Scca t2
10-04-2017, 07:25 AM
#2
Instructor
The C5 is not really competitive in T1 anymore. I run mine in T1-LP (limited prep) and I get the advantage of a lower minimum weight, but while I'm very competitive in regional races I get murdered at the majors.
10-04-2017, 08:08 AM
#3
Subscribed. My car is T1-LP right now, but I am considering either full prep t1 ($$$$$) or reverting back to a dedicated T2 car (3525lbs and ~350hp). There is also the issue of class participation.. I usually have 3 T1 cars to run with locally, and no T2 class. Regionals are about an even split.
Also, Buttermore won T2 last week, so is he an outlier or is the c5z still competitive in T2?
When can we get spec corvette in the midwest?
Also, Buttermore won T2 last week, so is he an outlier or is the c5z still competitive in T2?
When can we get spec corvette in the midwest?
10-04-2017, 11:19 AM
#4
Instructor
Buttermore just won the Runoffs in a C5 in T2. I was the second finishing C5 in 5th. I converted the car from T1 to T2 in the middle of season. Only a couple versions of the Corvette are somewhat competitive in T1, the C5 is not. That's why I switched to T2. The mix of cars in T2 is cool and the racing is close. It was a mixture of Vettes, Porsches, Mustangs, Nissans, BMWs, Camaros and even a Viper. It reminds me of the old T1 days. This was the finishing order....
1, (1), John M Buttermore, South Lyon, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C5, 19.
2, (6), Mark Boden, Buffalo Grove, IL, Porsche 997, 19.
3, (3), Preston Calvert, Potomac, MD, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
4, (2), Kurt Rezzetano, Phoenixville, PA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
5, (4), David Sanders, Malvern, PA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
6, (13), Jeff Lepper, Bradenton, FL, Nissan 370Z, 19.
7, (8), Jason Ott, Littleton, CO, BMW M3, 19.
8, (9), James Leithauser, Westminster, CO, BMW M3, 19.
9, (18), Joe Aquilante, Chester Springs, PA, Chevrolet Corvette, 19.
10, (12), William Moore, Chagrin Falls, OH, Chevrolet Camaro SS, 19.
11, (17), Chris Qualls, Yorba Linda, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
12, (16), Henry Van Vurst, Pompano Beach, FL, Ford Mustang Boss 302, 19.
13, (14), Gary Mason, Waterford, MI, Porsche 911/996, 19.
14, (11), Peter Kulka, Plandome Manor, NY, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
15, (20), Buz McCall, Boca Raton, FL, BMW E92 M3, 19.
16, (10), Derek Kulach, Albuquerque, NM, Nissan 370Z, 19.
17, (25), Lynne Griffiths, Menlo Park, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
18, (22), James R Smith, Alvin, TX, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
19, (15), John R Buttermore, Wolverine Lake, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C6, 18.
20, (21), Nicole Jacque, San Jose, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 18.
21, (23), Carl Fung, Rancho Palos Verdes, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 15.
22, (24), Richard Kulach, Franklin, TN, Nissan 370Z, 15.
23, (19), Natha Waldbaum, Omaha, NE, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 8.
24, (5), Michael Lavigne, Hooksett, NH, Ford Mustang GT, 4.
25, (7), Bill Collins, Saint Paul, MN, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 4.
1, (1), John M Buttermore, South Lyon, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C5, 19.
2, (6), Mark Boden, Buffalo Grove, IL, Porsche 997, 19.
3, (3), Preston Calvert, Potomac, MD, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
4, (2), Kurt Rezzetano, Phoenixville, PA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
5, (4), David Sanders, Malvern, PA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
6, (13), Jeff Lepper, Bradenton, FL, Nissan 370Z, 19.
7, (8), Jason Ott, Littleton, CO, BMW M3, 19.
8, (9), James Leithauser, Westminster, CO, BMW M3, 19.
9, (18), Joe Aquilante, Chester Springs, PA, Chevrolet Corvette, 19.
10, (12), William Moore, Chagrin Falls, OH, Chevrolet Camaro SS, 19.
11, (17), Chris Qualls, Yorba Linda, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
12, (16), Henry Van Vurst, Pompano Beach, FL, Ford Mustang Boss 302, 19.
13, (14), Gary Mason, Waterford, MI, Porsche 911/996, 19.
