Stuck Kingpins - CorvetteForum - Chevrolet Corvette Forum Discussion

Notices
C1 & C2 Corvettes General C1 Corvette & C2 Corvette Discussion, Technical Info, Performance Upgrades, Project Builds, Restorations

Stuck Kingpins

Old 12-09-2018, 09:00 PM
  #1  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default Stuck Kingpins

I'm rebuilding the front suspension on my 57 and the kingpin on the drivers side is stuck and I don't want to force it until I make sure that it just drives out without heat etc . I removed the caps and "C" clips and the center pin and tried to drive it out and it won't budge . I understand from some articles that I have read that they should just float in the bore and should just drive out . I haven't started tearing down the passenger side yet so I don't know if it will be the same . Any thoughts ?

Last edited by bj1k; 12-09-2018 at 09:01 PM.
bj1k is offline  
Old 12-09-2018, 09:59 PM
  #2  
Hermn59
CF Senior Member
Support Corvetteforum!
 
Hermn59's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 2017
Location: Largo FL
Posts: 287
Thanked 89 Times in 61 Posts
Default

BJ,

Here is an article by Tom Parsons (DZAuto). Hopefully he will chime in with some advice.

Barry
Attached Images
Hermn59 is offline  
Old 12-09-2018, 10:49 PM
  #3  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Hermn59 View Post
BJ,

Here is an article by Tom Parsons (DZAuto). Hopefully he will chime in with some advice.

Barry
Hi Barry , That is one of the articles that I went through but none of the articles mentioned anything about it being a problem to remove the kingpins . I understand that they should almost fall out when the clips and center pin are removed . I just don't want to force it until I am sure . Thanks Barry . How is the power steering conversion going ?

Last edited by bj1k; 12-09-2018 at 10:50 PM.
bj1k is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 11:10 AM
  #4  
CaptainEgg
CF Member
 
Member Since: Sep 2004
Posts: 63
Thanks: 0
Thanked 5 Times in 5 Posts
Default

Just to be sure, by center pin you mean the bolt that goes thru the center of the spindle and locks the king pin in? Have you tried driving out both directions?
CaptainEgg is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 11:36 AM
  #5  
DZAUTO
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Mar 2001
Location: Mustang OK
Posts: 11,006
Thanked 798 Times in 460 Posts
2015 C1 of the Year Finalist
Default

Originally Posted by bj1k View Post
I'm rebuilding the front suspension on my 57 and the kingpin on the drivers side is stuck and I don't want to force it until I make sure that it just drives out without heat etc . I removed the caps and "C" clips and the center pin and tried to drive it out and it won't budge . I understand from some articles that I have read that they should just float in the bore and should just drive out . I haven't started tearing down the passenger side yet so I don't know if it will be the same . Any thoughts ?
BJ,
I would not call this problem common, BUUUUUUUUUUT, it does happen. And the specific reason for a kingpin refusing to slide out (YES, just slide out) is because a previous owner(s) DID NOT keep it adequately greased!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thus, the result is somewhere between a kingpin that is slightly difficult to remove, OR, completely seized!
First thing to try, with the caps, clips and lock bolt removed, is to use a fairly heavy punch or a drift and drive it out (or attempt to drive it out). If you like, you can also use an old socket (that you don't mind damaging) which is just a tiny bit smaller than the diameter of the kingpin. Once the king pin is out (assuming you get it out with this method) then again, use a socket that is slightly smaller than the diameter of the bushings to drive them out.
If the above fails to remove the kingpin, then the next step is to remove the spindle support from the upper and lower A-frames. Carefully position it in a press and press out the kingpin and then press out the bushings.
Once the kingpin and bushings are removed, I cannot emphasize enough to THOROUGHLY clean the bores in the spindle (NOT the spindle support, you do not want the new kingpin to be sloppy in the knuckle of the spindle support). I have VERY, VERY, VERY LIGHTLY honed the bushing bores using a wheel cylinder hone in an AIR powered drill, with it emersed in water. Just hone, test fit a bushing, hone, test fit, hone, test fit, until the bushing just barely slides through the bore with light lubrication.






Here is what the bushing end of a used kingpin SHOULD look like when kept well greased.



