TheDarkKnight

Sure you can. Nearly all of my cone shots are rear wheel impacts on the cones. But it is still a good thing to try.

That said, I got a good tip from a fellow vette autocrosser (who runs at National):

On the road in light to no traffic, put your passenger mirror down to where you can see the rear wheel touching the ground. Get the white line to a couple inches or so away from the tire, and look across the hood to try to pin down where the line is meeting the front of the car while it is close to the tires on the ground. Hope that''s not too unclear. I've tried it and will be reporting results in a few weeks when I can put it to use on a course.

Another good one I got was to turn before the cone in the slalom.

Cheers,

Bill


[Modified by TheDarkKnight, 7:04 AM 6/22/2004]

EPiC Vette

Thanks for this thread.

Strick

WOW!!! I've got the disease and my first auto-X will be this Labor Day Weekend. Here is what I've learned so far: brake pads, get new ones; replace my brake fluid-synthetic? My 92 Vette is stock except for "non power increasing" shortie headers, muffler elims, and I just put in a new clutch. I got my helmet and fire extinquisher. I have a vert. I think I should run with the top up, maybe it's required. I normally run my Dunlop SP 8000s at 32 psi (cold). What preasure is suggested to start at? ASR- run with it off? Oh, they call this a slow (less than 80 mph) auto-X.

This has been an excellent thread. I need all the help I can get. What about chap stick so you don't split a lip from smiling so hard?

Numbers? How do you pick one and how do you put them on your Vette? White shoe polish? Does it go well over Zaino? :o

DriveIt

I am a novice running Autocross/Solo II with my stock 93 Coupe.

I run both NCCC (1STG) and SCCA (AS). A Snell M1995 or newer/better helmet is required, although most groups have loaners. I have worked shifts in the timing van and I know why shoe polish numbers are frowned upon. If the workers can't easily read both the car number and class QUICKLY, you may not get timed. I got re-usable vinyl numbers from ProTapeRacing. So far, they work great. No adhesive residue on the paint. Not as easy to use as magnetics, but there has to be SOME downside to a Vette.

I read in another web site to slide your seat back a couple of inches, tighten your belt, cinch it, then run the seat forward again. I tried it and it works great!

READ THE RULE BOOKS !

Autocrossers are some of the nicest, most helpful people in the world. They will tell you everything you need to know, but please make some effort to learn about the sport and what is required of you and your car.

I have not found on-line rule books for either NCCC or SCCA. You get the NCCC book free with membership in a NCCC-affiliated club. You have to buy a SCCA book on-line.

Get in - Strap in - Gas it - Grin

DriveIt

Strick,

OK, I forgot a few things.

NUMBERS: Pick from 1 to 3 digits that appeal to you. If you register early, you stand a better chance of getting to use your number preference. Be warned, you may be asked to change or shuffle your numbers if someone else has that number in your class.

ASR: Turn it off...as long as you can keep the run smooth without it. If you are having trouble driving smoothly (Squealing, howling tires, sliding sideways etc.) try a run with it on. It can be a great teacher.

SOFT TOP: Don't know, I haven't read the rules on this, but I have seen tops down in SCCA Solo II without roll bars or hoops.

TIRES: I run my 275 Falkens (Don't laugh, please) at 38 psi and don't roll the tires. By the way, 80 MPH is not a slow autocross. My last parking lot race was all under 50 MPH.

Strick

Thanks Terry, I appreciate your tips. About the tire pressures, I read here on the forum that because our C4s tend to run loose, that we should try running higher pressure in the fronts than the rears by about 6 psi to tighten up the Vette. Ever try this?

DriveIt

Strick,

I am an old guy who never learned to drive FWD cars fast. I want the rear end to come out first (oversteer). With both ends at 38 psi, I am really at about neutral handling, with no tire roll-over problems so far. I plan to make some changes for my Labor Day race. I'll probably reduce the front pressure by a pound or two.

My idea is to decrease the PSI until I start getting tire roll-over, then adjust for frt/rear balance. Lower PSI = Bigger contact patch, and I have been told that BIGGER IS BETTER :-}

Strick

Gee, I was told it's all in how you drive it.

I'll start out at even tire pressures and try this tire marking idea for roll over.

DriveIt

Strick,

The shoe polish or chalk marks on the tires will make roll-over easier to see. Even without the marks, a shined tire will look scuffed on the sidewall and an un-shined tire will display a freshly-black ring when it is rolling over. It's kind of scary to see a street tire that has obviously been running on the sidewall.

What Sanctioning Body/Class are you running on Labor Day? I looked at your list of mods and they might put you up with the race-only cars.

Technique or size? My wife says I wouldn't know either way.

Terry

VetteDrmr

Strick,

A couple of answers to questions:

1. Brake pads. Unless they're worn down now, I wouldn't worry about replacing them, or trying to upgrade them. The most important thing now is to learn how to drive, hardware upgrades won't really help right now.

2. Brake fluid. Absolutely flush out all the old gunk and replace with DOT 3/4 fluid. I use Valvoline Synpower, it's pretty good and easy to find. Main thing is to get rid of the old stuff, unless you've flushed the brake system within the last year.

3. Tire pressure. Start out at around 36 psi. Chalk your tires and watch for rollover. If the car feels real greasy, and the chalk marks show the sidewalls aren't rolling over, drop 1-2 psi. Small changes only, though.

