Help: Michelin PS4S or Nitto NT-01 for HPDE & Street Use
05-12-2018, 05:11 PM
#21
Hey everyone,
It's that time of year again and I think my 2006 Z06 deserves some fresh rubber. My questions and some background info are below. Please share your feedback!
Background info:
- I drive 3-5k km per year (2-3k miles) which includes 4-8 HPDE days at Mosport (and hopefully Watkins Glen this year!). The street mileage includes everything from twisty backroads to 1hr highway drives to the beach. I want to keep my yearly mileage up to feel I'm getting good use out of owning this car.
- I'm currently on oem sized PSS made in 2013. I've done ~6 trackdays on these tires last year (total of ~10-12 days between this car and my M3). They have tons of tread left but they feel hardened and lack grip, so I want to upgrade my tires and need your help to make the best choice.
- I realize this is a situation of compromise, so to help understand my priorities, I'd say durability/cost effectiveness is more important than the absolute lowest laptime. There is a lot to learn with this car and I want my next tire to help facilitate that over the next few summers.
Questions:
1. Based on my usage above, do you think the PS4S or NT01 will be better suited for me? I don't drive this car in the rain.
2. Do you think the PS4S will get killed on the track/the NT01 will get killed on the street? I've only clocked a ~1.37 at Mosport on these current PSS to provide context.
3. The NT01 has been around forever while the PS4S uses newer technology. Do you think this narrows the gap that usually exists between these classes, or not really? The Michelins will cost me $200 CAD more than the Nittos.
Thanks in advance!
Anthony
It's that time of year again and I think my 2006 Z06 deserves some fresh rubber. My questions and some background info are below. Please share your feedback!
Background info:
- I drive 3-5k km per year (2-3k miles) which includes 4-8 HPDE days at Mosport (and hopefully Watkins Glen this year!). The street mileage includes everything from twisty backroads to 1hr highway drives to the beach. I want to keep my yearly mileage up to feel I'm getting good use out of owning this car.
- I'm currently on oem sized PSS made in 2013. I've done ~6 trackdays on these tires last year (total of ~10-12 days between this car and my M3). They have tons of tread left but they feel hardened and lack grip, so I want to upgrade my tires and need your help to make the best choice.
- I realize this is a situation of compromise, so to help understand my priorities, I'd say durability/cost effectiveness is more important than the absolute lowest laptime. There is a lot to learn with this car and I want my next tire to help facilitate that over the next few summers.
Questions:
1. Based on my usage above, do you think the PS4S or NT01 will be better suited for me? I don't drive this car in the rain.
2. Do you think the PS4S will get killed on the track/the NT01 will get killed on the street? I've only clocked a ~1.37 at Mosport on these current PSS to provide context.
3. The NT01 has been around forever while the PS4S uses newer technology. Do you think this narrows the gap that usually exists between these classes, or not really? The Michelins will cost me $200 CAD more than the Nittos.
Thanks in advance!
Anthony
05-12-2018, 07:37 PM
#22
Absolute nonsense. NT01's and R888's are fine on the street in a daily driven vehicle. I've daily driven R888's and currently daily drive on Michelin LeMans style slicks. I've driven in the rain many times and even in snow.
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fruitsalad (05-13-2018)
05-12-2018, 08:35 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
FWIW NT01 was my preferred track tire on my supercharged Mustang Cobra. I would drive them to and from the track with no issues... except they are very noisy! For that reason alone, never considered the NT01 as a street tire.
They did well on wet track with full tread, got even better on dry tracks as the tread disappeared.
I have a new set of R888R's for my C7 Z51 this season.
They did well on wet track with full tread, got even better on dry tracks as the tread disappeared.
I have a new set of R888R's for my C7 Z51 this season.
05-12-2018, 10:39 PM
#24
Melting Slicks
05-13-2018, 05:36 PM
#25
Daily driving those tires is a waste of money. I don't daily my C7 (I drive 2 days a week) and I even change from r888r to pss for track days. It takes 45 minutes to change all 4 wheels and all 4 brake pad sets. Worth it.
05-14-2018, 07:40 PM
#28
I put the PSS back on for the street, or better yet I previously had a set of Bridgestone S01 non-run flat which have a much improved ride versus the PSS.