14, (11), Peter Kulka, Plandome Manor, NY, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
15, (20), Buz McCall, Boca Raton, FL, BMW E92 M3, 19.
16, (10), Derek Kulach, Albuquerque, NM, Nissan 370Z, 19.
17, (25), Lynne Griffiths, Menlo Park, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
18, (22), James R Smith, Alvin, TX, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
19, (15), John R Buttermore, Wolverine Lake, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C6, 18.
20, (21), Nicole Jacque, San Jose, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 18.
21, (23), Carl Fung, Rancho Palos Verdes, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 15.
22, (24), Richard Kulach, Franklin, TN, Nissan 370Z, 15.
23, (19), Natha Waldbaum, Omaha, NE, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 8.
24, (5), Michael Lavigne, Hooksett, NH, Ford Mustang GT, 4.
25, (7), Bill Collins, Saint Paul, MN, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 4.
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BrianCunningham (10-06-2017)
10-04-2017, 07:00 PM
#5
Instructor
Buttermore just won the Runoffs in a C5 in T2. I was the second finishing C5 in 5th. I converted the car from T1 to T2 in the middle of season. Only a couple versions of the Corvette are somewhat competitive in T1, the C5 is not. That's why I switched to T2. The mix of cars in T2 is cool and the racing is close. It was a mixture of Vettes, Porsches, Mustangs, Nissans, BMWs, Camaros and even a Viper. It reminds me of the old T1 days. This was the finishing order....
1, (1), John M Buttermore, South Lyon, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C5, 19.
2, (6), Mark Boden, Buffalo Grove, IL, Porsche 997, 19.
3, (3), Preston Calvert, Potomac, MD, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
4, (2), Kurt Rezzetano, Phoenixville, PA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
5, (4), David Sanders, Malvern, PA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
6, (13), Jeff Lepper, Bradenton, FL, Nissan 370Z, 19.
7, (8), Jason Ott, Littleton, CO, BMW M3, 19.
8, (9), James Leithauser, Westminster, CO, BMW M3, 19.
9, (18), Joe Aquilante, Chester Springs, PA, Chevrolet Corvette, 19.
10, (12), William Moore, Chagrin Falls, OH, Chevrolet Camaro SS, 19.
11, (17), Chris Qualls, Yorba Linda, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
12, (16), Henry Van Vurst, Pompano Beach, FL, Ford Mustang Boss 302, 19.
13, (14), Gary Mason, Waterford, MI, Porsche 911/996, 19.
14, (11), Peter Kulka, Plandome Manor, NY, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
15, (20), Buz McCall, Boca Raton, FL, BMW E92 M3, 19.
16, (10), Derek Kulach, Albuquerque, NM, Nissan 370Z, 19.
17, (25), Lynne Griffiths, Menlo Park, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
18, (22), James R Smith, Alvin, TX, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
19, (15), John R Buttermore, Wolverine Lake, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C6, 18.
20, (21), Nicole Jacque, San Jose, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 18.
21, (23), Carl Fung, Rancho Palos Verdes, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 15.
22, (24), Richard Kulach, Franklin, TN, Nissan 370Z, 15.
23, (19), Natha Waldbaum, Omaha, NE, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 8.
24, (5), Michael Lavigne, Hooksett, NH, Ford Mustang GT, 4.
25, (7), Bill Collins, Saint Paul, MN, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 4.
1, (1), John M Buttermore, South Lyon, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C5, 19.
2, (6), Mark Boden, Buffalo Grove, IL, Porsche 997, 19.
3, (3), Preston Calvert, Potomac, MD, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
4, (2), Kurt Rezzetano, Phoenixville, PA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
5, (4), David Sanders, Malvern, PA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
6, (13), Jeff Lepper, Bradenton, FL, Nissan 370Z, 19.
7, (8), Jason Ott, Littleton, CO, BMW M3, 19.
8, (9), James Leithauser, Westminster, CO, BMW M3, 19.
9, (18), Joe Aquilante, Chester Springs, PA, Chevrolet Corvette, 19.
10, (12), William Moore, Chagrin Falls, OH, Chevrolet Camaro SS, 19.
11, (17), Chris Qualls, Yorba Linda, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
12, (16), Henry Van Vurst, Pompano Beach, FL, Ford Mustang Boss 302, 19.