Here is what kingpins can look like when not kept greased and have become rusted and seized in the bushings!!!


Let me know if you have more questions.
DZAUTO is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to DZAUTO For This Useful Post:
bj1k (12-10-2018)
Old 12-10-2018, 01:01 PM
  #6  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by DZAUTO View Post
BJ,
I would not call this problem common, BUUUUUUUUUUT, it does happen. And the specific reason for a kingpin refusing to slide out (YES, just slide out) is because a previous owner(s) DID NOT keep it adequately greased!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thus, the result is somewhere between a kingpin that is slightly difficult to remove, OR, completely seized!
First thing to try, with the caps, clips and lock bolt removed, is to use a fairly heavy punch or a drift and drive it out (or attempt to drive it out). If you like, you can also use an old socket (that you don't mind damaging) which is just a tiny bit smaller than the diameter of the kingpin. Once the king pin is out (assuming you get it out with this method) then again, use a socket that is slightly smaller than the diameter of the bushings to drive them out.
If the above fails to remove the kingpin, then the next step is to remove the spindle support from the upper and lower A-frames. Carefully position it in a press and press out the kingpin and then press out the bushings.
Once the kingpin and bushings are removed, I cannot emphasize enough to THOROUGHLY clean the bores in the spindle (NOT the spindle support, you do not want the new kingpin to be sloppy in the knuckle of the spindle support). I have VERY, VERY, VERY LIGHTLY honed the bushing bores using a wheel cylinder hone in an AIR powered drill, with it emersed in water. Just hone, test fit a bushing, hone, test fit, hone, test fit, until the bushing just barely slides through the bore with light lubrication.






Here is what the bushing end of a used kingpin SHOULD look like when kept well greased.



Here is what kingpins can look like when not kept greased and have become rusted and seized in the bushings!!!


Let me know if you have more questions.
Tom , Thanks for chiming in on this subject . I was hoping that you would respond because it was one of your posts that I checked out but there was no mention of having a problem removing the kingpins . I already had the spindle out and in a vice when trying to drive the pin out . When that failed I put it in my shop press and gently pressed on the pin , still no movement . I was concerned about bending or cracking the spindle if I forced it too much . The one question that I do have is " will it hurt the spindle to apply a little heat ? " Thanks Again

bj1k is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 01:09 PM
  #7  
DZAUTO
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Mar 2001
Location: Mustang OK
Posts: 11,006
Thanked 798 Times in 460 Posts
2015 C1 of the Year Finalist
Default

You can apply some heat evenly around the bores for the bushings. But your best bet is to use a press. Try to get some kind of lubricant into each end of the kingpin/bushings.
DZAUTO is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to DZAUTO For This Useful Post:
bj1k (12-10-2018)
Old 12-10-2018, 01:11 PM
  #8  
ettev
CF Senior Member
 
ettev's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2000
Location: Pottsville, PA
Posts: 1,244
Thanked 8 Times in 2 Posts
Default




One was so badly seized in one of mine we had to cut it apart to drive it out.
ettev is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 01:13 PM
  #9  
AZDoug
CF Senior Member
 
AZDoug's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 2005
Location: Camp Verde AZ
Posts: 10,267
Thanked 430 Times in 334 Posts
2017 C1 of Year Finalist
Default

Yes, use some sort of penetrating oil, Kroil, etc everywhere there is places that it can seep into the kingpin bore. Acetone mixed with ATF about 50/50 will work in a pinch if you have both available.
Doug
AZDoug is online now  
Old 12-10-2018, 01:17 PM
  #10  
AZDoug
CF Senior Member
 
AZDoug's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 2005
Location: Camp Verde AZ
Posts: 10,267
Thanked 430 Times in 334 Posts
2017 C1 of Year Finalist
Default

Tell me how you were able to get to the KP to cut it apart without destroying the spindle or support. Blow out the bearing first?
Doug

Originally Posted by ettev View Post



One was so badly seized in one of mine we had to cut it apart to drive it out.
AZDoug is online now  
Old 12-10-2018, 01:35 PM
  #11  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by DZAUTO View Post
You can apply some heat evenly around the bores for the bushings. But your best bet is to use a press. Try to get some kind of lubricant into each end of the kingpin/bushings.
Thanks , I will give it another try today .

bj1k is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 03:03 PM
  #12  
jimh_1962
CF Senior Member
 
jimh_1962's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2004
Location: Norcal CA
Posts: 5,901
Thanked 269 Times in 247 Posts
2018 C1 of Year Finalist
Default

One set I had went through a fire. The king pin would not come out even with using a 20 ton press at a semi truck shop. The guy felt so bad that he did not charge me for the work. The kingpin was torched and still stuck. Luckily, I had another set of spindles and brackets. I kept the part as a fun thing to leave on the shelf. Completely amazing how seized the king pin was into the spindle bracket.
jimh_1962 is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 10:24 PM
  #13  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by jimh_1962 View Post
One set I had went through a fire. The king pin would not come out even with using a 20 ton press at a semi truck shop. The guy felt so bad that he did not charge me for the work. The kingpin was torched and still stuck. Luckily, I had another set of spindles and brackets. I kept the part as a fun thing to leave on the shelf. Completely amazing how seized the king pin was into the spindle bracket.
I had both spindles out today and put them in a 20 ton press and couldn't get them to move so I took them to two different shops and they both said that they no longer had the reamers to do the job. What would the reamers be for ? I thought it just required changing the bronze bushings and kingpins .

bj1k is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 10:52 PM
  #14  
Dan Hampton
CF Senior Member
 
Dan Hampton's Avatar
 
Member Since: Sep 2008
Location: Menomonie Wisconsin
Posts: 3,041
Thanked 116 Times in 83 Posts
2018 C1 of Year Finalist
Default

Has anyone tried a power hammer? Vibration works wonders.
Dan Hampton is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 11:04 PM
  #15  
DZAUTO
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Mar 2001
Location: Mustang OK
Posts: 11,006
Thanked 798 Times in 460 Posts
2015 C1 of the Year Finalist
Default

Originally Posted by bj1k View Post
I had both spindles out today and put them in a 20 ton press and couldn't get them to move so I took them to two different shops and they both said that they no longer had the reamers to do the job. What would the reamers be for ? I thought it just required changing the bronze bushings and kingpins .
NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, DON'T LET SOMEONE TOUCH THE SPINDLE BORES OR THE BORE IN THE SPINDLE SUPPORT KNUCKLE WITH A REAMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, DON'T LET THEM TOUCH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

The bushings AND the kingpins are floating. If the bushing bores in the spindles are reamed, then the bushings will be sloppy loose!!!
With a clean, smooth bore, and some light lubrication, a new bushing should slide through the bore with MINIMAL, I mean MINIMAL finger pressure.
One end of the bushing has a groove around it, and a hole in the groove. The bushing is installed with the groove inline with the grease fitting, and the hole in the groove OPPOSITE, repeat, OPPOSITE the grease fitting hole. When greased, the grease goes into and around the groove, then into the hole on the opposite side and then into the spiral groove on the INSIDE of the bushing. Thus, grease is supposed to be forced around the bushing, between the outside of the bushing and the inside of the bushing bore in the spindle.
Also, as grease enters the hole in the bushing, it then goes inside the bushing between the bushing and the kingpin. When greasing these kingpin frontends, it is important to grease, rotate the wheel/spindle assembly back and forth (to work grease into all areas of the bore/bushing/kingpin, and then grease some more.
Greasing these old frontends is a messy job at best (have LOTS of rags handy!!!!!), but thorough greasing every single joint will assure long life!!!!!!!!!!
I CANNOT EMPHASIZE ANY OF THE ABOVE ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!
DZAUTO is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to DZAUTO For This Useful Post:
bbison (12-13-2018), davekp78 (12-11-2018)
Old 12-10-2018, 11:05 PM
  #16  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Dan Hampton View Post
Has anyone tried a power hammer? Vibration works wonders.
I thought of doing that but scared to mushroom the end making it tighter . I'm thinking about taking it in the morning to a local truck garage that changes a lot of kingpins to see if they can get them out .

bj1k is offline  
Old 12-10-2018, 11:14 PM
  #17  
bj1k
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
bj1k's Avatar
 
Member Since: May 2006
Location: Pittsburgh suburbs (Cabot ) Pa.
Posts: 5,195
Thanked 220 Times in 192 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by DZAUTO View Post
NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, DON'T LET SOMEONE TOUCH THE SPINDLE BORES OR THE BORE IN THE SPINDLE SUPPORT KNUCKLE WITH A REAMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, DON'T LET THEM TOUCH IT!!!!!!!!!!!!

