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Doing winter projects, one is to clean up & paint the rear carrier, trailing arms, spring ect, replace all the bushings, you know the drill... get rid of the crusty's & make it clean & shiny underneath!
I have read many threads from the past on this, my question being the placement of the liners. As you see, my rear spring has 9 leafs. Starting at the top & going down, i have liners between 1&2, then 2&3, but no liner between 3 & 4, then the rest have liners?
I looked at my assembly manual, and this detail is not in there.
Additionally, what are your thoughts on cleaning mine up & painting it, & putting the new liners on, verses just getting a new spring, which sounds too easy & i dont like to do things the easy way the first time.
By looking at your photo...I see something that as nothing to do with your question(s). You another major problem (in my opinion).
There should be nothing that goes between the rear leaf spring and the rear end cover. So that thick block should not be there and makes be 'suspect' to IF your leaf spring is any good at all in regards to being able to hold up the car as designed.
The spring ...from what I can see...looks to have a decent arch to it....but I think it should have more of an arch when it is un-caged.
Yes, seven liners were used on the nine leaf spring – no liner between the top curved leaf and the bottom flat leaf. Per your numbering, nothing between 3 & 4.
Eaton Corporation (no relation to Eaton Detroit Spring), the original supplier, shipped the assembled spring to St. Louis, so the assembly of the leaves isn’t shown in the AIM.
If your spring still has arch (symmetrical on both sided) and provides the correct ride height (AIM, UPC 4, Sheet B5 - perform the "D" measurement on both sides), there should be no reason why you couldn’t re-use it.
As DUB said, not sure why there's a block installed between the top leaf and the differential rear cover?
Ahh yes, it appears bubba wanted a 1" change in ride height... nothing new to discover bubba's handywork over the 54 years since the car was new!! Looks like 1" steel plate, torched to fit... nice work bubba!
So the arch measures 9" at rest, from the bottom of the center of the spring, to the round bar I had placed between the two ends.
Last edited by Rob_64-365; 02-04-2018 at 07:04 PM.
RE: cleaning and painting. I'm not sure what that gray crud is on the spring leafs now. If they aren't rusty then cleaning them up with a wire wheel on a drill and a fresh coat of light gray would be pretty easy and make it look like new. If that gray is something over rust then you are probably faced with sandblasting them and painting them. If you don't want to get into the sandblast business yourself then you might take them to a shop that does blasting.
Might want to remove the spacer and see how it looks for ride height before investing much in it. You may need a new spring to get a correct ride height. Did it have much curve on the lower leaf with the weight on the suspension? It should have a slight arc in the spring with weight on the suspension.
There is undercoating & paint & dirt on everything under the car, scaling surface rust, & when i hit it with a wire brush & it all falls off and the metal looks good underneath, so i don't think it is too much into the metal, but whatever it needs, I'll get the spring & rear carrier out of there the rest of the way & see how it looks on the bench. It's easy enough to order a new Eaton spring if needed.
Last edited by Rob_64-365; 02-04-2018 at 07:31 PM.
Thank you Bubba!! Looks like there were 2 plates between my spring & rear end housing, one 1" plate, and a second 3/8" thick steel plate. I see my spring is measuring 10 1/4", so that says it is probably still good, but i may just buy a new one anyway.
Thank you Bubba!! Looks like there were 2 plates between my spring & rear end housing, one 1" plate, and a second 3/8" thick steel plate. I see my spring is measuring 10 1/4", so that says it is probably still good, but i may just buy a new one anyway.
When you remove the center bolt and seperate the leaves your path forward may be determined because of rust where you can not see right now.
If it's got good metal I would rather see you restore the original, I see lots of cars that have these reproduction springs and many sit to high. Keep in mind to compare the new center bolt head with the old bolt head, I have seen liner kits where the new center bolt head is to tall and will crack the rear cover when tightened if not ground down.
Also, do some research on the correct length of the four bolts that hold the spring to the rear because you can crack the rear housing using the wrong length bolts and the existing bolts have probably been replaced bbecause of the metal spacers.
Great little winter project just be careful of project creep, try to keep focused on suspension items and safety.
Yes, i have been reading as many previous posts as I can on this whole rear suspension rebuild process, I will make sure my center bolt is clear, and it is clear that these bolts would definitely be too long if i put them in without the 1-3/8" "Bubba spacers" in place, but thank you for the warning on this. I am curious if they were trying to lower the car? I see the strut rod is also bent on the passenger side, so I will be replacing those as well.
Last edited by Rob_64-365; 02-07-2018 at 09:14 AM.
Yes, i have been reading as many previous posts as I can on this whole rear suspension rebuild process, I will make sure my center bolt is clear, and it is clear that these bolts would definitely be too long if i put them in without the 1-3/8" "Bubba spacers" in place, but thank you for the warning on this. I am curious if they were trying to lower the car? I see the strut rod is also bent on the passenger side, so I will be replacing those as well.