13, (14), Gary Mason, Waterford, MI, Porsche 911/996, 19.
14, (11), Peter Kulka, Plandome Manor, NY, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
15, (20), Buz McCall, Boca Raton, FL, BMW E92 M3, 19.
16, (10), Derek Kulach, Albuquerque, NM, Nissan 370Z, 19.
17, (25), Lynne Griffiths, Menlo Park, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 19.
18, (22), James R Smith, Alvin, TX, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 19.
19, (15), John R Buttermore, Wolverine Lake, MI, Chevrolet Corvette C6, 18.
20, (21), Nicole Jacque, San Jose, CA, Ford Mustang GT, 18.
21, (23), Carl Fung, Rancho Palos Verdes, CA, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 15.
22, (24), Richard Kulach, Franklin, TN, Nissan 370Z, 15.
23, (19), Natha Waldbaum, Omaha, NE, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 8.
24, (5), Michael Lavigne, Hooksett, NH, Ford Mustang GT, 4.
25, (7), Bill Collins, Saint Paul, MN, Chevrolet Corvette C5 Z06, 4.
10-04-2017, 08:31 PM
#6
Burning Brakes
Member Since: May 2001
Location: Coto de Caza CA
Posts: 1,163
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With my race taking place last on Sunday it took me until 11pm to finish and load up. But well worth the effort to cross the bricks first.
Last edited by RX7 KLR; 10-04-2017 at 08:32 PM.
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Captain Buddha (10-10-2017)
10-04-2017, 11:52 PM
#7
I'm in that T2 group. Honestly, I think the SCCA has done a fantastic job of equalizing. It really comes down to the driver and team. Buttermore is pretty darn good as is calvert and rezzantano. Not sure about others on the grid but calvert does low level pro stuff too. Also, there are professional efforts out there. Those pheonix guys had extra cars! When their 1st car was lame they gave up qualifying times and qualified on their back up cars. I'm lucky to have new tires. I go to runoffs with a set of used tires and a new set to qualify and a new set to race. I have the same set-up since Mid-O 2016 runoffs and ran it all year (my car was doing east coast Majors tour I live in cali) doing nothing to prep for Runoffs except change my fuel over to pass tech. These other guys have pro efforts and new tires for every qualy and race and are setting up the cars differently as they learn how to go faster on this track. I know how to scale a car and get 50/50 cross and stuff like that but these guys know how to tweek corner weights and alignment settings to capitalize on the track. You bet they are faster and its not because they have a C5 or a mustang it is because they know more than the rest of the pack. They test and test and test. Who can afford to do that? Near pro efforts. Who has the time or dedication or budget to find out if the C5 is faster as 3525 lbs/55mm restrictor or 3400lbs/50mm restrictor stock brakes, or 3225lbs/48mm restrictor?
That stuff aside look at Indy. We got this infield track that is a giant autocross course. It was a handling track not a power track. What works best 3525lbs/55mm restrictor most of the C5 pack or 3225/48mm restrictor buttermore's package? I have not seen the 3225/48mm package run all year and it has just been recently allowed and it shows up at the Runoffs on a handling track? Hmmm.....
OTOH I was lapped at Daytona by Rezzantano in his mustang on a power track. I could make up time and pass on the daytona infield only to be passed back by the time I got to the bustop.
So much is track dependent and driver dependent and crew dependent. So when I raced Sebring this year seeing the track for the 1st time and my friends asked why I missed practice. I said I went fishing. They said I thought you came to race. I say, I came to have a good time. IMO if you aren't 1st you lost. It does not matter if you are 2nd or 17th, there is only 1 national champion. So if you don't really have a chance at it, go have a good time and enjoy the experience and let other sweat the details.
That stuff aside look at Indy. We got this infield track that is a giant autocross course. It was a handling track not a power track. What works best 3525lbs/55mm restrictor most of the C5 pack or 3225/48mm restrictor buttermore's package? I have not seen the 3225/48mm package run all year and it has just been recently allowed and it shows up at the Runoffs on a handling track? Hmmm.....
OTOH I was lapped at Daytona by Rezzantano in his mustang on a power track. I could make up time and pass on the daytona infield only to be passed back by the time I got to the bustop.