05-14-2018, 07:41 PM
#29
Melting Slicks
Yes, but the OP also said
So, since the NT05 is a 200 TW tire, I thought I'd throw that into the discussion.
He could conceivably use an NT05 as an "in between".
Originally Posted by anth115
It’s a shame that none of the newer 200tw tires seem to come in c6z sizes, as I'd love to run an re71r or something as an ‘in between’ step.
He could conceivably use an NT05 as an "in between".
05-14-2018, 08:18 PM
#33
200tw doesn't mean it is a good tire. it is just a treadwear rating (NOT standardized). cheater 200tw tires like RE71R acts more like a 80 treadwear if you are comparing to traditional R-comp like 100tw NT01/RC1/R888R. Ignore the number completely.
although most cheater 200tw tires do overheat pretty fast, as most are designed as an autocross tires (needs to get up to temp within seconds). most 100tw R-comp is better at handling heat, but still get its *** kicked on the first lap or 2, depending on ambient temp.
and NO, NT05 is not good for autocross. it is a street tire, NOT a performance (as in HPDE/autocross) tire.
although most cheater 200tw tires do overheat pretty fast, as most are designed as an autocross tires (needs to get up to temp within seconds). most 100tw R-comp is better at handling heat, but still get its *** kicked on the first lap or 2, depending on ambient temp.
and NO, NT05 is not good for autocross. it is a street tire, NOT a performance (as in HPDE/autocross) tire.
Last edited by bellwilliam; 05-14-2018 at 08:20 PM.
05-15-2018, 12:17 AM
#35
Why is it a waste of money?
Last edited by Millennium FRC; 05-15-2018 at 12:19 AM.
05-15-2018, 12:26 AM
#36
Melting Slicks
Because he likely thinks they burn up too fast, and you're uselessly burning up the tires quickly on regular drives.
I've had R888's on my boosted ZO6 for a long time. I think this is their 4th year. The car sees 3k miles a year maybe. It would have been a waste of money to buy anything else. Just depends on your situation and if it's your only car.
I've had R888's on my boosted ZO6 for a long time. I think this is their 4th year. The car sees 3k miles a year maybe. It would have been a waste of money to buy anything else. Just depends on your situation and if it's your only car.
02-05-2019, 05:00 AM
#37
Melting Slicks
Got the 4S couple weeks ago, might try it out in a HPDE next month. Does anyone know how many heat cycles it can do? I use 4s for DD too so I was wondering.
After maxing out heat cycles it just not as good at the track right?, but DD and drag strip should still be ok ?
After maxing out heat cycles it just not as good at the track right?, but DD and drag strip should still be ok ?
02-05-2019, 08:28 AM
#38
Le Mans Master
I might have missed it if someone else recommended this, but how about Continental ExtremeContact Speed tires? They come in exact C6 Z06 sizes. They are also pretty fast - about a second off Rival S or RE71R tires on a typical autocross course. And they are the go-to choice for wet autocross events. The only thing they aren't recommended for is below-freezing temps.
02-05-2019, 08:37 AM
#39
They can and will heat cycle out though, but you can maximize their useful life by:
- having a proper alignment with good camber/toe to keep the tires cooler/flatter on track
- limiting wheelspin/donuts etc. on the street
- keeping an eye on pressure settings on the track/street to help the tire do its thing
And once they do get past their prime, they'd be suboptimal for all sorts of performance driving aside from roll racing where grip is less of a factor.
Lastly, use em while they're fresh! They'll degrade over time even without being driven, so you may as well enjoy them while they're in peak shape.
02-05-2019, 08:43 AM
#40
I might have missed it if someone else recommended this, but how about Continental ExtremeContact Speed tires? They come in exact C6 Z06 sizes. They are also pretty fast - about a second off Rival S or RE71R tires on a typical autocross course. And they are the go-to choice for wet autocross events. The only thing they aren't recommended for is below-freezing temps.
Also, to update to my original post, I went with the PS4S again as they were easier to get in stock, obviously more street/weather friendly, and I felt they were a better match for my stock brakes and stock suspension (oem leafs and DRM Bilsteins). While they're definitely not R-comp fast, I've been very impressed with them so far and instantly cut 2 seconds off of my 1:3x laps around Mosport, coming from my old set of PSS. If I keep the car for track use, NT01 will be my next tire though.