The bushings AND the kingpins are floating. If the bushing bores in the spindles are reamed, then the bushings will be sloppy loose!!!
With a clean, smooth bore, and some light lubrication, a new bushing should slide through the bore with MINIMAL, I mean MINIMAL finger pressure.
One end of the bushing has a groove around it, and a hole in the groove. The bushing is installed with the groove inline with the grease fitting, and the hole in the groove OPPOSITE, repeat, OPPOSITE the grease fitting hole. When greased, the grease goes into and around the groove, then into the hole on the opposite side and then into the spiral groove on the INSIDE of the bushing. Thus, grease is supposed to be forced around the bushing, between the outside of the bushing and the inside of the bushing bore in the spindle.
Also, as grease enters the hole in the bushing, it then goes inside the bushing between the bushing and the kingpin. When greasing these kingpin frontends, it is important to grease, rotate the wheel/spindle assembly back and forth (to work grease into all areas of the bore/bushing/kingpin, and then grease some more.
Greasing these old frontends is a messy job at best (have LOTS of rags handy!!!!!), but thorough greasing every single joint will assure long life!!!!!!!!!!
I CANNOT EMPHASIZE ANY OF THE ABOVE ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks Tom . I agree with everything you said . When I heard reamer I thought these guys haven't done this before because everything that I have read everything is supposed to float in the opening so I just need someone to get it apart . The local truck garage hopefully has that experience . Too bad you don't live closer. I will keep you posted . BJ

bj1k is offline  
Old 12-11-2018, 11:32 AM
  #18  
jimh_1962
CF Senior Member
 
jimh_1962's Avatar
 
Member Since: Feb 2004
Location: Norcal CA
Posts: 5,901
Thanked 269 Times in 247 Posts
2018 C1 of Year Finalist
Default

Originally Posted by bj1k View Post
I had both spindles out today and put them in a 20 ton press and couldn't get them to move so I took them to two different shops and they both said that they no longer had the reamers to do the job. What would the reamers be for ? I thought it just required changing the bronze bushings and kingpins .
Yeah this one they tried with a 20 ton press then took it to the next biggest press they had. This was a semi truck/ heavy equipment shop. The guy looked defeated when he handed back the parts to me. I looked at him and said it was fine I had another set. The funny thing was Joe Frankenstein58 sold me the part. Afterwards, he mentioned there was a "fire".
jimh_1962 is offline  
Old 12-12-2018, 01:49 PM
  #19  
Bill Pilon
CF Senior Member
 
Bill Pilon's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jun 2005
Location: Hinesville, GA & Oswego, NY
Posts: 519
Thanked 65 Times in 49 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by bj1k View Post
I had both spindles out today and put them in a 20 ton press and couldn't get them to move so I took them to two different shops and they both said that they no longer had the reamers to do the job. What would the reamers be for ? I thought it just required changing the bronze bushings and kingpins .
The Chevrolet does not requiring reaming because they used floating bushings, however most vehicles with king pin front ends used pressed in bushings that had to be fitted to the king pin. I have a Sunnen rod machine that I use for wrist pin bushings and king pin bushings and wheel cylinders, as well as resizing connecting rods.

Bill
Bill Pilon is offline  
Old 12-12-2018, 02:06 PM
  #20  
wstafford
Junior Member
 
Member Since: Aug 2018
Posts: 31
Thanks: 0
Thanked 8 Times in 4 Posts
Default

Don't be afraid to use a torch and heat it. Turn it red and get ready to frail the hell out of it. You can get it that way, the heat won't hurt it at all. Use as heavy of a hammer that you can swing in there and have a brave sidekick hold your drift pin for you.
Good luck, Stafford
wstafford is online now  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: Stuck Kingpins


Sponsored Ads
Vendor Directory

Contact Us About Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

© 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: