Notices
C1 & C2 Corvettes General C1 Corvette & C2 Corvette Discussion, Technical Info, Performance Upgrades, Project Builds, Restorations
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Replacing clutch 1963 fuelie

 
Old 06-16-2019, 07:09 PM
  #41  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default


the throwout bearing was making noise. What could have caused the gashes?
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-16-2019, 07:32 PM
  #42  
MikeM
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Mar 2003
Location: Greenville, Indiana
Posts: 23,041
Received 932 Likes on 788 Posts
Default

The front bearing retainer looks worn out. What gashes are you talking about?
MikeM is online now  
Old 06-16-2019, 08:53 PM
  #43  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
The front bearing retainer looks worn out. What gashes are you talking about?
the edges of the throwout bearing in the picture above. There are two equal "gashed" spots across from each other.
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-16-2019, 08:56 PM
  #44  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

making progress!!


rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-16-2019, 09:19 PM
  #45  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

any recommendations on a clutch kit. This ia available at rock auto
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...324460&jsn=473
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 09:21 AM
  #46  
tbarb
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: May 2014
Posts: 2,477
Received 283 Likes on 264 Posts
Default

The clutch fork is not installed in the bearing correctly, there should not be any damage like that on the T/O bearing. Outside of the noise from the bearing did the clutch work ok?

You may only need a new bearing and fork, something's not right there.
tbarb is online now  
Old 06-17-2019, 09:31 AM
  #47  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Originally Posted by tbarb View Post
The clutch fork is not installed in the bearing correctly, there should not be any damage like that on the T/O bearing. Outside of the noise from the bearing did the clutch work ok?

You may only need a new bearing and fork, something's not right there.
Thanks Tbarb, the TO bearing was making noise and there was a large vibration at around 4000 RPM. So I wanted to check clutch system and pilot bearing. After tearing it down you can see a bit of damage on the TO. I also notice some play in the end shaft of the tranny. I can move the splined shaft up and down a few millimeters. I am not a transmission expert but any shaft movement doesn't seem normal. I can post a video this evening when I get home from work. Could that be causing the vibration? The clutch disc has plenty of material left on it. Pilot bearing looks ok. Flywheel looks good. Pressure plate has a few marks on it. I'll post a photo of that tonight.
Thanks again.
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 10:13 AM
  #48  
tbarb
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: May 2014
Posts: 2,477
Received 283 Likes on 264 Posts
Default

The transmission input shaft is held in position by the pilot bushing but the bearing in the front could be bad. Also, (inside the transmission) the main shaft has a pilot on the end and that slips inside the input shaft with a roller bearing. In another life I had a F700 dump truck with a Spicer transmission that the input shaft surface inside where that roller bearing and main shaft mate was wore causing a vibration at speed. I am not saying that's your issue as only a tear down will show.

I am not a transmission expert but call Larry at D&L transmission, he may have some advice to guide you. You are doing right checking everything including flywheel run out while it's apart.
tbarb is online now  
Old 06-17-2019, 10:56 AM
  #49  
Powershift
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Apr 2005
Location: Luling Louisiana
Posts: 7,326
Received 683 Likes on 617 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by rscone11 View Post
any recommendations on a clutch kit. This ia available at rock auto
https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...324460&jsn=473

Read Lars' technical discussion about clutches and pressure plates. It was discussed on here (C2 Forum) many times. Any clutch and PP requires some checks before installation to ensure success. Other items to make the job/installation easier are a couple of transmission to bell housing alignment pins and a cut-off transmission input shaft from an old transmission. You can do without both, but it really makes the job harder if you do not have.

Larry
Powershift is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 12:00 PM
  #50  
MikeM
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Mar 2003
Location: Greenville, Indiana
Posts: 23,041
Received 932 Likes on 788 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by rscone11 View Post

I also notice some play in the end shaft of the tranny. I can move the splined shaft up and down a few millimeters. I am not a transmission expert but any shaft movement doesn't seem normal.
Thanks again.
Some lateral play is normal. How much, I can't tell you. I never measured it. 2 MM doesn't sound too bad. The input shaft nose should fit fairly snug in the pilot bushing. If it doesn't, that can allow your clutch disc to run in an eccentric motion and vibrate.
MikeM is online now  
Old 06-17-2019, 12:37 PM
  #51  
Powershift
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Apr 2005
Location: Luling Louisiana
Posts: 7,326
Received 683 Likes on 617 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
Some lateral play is normal. How much, I can't tell you. I never measured it. 2 MM doesn't sound too bad. The input shaft nose should fit fairly snug in the pilot bushing. If it doesn't, that can allow your clutch disc to run in an eccentric motion and vibrate.
How about giving the man some measurable number.

I think about 0.002 to 0.004 inches is a good "ballpark" clearance between input shaft nose and pilot bushrng (after it is installed.....which can reduce the ID a small amount). If a true Oillite pilot bushing is used, it will also wear in as needed when driving.

