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thats exactly what my guy told me last night when i talked to him , whats the proper way to wire that resistor if i replace the ballasted coil ? Feed the pink in one end of resistor and run a wire back to the pos terminal from the other end ? what value resistor do i need or are they all the same ?
You don't use a ballast resistor if you have electronic ignition.
You don't use a ballast resistor if you have electronic ignition.
Not necessarily.
The std GM coil is a 6V coil, the ballast lets it operate on 12V without overheating.
Many electronic ignitions are simply breaker point replacements, thats all they do, replace the points, they have nothing to do with the coil, and they do not require special 12V coils. If you use 12V coil, you do remove the balast
Doug
I skipped all the way to the end and didn't reed all the posts. does sound like heat is the demon. I had very few coils go out when I was a daily mechanic, BUT there was one that did what you say. All I had to do was lift the hood and wait and it would start. It also was hot. I found a small dent on the coil that grounded it out when it expanded with heat. That one I threw away but kept all the others that I was told to change and they are good to this day. Also had the same symptoms on a dodge that had a spade connector with about 5 wires (# 14) and one # 10 wire. The # 10 was the main ignition and relay wire. It had a high resistance connection and the pin would get the female side to expand with the bad connection, grow larger than the pin, and loose contact. Again once it cooled it would start and run for a while. Found that by touching the wires and felt a hot one. Further investigation showed the plastic on the connector was burned a bit. I by passed that and had to change all on display and every one that came in under warrantee.
Just a shot in the dark, but you can never tell.
I've had ignition modules fail with high heat, and work fine after cool down. Same with fuel systems. You need to squirt some fuel down the carb next time it dies and see if it runs. If it doesn't, check for spark. If no spark, another vote for going back to stock points ignition, which is impervious to high temps. YMMV....
ok heres the latest , i took off the splash pans , wired open the exhaust flapper on the passenger side header, took the fuel filter off the intake manifold and swung it around so it was in front of the oil filler tube not touching anything hot , adjusted the fuel line from frame to fuel pump cause it had a little flatness to it , took her for a good run came back , no start fuel filter just as hot as before , waited ten minutes and it fired right off . Its hot and humid here and im as hot as the engine so its time to visit my old pal jim beam and his pal amstel , tomorrow is another day. Thanks for all the help
Sorry I cant remember the nuances of my 327/365...but I ran into a problem with it starting and I think it was when it was hot....pulled the carb apart and the little ball check in the accelerator pump circuit found a way to get dislodged...so we put it back in and sure enough very shortly it became dislodged again. GRRRR....took it back apart and this time staked it in place so that it coudnt drop out....never a problem again. if that check ball isnt in place...ugh!
Thought I would add my 2 cents in since you were getting all kinds of help...
Mine used to do the same thing, but was caused by two different problems.
1. Fuel Pump pin came out. Some fuel would pump, but not enough for a highway cruise. Carb would run dry.
2 Worn out ignition switch. Car would die, not start for a while, then start right up after a tow. (took 2 years to figure that one out).
ok heres the latest , i took off the splash pans , wired open the exhaust flapper on the passenger side header, took the fuel filter off the intake manifold and swung it around so it was in front of the oil filler tube not touching anything hot , adjusted the fuel line from frame to fuel pump cause it had a little flatness to it , took her for a good run came back , no start fuel filter just as hot as before , waited ten minutes and it fired right off . Its hot and humid here and im as hot as the engine so its time to visit my old pal jim beam and his pal amstel , tomorrow is another day. Thanks for all the help
What is the ambient temp when all of this occurs? It sounds like heat soak/percolation to me. read this
Both vapor lock and heat soak have been mentioned in this thread. They are two different things with different fixes.
Heat soak/perc is usually a product of the ethanol in our gas today which has a WORST blend in the winter. If you have ethanol free gas available and use it it usually goes away. If not, a phenolic spacer between the intake and manifold along with other trick to eliminate heat at the manifolds that can be found in this thread: https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...el-percolation
If it is heat soak/perc the start procedure that works for me is to turn the engine over about three revolutions WITHOUT touching the gas pedal, then depress the gas pedal 1/3 of the way until it starts. You will have to rev/feather the gas as it will be running rough for quite some time and in fact will usually stall again in a few hundred feet.
We did not have ethanol in our fuel in AZ. until the early 2000s as I recall. I did not start to notice percolation problems until that time. I did not understand what it was until later and could not understand why the usual fix for vapor lock did not fix it. On my recent Rt. 66 trip (from Chicago to AZ. in my 1965 with no carb spacer) I experienced heat soak and perc at every fuel stop until I got to the states with no ethanol fuel and then BINGO, it all went away with the same ambient temps. When I was not able to buy ethanol free gas it came right back.
BTW, my 1965 is a completely stock car with 76K original miles.
Vapor lock can usually be prevented with some of the following or combinations of all. Vapor lock is cured with electric fuel pump located as close to the tank as possible with fuel lines in stock locations and eliminating the mechanical pump (heat sink,) also a fuel return line can work on it’s own or in conjunction with the electric fuel pump. Also try to make sure your fuel lines are routed away from heat sources.
What is the ambient temp when all of this occurs? It sounds like heat soak/percolation to me. read this
Both vapor lock and heat soak have been mentioned in this thread. They are two different things with different fixes.
