made lifelong friendships. The biggest concern about an event that doesn’t provide the proper building blocks in a methodical way is that someone might be turned off because they feel they are floundering around, or that it may be unsafe or feel unsafe because people aren’t following protocols (like passing rules). But as long as everyone is having fun and being safe - I’m all for it!

See you at the track!

Dan H.

I've done 2 TNIA events, one last year and one this year. Both were at Pocono. These are a cheap way to go try a track event out, with a discount code they are $125 for three 20 minute sessions. My biggest hangup with this group is that there is zero governance on what run group drivers sign up for. My neighbors in the garage this year were Intermediate because "They have track experience" they said. They proceeded to tell me they had done one other TNIA event and thats what put them in intermediate in their eyes. I was intermediate last year and there were clearly others who had never been on track before.

Most guys I spoke to also didn't understand their were other options for track time. They thought TNIA was all there was. I spent a lot of time saying "If you like this, you should really try PCA, Chin, or SCCA". So while people think its a great intro, the people who liked it didn't understand there were more and better options.

I look at TNIA as a way to get some cheap laps mid week if I'm jonesin and haven't been to the track in some time. Its not a great experience because you have to set your expectations a notch or two lower than what you would expect per run group. SA and pace are not what you would expect out of any other organization. And there is zero education for Novices or Intermediate drivers.