So much is track dependent and driver dependent and crew dependent. So when I raced Sebring this year seeing the track for the 1st time and my friends asked why I missed practice. I said I went fishing. They said I thought you came to race. I say, I came to have a good time. IMO if you aren't 1st you lost. It does not matter if you are 2nd or 17th, there is only 1 national champion. So if you don't really have a chance at it, go have a good time and enjoy the experience and let other sweat the details.
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Captain Buddha (10-10-2017)
10-05-2017, 10:02 AM
#8
Instructor
T2 really does look like a lot of fun. I think I might be doing what David did for next season and converting the car back to T2. I want to run the majors next year and I dont have the car for it in T1, its either convert to T2 or sell the current car and buy a competitive car in T1... Being stuck in the middle is a real pain.
Honestly I wish there was a field for spec corvette here on the east coast. I would LOVE to race in that class.. the idea of a SPEC class for C5s would be incredible.
Honestly I wish there was a field for spec corvette here on the east coast. I would LOVE to race in that class.. the idea of a SPEC class for C5s would be incredible.
10-05-2017, 07:28 PM
#9
Start building a car ! I'm in Pittsburgh, and started converting my car. I've got one or two local guys on the fence but I think they will start once I'm done. I can't see why we can't get 8-10 cars between PIRC, VIR, Watkins Glen,and Mid Ohio, NCM, and NJMP.
My thought process: I already have a c5z that it mostly stock. It's a dedicated track car and I've run it all season with just basic safety and performance mods. I would have been adding parts over the next few months anyways, why not buy a "specific " set of parts and be ready for the series once it catches on. Worst case scenario is no one on the east coast/Midwest buys in, and then your "stuck" with quality parts bought at great discount. I'll take that scenario all day long.
Oli & John seem like stand up guys and have always returned my emails and answered my questions. I'm happy to be one of the early adopters on the east coast .
The other option is an open checkbook series that requires a lot of money and talent. I'm not sure how much talent I have , but I know for sure I don't have a 75-150K race budget !
If you build it they will come !
My thought process: I already have a c5z that it mostly stock. It's a dedicated track car and I've run it all season with just basic safety and performance mods. I would have been adding parts over the next few months anyways, why not buy a "specific " set of parts and be ready for the series once it catches on. Worst case scenario is no one on the east coast/Midwest buys in, and then your "stuck" with quality parts bought at great discount. I'll take that scenario all day long.
Oli & John seem like stand up guys and have always returned my emails and answered my questions. I'm happy to be one of the early adopters on the east coast .
The other option is an open checkbook series that requires a lot of money and talent. I'm not sure how much talent I have , but I know for sure I don't have a 75-150K race budget !
If you build it they will come !
T2 really does look like a lot of fun. I think I might be doing what David did for next season and converting the car back to T2. I want to run the majors next year and I dont have the car for it in T1, its either convert to T2 or sell the current car and buy a competitive car in T1... Being stuck in the middle is a real pain.
Honestly I wish there was a field for spec corvette here on the east coast. I would LOVE to race in that class.. the idea of a SPEC class for C5s would be incredible.
Honestly I wish there was a field for spec corvette here on the east coast. I would LOVE to race in that class.. the idea of a SPEC class for C5s would be incredible.
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Olitho (10-06-2017)
10-06-2017, 03:05 PM
#10
The other cool thing is spec vette is very close to T2 and ST3/4. So you will always have a place to race. Also, building a racecar with full cage is safer than a dual use compromise. The C5 doesn't know if you are doing HPDE or racing. Even in T2 trim the C5 is a 160mph car at Daytona.
10-06-2017, 05:11 PM
#11
Instructor
Start building a car ! I'm in Pittsburgh, and started converting my car. I've got one or two local guys on the fence but I think they will start once I'm done. I can't see why we can't get 8-10 cars between PIRC, VIR, Watkins Glen,and Mid Ohio, NCM, and NJMP.
My thought process: I already have a c5z that it mostly stock. It's a dedicated track car and I've run it all season with just basic safety and performance mods. I would have been adding parts over the next few months anyways, why not buy a "specific " set of parts and be ready for the series once it catches on. Worst case scenario is no one on the east coast/Midwest buys in, and then your "stuck" with quality parts bought at great discount. I'll take that scenario all day long.
Oli & John seem like stand up guys and have always returned my emails and answered my questions. I'm happy to be one of the early adopters on the east coast .
The other option is an open checkbook series that requires a lot of money and talent. I'm not sure how much talent I have , but I know for sure I don't have a 75-150K race budget !
If you build it they will come !
My thought process: I already have a c5z that it mostly stock. It's a dedicated track car and I've run it all season with just basic safety and performance mods. I would have been adding parts over the next few months anyways, why not buy a "specific " set of parts and be ready for the series once it catches on. Worst case scenario is no one on the east coast/Midwest buys in, and then your "stuck" with quality parts bought at great discount. I'll take that scenario all day long.
Oli & John seem like stand up guys and have always returned my emails and answered my questions. I'm happy to be one of the early adopters on the east coast .
The other option is an open checkbook series that requires a lot of money and talent. I'm not sure how much talent I have , but I know for sure I don't have a 75-150K race budget !
If you build it they will come !
James
10-10-2017, 10:49 PM
#13
I missed you. I must have had my head up my &^%. I could not get my act together for qualy. I had a great race passing cars up the field then engine go "BANG." I'll try again at Sonoma 2018.
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Olitho (10-11-2017)
11-19-2017, 03:46 PM
#15
Question for the group who have T1 vs T2 setup. What is the difference, Im setting up a stock Ls6, Coil overs, spherical bearings, sway bars, big brakes front, removable steering wheel, fire safety, E-stop, and a cage. I already have a competition SCCA Lic. Thanks in advance for the feedback. Looking forward to racing this car vs a High Maint Super Production Car.
11-19-2017, 06:04 PM
#16
Question for the group who have T1 vs T2 setup. What is the difference, Im setting up a stock Ls6, Coil overs, spherical bearings, sway bars, big brakes front, removable steering wheel, fire safety, E-stop, and a cage. I already have a competition SCCA Lic. Thanks in advance for the feedback. Looking forward to racing this car vs a High Maint Super Production Car.
Looks like van steel has the best deal on refurbishing your a arms with new ball joints and delrin bearings.
11-19-2017, 06:16 PM
#17
Question for the group who have T1 vs T2 setup. What is the difference, Im setting up a stock Ls6, Coil overs, spherical bearings, sway bars, big brakes front, removable steering wheel, fire safety, E-stop, and a cage. I already have a competition SCCA Lic. Thanks in advance for the feedback. Looking forward to racing this car vs a High Maint Super Production Car.
11-19-2017, 06:29 PM
#18
Le Mans Master
Additionally, in talking last week with Alan at SCCA he felt the "ask" would be much more likely to be approved with a part numbered suspension kit request such as we already have in Spec Corvette. They don't like to make that approval on an open basis for the suspension, but if they know the elements and performance of the exact kit they can make fairness adjustments via weight and restrictor, but Sam I am sure you pretty much already know that....
11-19-2017, 06:44 PM
#19
That is correct. If I am not mistaken that question is posted by Sam in NorCal who also wants to do Spec Corvette. At this time the easier path is T1 LP, but I am hoping we can finagle coil-overs and sphericals into T2 through the CRB, but I am not remotely suggesting that is likely in 2018 and if you have ever dealt with the CRB it might be never. That is why we are waiting for more car counts in Spec Corvette because we will have much more clout asking for that accommodation when we approach them with attractive car counts.
Additionally, in talking last week with Alan at SCCA he felt the "ask" would be much more likely to be approved with a part numbered suspension kit request such as we already have in Spec Corvette. They don't like to make that approval on an open basis for the suspension, but if they know the elements and performance of the exact kit they can make fairness adjustments via weight and restrictor, but Sam I am sure you pretty much already know that....
Additionally, in talking last week with Alan at SCCA he felt the "ask" would be much more likely to be approved with a part numbered suspension kit request such as we already have in Spec Corvette. They don't like to make that approval on an open basis for the suspension, but if they know the elements and performance of the exact kit they can make fairness adjustments via weight and restrictor, but Sam I am sure you pretty much already know that....
11-19-2017, 06:49 PM
#20
Ok T1 it is thanks gentlemen!
I have some suspension parts to finish up I have already driven the wheels off it using a stock suspension and brakes. Looking forward to trying it all out when done.
I have some suspension parts to finish up I have already driven the wheels off it using a stock suspension and brakes. Looking forward to trying it all out when done.