Heat soak/perc is usually a product of the ethanol in our gas today which has a WORST blend in the winter. If you have ethanol free gas available and use it it usually goes away. If not, a phenolic spacer between the intake and manifold along with other trick to eliminate heat at the manifolds that can be found in this thread: https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...el-percolation
If it is heat soak/perc the start procedure that works for me is to turn the engine over about three revolutions WITHOUT touching the gas pedal, then depress the gas pedal 1/3 of the way until it starts. You will have to rev/feather the gas as it will be running rough for quite some time and in fact will usually stall again in a few hundred feet.
We did not have ethanol in our fuel in AZ. until the early 2000s as I recall. I did not start to notice percolation problems until that time. I did not understand what it was until later and could not understand why the usual fix for vapor lock did not fix it. On my recent Rt. 66 trip (from Chicago to AZ. in my 1965 with no carb spacer) I experienced heat soak and perc at every fuel stop until I got to the states with no ethanol fuel and then BINGO, it all went away with the same ambient temps. When I was not able to buy ethanol free gas it came right back.
BTW, my 1965 is a completely stock car with 76K original miles.
Vapor lock can usually be prevented with some of the following or combinations of all. Vapor lock is cured with electric fuel pump located as close to the tank as possible with fuel lines in stock locations and eliminating the mechanical pump (heat sink,) also a fuel return line can work on it’s own or in conjunction with the electric fuel pump. Also try to make sure your fuel lines are routed away from heat sources.
its been hot as hell with high humidity 80's and 90's
I've actually made a few in the past myself. Just make a cardboard template that fits around any linkage or fittings on the carb/intake and when you're happy transfer it to the aluminum and cut/trim to match. Some folks consider them a band-aide, but they were used a lot back in the day on many cars to keep cooler fuel in the carb.
Good luck... GUSTO
Im gonna pick up a heat gun today i wanna see how hot this thing is getting also , i wil post up what i find thanks for the help, i do have a mallory set up in the dist , there have been so many hands on this i have no idea whats beeen wired right or wrong , i tried to get at the module yesterday to get a replacement but once i got the rotor off i couldnt figure out how to pull the rest of it off the top of the module , are there special tools needed ?
If it were my car , I would temporarily restore to a standard oem set up (coil, ballast, points...why not) so as to eliminate all sorts of parasite problem origins and guesswork. Most of those components are cheap, cheaper than replacing an MSD or equivalent. Then go through a retuning of timing and carb (those influence temperature) . And then see how the start problem behaves.
If it were my car , I would temporarily restore to a standard oem set up (coil, ballast, points...why not) so as to eliminate all sorts of parasite problem origins and guesswork. Most of those components are cheap, cheaper than replacing an MSD or equivalent. Then go through a retuning of timing and carb (those influence temperature) . And then see how the start problem behaves.
dont really now how to get that done without using mechanic , i tried to get at the module the other day to replace it but couldnt get at it ,so to go to all the expense of getting the mech on board , tying up the car and buying the original parts it may be even more expensive .Im gonna try everything i can to remedy or at least diagnose the problem before i give it to the mechanic
I put my new crate motor in last year and added an electronic ignition and it initially did not run great...
The ballast resistor defeats the purpose of running electronic ignition by limiting available power. Bypass it and report back.
Good luck
This is simply not true. As I posted back on the first page, you have to ensure you use the complete and correct configuration to ensure your ignition works properly and lasts. Pasted below is the first paragraph from the instructions for a Mallory ignition module that I linked:
IMPORTANT: Before installing the E-SparkTM Ignition System, make sure that your vehicle is equipped with an ignition ballast resistor (or loom resistance wire) in the wire between the ignition switch and the coil (+) terminal. One easy way to find the ignition ballast resistor is to check the service manual for your vehicle. You can test your stock ignition system voltage while the engine is at idle at the coil (+) terminal. If the measured voltage is within 1-volt of battery voltage, an ignition ballast resistor must be installed in the wire from the ignition switch. In general, all vehicles equipped with the Delco point ignition were equipped with an ignition ballast resistor. If you find your vehicle is not equipped with an ignition ballast resistor, install a Mallory Ignition Ballast Resistor Part No. 700 in series in the wire from the ignition switch. Failure to use an ignition ballast resistor will result in the eventual destruction of the E-SparkTM Ignition Module.
Exceptions: 1)UsingoneofMallory's3speciallymatchedco ilseliminatetheneedforaballastresistoror aresistancewire.Thesecoilsare:29219-Chrome Canister Coil, 30450 PROMASTER e Coil and 29450 PROMASTER Classic Coil.
2) If your vehicle is equipped with a HyFire Electronic Ignition Control or similar aftermarket ignition control, use the wiring specified for the particular controller, along with its matching coil, such as Mallory's 29440 or 30440.
Blanket statements simply based on your specific experience without knowledge of the components installed are not helpful.
This is simply not true. As I posted back on the first page, you have to ensure you use the complete and correct configuration to ensure your ignition works properly and lasts. Pasted below is the first paragraph from the instructions for a Mallory ignition module that I linked:
the car did have the resistor at one point and was replaced with a ballasted coil , i figured it was the resistor giving me the grief so we put in the ballasted coil and all was good till now . I dont know how old that module in the car is ,so it may be time to replace it i got the cap off and removed the rotor but under the rotor is some kinda mechanical marvel sitting on top of the module preventing me from getting at the screws holding the module in place . So im stuck as far as trying different things on my own and will have to get it back to the shop at this point
08-17-2018, 12:58 PM