The spacers would make the car sit higher.
The bent strut rod is because the adjusting bolt assembly may be rusted and the rod was bent to set rear camber.
Check the strut rods and free them up plus you may want to install new bushings and straighten the bent rod, it will be fine. A nice size vise is all you need to press out and install the new bushings, keep the original small 1 1/4" bushing size strut. I think late sixties the bushing size was made larger probably because tires got bigger.
The position of the concentric bolts for the strut rods where they are bolted to the bracket....that is bolted to the underside of the rear differential will tell us a lot.
IF you look from the rear of the car looking forward...and you can see the concentric bolt. You will see how how when this bolt is turned...it will either draw in or push out the strut rod.
SO,,,IF the head of the bolt or the nut of the concentric bolt that you can see from the rear of the car ...ON THE DRIVERS SIDE is at the 9 o'clock position...that is telling you that the strut rod is IN as far as it can go. And when the strut rod gets pulled IN...it makes the tire/wheel stand up straight...in case it was actually leaning inwards at the top.
On the PASSENGER SIDE...the head or nut of the concentric bolts will be at the 3 o'clock position.
SO...if your strut rods concentric bolts are in these positions...you and no ability to get the wheel/tire to stand up IF it is leaning in at the top.
YES...bad bushings can cause this...BUT..they will not correct the other possible problem...if it is bad enough
From what I have found to be more of the major problem is that the side yokes are worn down badly and the concentric bolts now are 'out of range' of being able to adjust correctly.
IF you plan on putting in new strut rods. If you are not worried about judging....I would highly advise putting in greaseable heim/spherical jointed adjustable strut rods. But if you do this to not repair the worn side yokes. That may be a mistake. Your side yokes should not have very much end play at all...and leaving worn side yokes in your differential can cause for other damage to occur in time depending on how much it is driven.
I am not concerned about judging at all, and plan on replacing everything back there with new, I am looking at the Corvette Central full rebuild kit, bolts, bushings, radios rods, concentric bolts, then a rear spring, and having the rear carrier stripped down & rebuilt, which is a 67 AM 3:70 Posi, and here is the pic for you. All of the bushing in everything are shot back there.
If you replace your spring make sure your spring thickness is the same. I ordered a new spring from Ecklers and my original bolts were not long enough to secure to the differential. Their fix was longer bolts. My fix was returning the spring.
Last edited by Dave Tracy; 02-08-2018 at 07:12 PM.
Reason: typo
Yes, my all of my bolts/nuts will be replaced in the Corvette central full rear suspension kit, the ones that were in my car are definitely too long. The good news is, this will all go together much easier than the years of being locked together are letting me take them apart!
Last edited by Rob_64-365; 02-08-2018 at 08:09 PM.
And that is your choice and it can depend on how much you plan on driving the car and how you plan on driving it. If this is going to be cruiser and not driven that much...then putting in rubber or urethane will last for a good while HOPING that the rubber and polyurethane do not disintegrate like they have been know to do.
If you are going to be driving with with a bit of 'spirit'...then possibly installing the grease-able spherical heim joined ones that are adjustable might be the way to go.
IF you choose to use adjustable polyurethane or the adjustable heim jointed strut rods assemblies. Welding will need to take place on the bracket they they are mounted to. And where this welding should be done is where the plates that are spot welded on the bracket that allow the round concentric washer to fit into it. I weld at the curved edges of these plates...and need to be welded in much better and that way you are not relying on the spot welds. So a total of eight welds ( two welds per plate) would do it.
Thanks for all the insight on this DUB, I plan on going with rubber bushings, I don't do much spirited driving, just enough to wind thru a few gears on a straight away, there are no twisty roads around me... lol. I have a dial gage & I'll check the end play, just to know where it is before. Engineer brain, gotta know...
Last edited by Rob_64-365; 02-08-2018 at 08:18 PM.
And that is your choice and it can depend on how much you plan on driving the car and how you plan on driving it. If this is going to be cruiser and not driven that much...then putting in rubber or urethane will last for a good while HOPING that the rubber and polyurethane do not disintegrate like they have been know to do.
If you are going to be driving with with a bit of 'spirit'...then possibly installing the grease-able spherical heim joined ones that are adjustable might be the way to go.
IF you choose to use adjustable polyurethane or the adjustable heim jointed strut rods assemblies. Welding will need to take place on the bracket they they are mounted to. And where this welding should be done is where the plates that are spot welded on the bracket that allow the round concentric washer to fit into it. I weld at the curved edges of these plates...and need to be welded in much better and that way you are not relying on the spot welds. So a total of eight welds ( two welds per plate) would do it.
DUB
Can't use polyurethane bushings in strut rods. See discussion in link below.
02-04-2018, 06:22 PM
64 Rear Spring - 9 leaf - liners question