If OP installs a new bushing, he needs to make sure of his ID and OD clearances/ interference fit and use the correct install tool. Just a little lagniappe

Larry

Last edited by Powershift; 06-17-2019 at 12:37 PM.
Powershift is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 01:35 PM
  #52  
DansYellow66
CF Senior Member
 
DansYellow66's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 2003
Location: Central Arkansas
Posts: 10,940
Received 739 Likes on 662 Posts
Default

Some free wiggle on the input shaft inside the front bearing retainer on a Muncie is normal. A ball bearing allows more play in the input shaft inherently than a roller bearing would.
DansYellow66 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 01:37 PM
  #53  
MikeM
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Mar 2003
Location: Greenville, Indiana
Posts: 23,041
Received 932 Likes on 788 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Powershift View Post
How about giving the man some measurable number.

Larry
I do a lot of my work by the Braille method. I knew an expert would come along with his spec sheet and be more specific.
MikeM is online now  
Old 06-17-2019, 02:10 PM
  #54  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

here is a video. Normal play? Also, How can I tell which transmission this is? Did the video attach?
Attached Files
File Type: mov
IMG_6740.mov (2.24 MB, 12 views)

Last edited by rscone11; 06-17-2019 at 03:22 PM.
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 02:16 PM
  #55  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
Some lateral play is normal. How much, I can't tell you. I never measured it. 2 MM doesn't sound too bad. The input shaft nose should fit fairly snug in the pilot bushing. If it doesn't, that can allow your clutch disc to run in an eccentric motion and vibrate.
Thanks Mike, I posted a video. It looks about to be 1/16th" play at the end.
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 03:51 PM
  #56  
63 340HP
CF Senior Member
 
63 340HP's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2005
Location: Beach & High Desert Southern California
Posts: 16,057
Received 538 Likes on 323 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by rscone11 View Post
Thanks Mike, I posted a video. It looks about to be 1/16th" play at the end.
If you had no trans noise before removal, and no difficult 3-4 shifts, the pilot shaft bearing is likely to be good. The 1/16th" radial play at the tip is normal as long as it is consistent as you roll the pilot shaft.

With the trans in neutral, roll the pilot shaft and feel for any sticking, or uneven change in the tip end play. If the feel is consistent through a full 360 degrees, it is unlikely that you have a bad pilot shaft bearing.

The small 63' only pilot shaft bearing is one area where the Muncie was improved with larger bearings and hardware in later years but it is more than adequate for the torque of the 327.
63 340HP is online now  
Old 06-17-2019, 06:19 PM
  #57  
Powershift
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Apr 2005
Location: Luling Louisiana
Posts: 7,326
Received 683 Likes on 617 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by MikeM View Post
I do a lot of my work by the Braille method. I knew an expert would come along with his spec sheet and be more specific.
Replace bold with "damn engineer" and the statement is now correct.

Larry
Powershift is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 06:32 PM
  #58  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default

Originally Posted by DansYellow66 View Post
Some free wiggle on the input shaft inside the front bearing retainer on a Muncie is normal. A ball bearing allows more play in the input shaft inherently than a roller bearing would.
Originally Posted by 63 340HP View Post
If you had no trans noise before removal, and no difficult 3-4 shifts, the pilot shaft bearing is likely to be good. The 1/16th" radial play at the tip is normal as long as it is consistent as you roll the pilot shaft.

With the trans in neutral, roll the pilot shaft and feel for any sticking, or uneven change in the tip end play. If the feel is consistent through a full 360 degrees, it is unlikely that you have a bad pilot shaft bearing.

The small 63' only pilot shaft bearing is one area where the Muncie was improved with larger bearings and hardware in later years but it is more than adequate for the torque of the 327.
I had noise from the TO bearing, and excessive vibration on the shifter at 4k to 4.5k RPM. I am attaching photos of flywheel, pilot bearing and pressure plate. The car shifted fine otherwise, no unusual noise and I just rolled the pilot shaft and it seems normal.

Last edited by rscone11; 06-17-2019 at 06:38 PM.
rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 06:35 PM
  #59  
rscone11
CF Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Member Since: Apr 2019
Location: Columbus, Ohio
Posts: 120
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Default



rscone11 is offline  
Old 06-17-2019, 06:49 PM
  #60  
Powershift
CF Senior Member
 
Member Since: Apr 2005
Location: Luling Louisiana
Posts: 7,326
Received 683 Likes on 617 Posts
Default

The trans has been out before and has had at least one modification. That is the drain plug.

Heat scoring/checking on PP section is obvious. PP may have weak "fingers" in this area.

Bolts holding flywheel to crankshaft should be special Grade 8 bolts and lock washer under bolt is highly unusual.

You can run a dial indicator on the flywheel at a few different radius and check for runout before removing.

Lars and Dan and MikeM will likely have a lot more comments for you.

Trans input shaft "wiggle" is normal for these 1960's transmissions. I would not worry about it as a major issue.

Larry

Last edited by Powershift; 06-17-2019 at 06:51 PM.
Powershift is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread
Quick Reply: Replacing clutch 1963 fuelie


Contact Us - About Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

We are a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for us to earn fees by linking to Amazon.com and affiliated sites.
 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: