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~pics/diagrams for NASA/SCCA/TA legal C6Z Cage mounting technique?

Old 12-06-2018, 06:18 PM
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STANG KILLA SS
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Default ~pics/diagrams for NASA/SCCA/TA legal C6Z Cage mounting technique?

this seems to be fairly illusive on the interwebs. especially from a sanctioning body.

any body got any pics or diagrams?
or know who or where i can get verified legal mounting techniques for these cars for w2w nasa/scca/ta?
also interested in required sandwich/mount plate thickness and sizes
and bolt size required.

so far ive only found these
https://imgur.com/gallery/i01uk
dont care for this one
b pillar


not sure how you remove this?


a pillar



NHRA is the only official diagram i can find. but obviously useless for NASA/SCCA/TA


this ones by Tollefab, i like the frame part a bit better, but dont care for the "on the floor" steel cup. seems like it relies alot "sheer" strength in several areas. but yet it works fairly well.
b pillar cant see other side if its sandwiched on the other side with a threw bolt, or just screws into inner frame wall.



Last edited by STANG KILLA SS; 12-06-2018 at 06:19 PM.
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Old 12-06-2018, 11:18 PM
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A cage builder that specialized in unibody cars explained his ideas on this to me, basically it involved large contact patches that would not allow the cage tubing to punch through. He had similar ideas with the out riggers on the frame, but a bit bigger than those in the pictures.
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Old 12-07-2018, 12:57 AM
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This is why aluminum sucks... those bar locations suck for room. You want the main hoop through the rear wall.

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Old 12-07-2018, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by Tool Hoarder View Post
This is why aluminum sucks... those bar locations suck for room. You want the main hoop through the rear wall.

why does aluminum matter for location? the frame is the same is it not? why couldnt you poke threw the "behind seat" bulkhead on aluminum cars too?
and for A pilliar mount you could mount to top of rail as well like many steel frame cages?
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Old 12-07-2018, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by STANG KILLA SS View Post
why does aluminum matter for location? the frame is the same is it not? why couldnt you poke threw the "behind seat" bulkhead on aluminum cars too?
and for A pilliar mount you could mount to top of rail as well like many steel frame cages?
I've never seen an aluminum car caged like my C5 was. They always have way less room and are done like you posted.
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Old 12-07-2018, 11:29 AM
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If your under 5'10" or so it's no big deal to put the main hoop where you see in the pictures, but getting it further back makes you put it through the bulk head where the tanks are, the tanks are there and the frame gets more difficult to mount to as well. I don't think on the aluminum frame cars you have the option to remove the b pillar and make the main hoop in its place. I'm sure people with way more knowledge than me can clarify.
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Old 12-10-2018, 05:34 PM
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Contact Danny Popp up here in Cincinnati. He has a Road Race C5 (NOT his OPTIMA car). He would be a good resource.
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Old 12-11-2018, 03:08 PM
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I don't think what you have shown is SCCA legal, nor is it safe. You need an upside down "U" shaped bracket that slides over the frame. It is supposed to be bonded to the frame. You have to have the bracket bolted to the frame, I think 4 - 1/2" bolts. The frame has to have tubes welded into the frame where it is bolted to prevent the aluminum frame from collapsing when bolts are tightened. The roll cage tube then sits on top of the assembly. This will make a strong enough assembly in the event you need it. What you have shown, won't.
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Old 12-11-2018, 07:19 PM
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this is getting frustrating.
ive emailed both NASA and SCCA about this, and both have simply replied with the rule book pdfs.
neither of which says anything about bolting a cage to a aluminum frame or the approved or suggested methods of doing it.

i just dont seem to be able to get any answers about this.
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Old 12-11-2018, 09:58 PM
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Well since you can’t weld aluminum to steel, the only way to do it is to create bulkheads.
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Old 12-11-2018, 10:27 PM
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Originally Posted by STANG KILLA SS View Post
this is getting frustrating.
ive emailed both NASA and SCCA about this, and both have simply replied with the rule book pdfs.
neither of which says anything about bolting a cage to a aluminum frame or the approved or suggested methods of doing it.

i just dont seem to be able to get any answers about this.
Respectfully that's not their job, nor would they want the liability. Their job is to tell you how to make a cage to their rules. Not how to make it the safest for all materials/chassis types and car types. You're supposed to sleeve the frame and bolt/glue mount plates.
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Old 12-12-2018, 12:10 AM
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Or, return your car to stock, sell it, buy a steel frame high mileage c6 and build it up. I think you might come out even if not ahead $ wise, from cage cost, you could wide body the car with fiberglass fenders, and so on.
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Old 12-12-2018, 03:27 AM
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It was brought up in the thread at the time, but I am still curious if the bulkhead mount solution explored here https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...y-on-pics.html would be generally accepted (I don't know if that car was ever raced)
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Old 12-12-2018, 09:49 AM
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That main hoop is not on frame... always been told it has to go to the frame rail to be functional. And wow those entry/exit holes are narrow.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by wtb-z View Post
It was brought up in the thread at the time, but I am still curious if the bulkhead mount solution explored here https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...y-on-pics.html would be generally accepted (I don't know if that car was ever raced)
thanks for the link! ive seen many/most cages with the A pillar rocker box on top of the frame rail, but ive never seen a single cage before that one with a second one near the rear of the door like that. but thats not the box the main hoop sets on. thats the main one im looking for. i didnt see any pics of the main hoop attachment point?

edit i see it now. theyve got a half main hoop. attached the inner body it looks like. kinda like those RPM roll bars that bolt to the sheetmetal over the fuel cross over tube. i dont see that passing tech.
however still neat to see that second door box mount point.

Last edited by STANG KILLA SS; 12-12-2018 at 10:34 AM.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Tool Hoarder View Post

Respectfully that's not their job, nor would they want the liability. Their job is to tell you how to make a cage to their rules. Not how to make it the safest for all materials/chassis types and car types. You're supposed to sleeve the frame and bolt/glue mount plates.
well i disagree, but lets just say the sandwich/threw bolt, or U sleeve method is accepted. what happens if i use 3/16" plate and 1/2" bolts to do it, and i get there and they say sorry we require 1/4" plate and 5/8" bolts? this is why it needs to be spelled out in rules like everything else.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by STANG KILLA SS View Post
well i disagree, but lets just say the sandwich/threw bolt, or U sleeve method is accepted. what happens if i use 3/16" plate and 1/2" bolts to do it, and i get there and they say sorry we require 1/4" plate and 5/8" bolts? this is why it needs to be spelled out in rules like everything else.
They don't specify that... read their cage diagram rules. It specs tube thickness and bar count/bend requirements. It doesn't get into vehicle-specific mounting provisions.

Call some of the Ferrari challenge teams or Lambo Super Trofeo teams and see if someone will tell you how. Maybe those are carbon tub cars though.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:43 AM
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You're in Texas... call Louis at G-speed. He'll probably tell you to get a steel car, but he'd at least be able to point you in the right direction.
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Old 12-12-2018, 12:23 PM
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Checkout Blackbird Fabworx in Southern California. He did beautiful work, visually and structurallly. Bonded and bolted bulkhead plates.
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Old 12-12-2018, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by jimtway View Post
Checkout Blackbird Fabworx in Southern California. He did beautiful work, visually and structurallly. Bonded and bolted bulkhead plates.
Does the stock roof and hatch go back in place?
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