4. The chap stick is a good idea; it's easy to get sunburned lips.

HTH, and have a good one,
Mike

Strick

Thanks again guys, I'll try everything out on the 4th of Sep. I'm actually excited about this.

TheDarkKnight

If you want to do your numbers cheap (for now), get some blue painter's tape. Works well. Don't get white, it doesn't stick as well. No residue, no mess, easy removal.

teh show polish (when used) goes on the wndow, not the body. You can also get "window chalk". It's what stores often use for window paintings. Thus, it comes in colors like bright orange, etc. and is thus much more visible than shoe polish.

Now go get as much seat time as you can.

Strick

Just to let you guys know, I had a great time at my first auto-X. My times drastically improved with every run. Everything here on this thread is right on. The most important things I did that helped me the most was: 1) walking the track with an experienced driver. I even took notes. 2) drawing a picture of the course and driving it in your mind visualizing everything. 3) getting everything done (tech inspection, tire pressures, etc) early, so you can sit in your Vette and go over the course in your mind, again. 4) check your EGO at the gate.

As far as numbers go, I used static cling numbers and they stayed on all day and the trip home.


They put me in class II because of my headers. It didn't matter anyway as I was only concerned about my times and driving.

Oh, BTW, I didn't hit a cone all day. Guess I needed to push it a little harder.

DriveIt

Strick,

Glad you had a good time. I got severely whupped by Evos, STis, an Audi TT and even an '84 Vette, but I was grinning ear-to-ear all the time. I even get excited rerunning my in-car video of the race.

Terry

Jason

Great thread guys. Now it's time to check out all those links posted along the way.

I-SPEEED

After reading all of the above i went to my first autox. I placed third and only missed first by .8 seconds! you guys rule!

TheDarkKnight

Just thought I'd make a point about tires. I don't rememebr where I saw it but I saw someone say not to worry about "race" tires until you are consistently within 2 seconds of whomever you are targetting ..err I mean racing against.

After doing this, I agree. I managed to be consistently within 2 seconds of the top guy in ASP (in a prepped 911 on KumHos ... many years experience). Went to KumHo 305/18s on all four and have consistently been ahead of him by 1.5-2 seconds.

I can't emphasize how important tire pressure is. I've seen it make a difference of about 4 seconds for me. Be sure to check as close to your next run as you can ... and be mindful of the sun. I found that on the side with the sun the pressures have varied by as much as 3 pounds.

Besides, you'll need all that pressure learning curve down before figuring out the pressure on competition tires.

When you do make the move to comp tires, set the pressures in the mid thirties, and drive like hell. For me, the grip was so different I thought I'd push it and push it, gradually mind you. Then, a few events ago I said "to heck with it", and went for broke.

O
M
G

One thing I learned after changing to the KumHos, was that I could use the brake AND turn at the same time. Which is a tip for running a C5 on streets. Don't. At least I couldn't do both and get good times.

Oh yes, hand positioning on the steering wheel. I rest my thumbs on the top of the top arm. Our courses are ~38-48 second runs. I tried going to second, but for our courses found that staying in first gave me *much* faster times. Except on *really* tight corners, do not move your hands. It may feel a bit awkward to have the wheel turn 180 degrees w/o shifting your hands, but for me it made my runs more consistent, faster, and I felt I had much better control. Try it. On the street you can practice this. You'll find (in a C5 can't speak for other gens), that you can take 90 degree turns w/o changing hand position.

Another tip. Part of begin close to the cones is knowing where your car is. While not on course, i.e. on the street, but somewhere safe, move your passenger mirror down to where you can see the ground and the side of the car. Now, drive close to the side line and then note where you see it over your hood. Try to pick something out the front view (such as the hood bulges or fender lines) that lines up. With this, you'll be able to use that spot like a targetting sight for passenger side cones. I practice this frequently so I can get an intuitive sense of where the right side is. IIRC, someone told me once that in a slalom, getting one inch closer to the cone is about a tenth of a second faster.

Anyway, just some tips I've learned this year.

JiminVirginia

Great thread. We've covered driving, tires, and tire pressure. But the cheapest fix is commonly said to be a suitably aggressive alignment. I'm thinking autocross here, but would welcome any input on track time, too.

How much camber is available on, say, a 2004 ZO6 (lowered using stock bolts). I'm running Super Stock--so no exotic hardware.

How much toe (front and rear) makes sense? Forget about tire wear. I don't care.

It strikes me from the few events I've done that the car is very tire limited, and I'm thinking Toyo RA1s or the equivalent next year. But since I've been running a stock alignment, I probably don't have a great reading on what tires could do.

Any alignment advice appreciated.

bark3711

Greetings...well, you've got way more HP than you'll need for the typical autox (but Mark Donahue says that when can leave two blacks streaks from the exit of turn to the entrance of the next turn, then you've got JUST enough HP). Your car will most likely be classed in SCCA Street Modified. SCCA does not require rollbars etc. for autox events. NCCC will have a different classing system and may require additional safety equipment. Both have excellent websites that will provide detailed info.

bark3711

Solotime has a large selection of numbers & letters that are backed with a low-tack adhesive. They're cheap, easy to put on & take off, and I've gotten as much as two seasons out of a set.

Bark