mbeeman350

I have been following this thread for a while and I missed out on the original group buy earlier this year. I had an investment opportunity that consumed a lot my resources. Now I am ready to get back to work on my car. Yesterday I talked to Paul at AP and he is offering about the same pricing as the buy in for the auto to 5 speed TKO 600 package.
But after reading about all the problems, I am having second thoughts.

Some of my concerns
Aftermarket Bellhousing fitment - does the original GM 621 line up or center better than the repos w/o changing dowels?
Clutch/Flywheel - would I be better off on my own? Would appreciate some recomendations
2/3 Shifting Issue - anyone have any experience with the Hurst Driveline Conversion featuring their own "sidewinder" shifter, shift any better?
Clutch Pivot Bracket Flexing - I have to weld a clutch pivot frame bracket now I see there are some problems there??
Should I plan on rebalancing the flywheel, clutch and drive shaft?
Long Wait Times for the parts - Paul stated there is a 2 week wait, but I see some owners here had a 3-4-5 month wait

Engine is a 383 w/trick Flow Heads/Retro roller cam/3.08 Rear (plan to change to 3.55 or 3.73)
thanks

69VetteFla

I am very happy with the TKO 600 but would speak to Paul about getting the shorter shifter with the kit. The shifting from 2nd to 3rd and from 5th to 4th take a little getting use to but no problem after a little while. Regarding the clutch, I ordered the AP Science Friction and it was defective which was a pain in the *** having to remove tranny and reinstall. I ended up buying a McLeod Super Street Pro kit and am very happy with it.
http://www.mcleodracing.com/products...Street+Pro.mcl

I would be very clear with him that you do not want to wait more than 2 or 3 weeks and ask him to confirm that will be the wait. Maybe ask him to agree in writing that he will take $300 off if it takes more than 3 weeks and see what he says.

I didn't do the install myself so can't help you with your other questions but sure that others will chime in.

mbeeman350

Josh thanks for the advice.
This thread started in February and has been going a while and I see you had a new addition to your family. Congrats. Hope all is well!
I read Pauls frustation with shipping, shifting, the shifter and gear shift ball!

69VetteFla

Thanks The little guy is already eying the vette at 7 weeks - it is all his when he turns 18.

flyeri

I used the stock flywheel and had it resurfaced. It did not need much rework so I did not rebalance it. Centerforce Dual Friction clutch, pressure plate, and release bearing and a new GM 621 bell housing. I used a Moroso needle pilot bearing. Other clutches probably would have been acceptable but I wanted close to stock clutch pedal force.

Shark Racer

The 621 bellhousing I got with the kit needed 014 dowels and was warped. (008th runout on the block face)

The transmission bolt holes also stripped... so I had quite a bit of fun.

The clutch, however, is one of the nicest clutches I've ever driven. I got the kevlar clutch with hydramax hydraulics (3/4" bore master). It's a little heavier than the clutch in my C6 Z (just a little) but a lot more predictable. Even though it's hydraulic, it feels very positive.

The transmission shifts great. Overall, I'm very happy to have it.

The shifter is direct, but not clunky. I like it better than the Richmond-5.

Billysvette

Josh i know what you mean i have 2 kids but i think the son really wants it,he goes to the car shows with me in it,he takes cruises with we when ever i go,hes all about the vette.he calls it Austins car,and you know what,it is austins car.He helps work on it with me.but so does my daughter when i ask her to.

Billysvette

Ok guys,just wanted to say it was worth the trouble ,it does take a little bit to get use to the shifting and the pattern,once you get that down ,its awesome ,i love the car even more now,it is sweet.55 at 1500 rpms,and after redoing the engine too,words cant describe the look and smile on my face.awesome guys ,just awesome

69VetteFla

Great pics Billy So glad that you feel that way. Driving on the highway is so much more fun now. I hated having to drive more than 5 miles or so on the highway before and felt like a granny not even enjoying driving the speed limit down here (65MPH). Now 70+ is no problem and even 80+ is lots of fun. Enjoy the hell out of her

Billysvette

Yes indeed,this is of the best mods to do.I think a supercharger is #1 and then the trans.

94hokies

AP's 24x7 support number mailbox is full, anyone know another way to get a hold of them?

And maybe you guys can answer as well...Upon delivery, I did the test of putting on the shifter and running it through all the gears successfully. We put it on the engine and dropped the engine/trans into the car, reattached the shifter to put it inn neutral to get the d/s installed. Just for fun, went to run it through the gears and it will only go in 3rd and reverse. I don't have the clutch pedal hooked yet. Will need to hook up the pedal and release the clutch just to traverse all the gears or did something get messed up when putting it into the car?

94hokies

OK, the voicemail box was full but it is for a cell phone and they called right back. We tried hand turning the engine to see if that would free up whatever was binding and I actually then lost 3rd as well and could only shift into reverse. Tried hooking up the clutch pedal and pumping it a couple times and that seems to have settled in whatever was binding and can now hit all the positions both with and without clutch depressed again.

28cars

My buddies and I were ready to buy from them until we did some research and saw they had an F rating with the Better Business Bureau.
http://www.bbb.org/nashville/busines...le-tn-37057976

Shark Racer

For what it's worth, while I was frustrated as hell with the delivery times they ultimately delivered a pretty good product that I am very happy with.

Like I said earlier, don't take your car down on the expectation that something will arrive, wait till you've got everything.

oldC3guy

When this group buy started back in March, AP had some trouble getting the product they needed from the supplier (Tremec?). I ordered a 5 speed and had to wait a while but it wasn't a problem for me. The guys who ordered 6-speeds had a longer wait since I believe more people ordered those. If you read back in the posts, you will see a lot of frustration. Like others, I called in but overall felt I got good service and now that my transmission is installed it is GREAT. The shifter is short and precise. Love it. I don't know about the "F" rating but all it takes is a few guys PO'd and they will let it fly. Overall, because of the wait I might give them a "B" grade but I have no complaints. And if somebody out there can find a perfect world with no frustration and instant gratification, let me know where it is. I'd like to move there.

69VetteFla

I agree with Shark Racer and OldC3Guy. I was the one who put together the group buy and I can tell you that it was extremely frustrating waiting for delivery and feeling responsible for getting other people involved and seeing them get frustrated. At the end of the day though they did deliver a great product that I am very happy with. I can also say that I did speak with most of the other providers during my due diligence to figure out who to go with and came up with AP based on price and they also were the most pleasant to deal with in terms of negotiating a deal. I don't remember the exact # of trannys that we bought but I believe it was somewhere around 20 or 30 and am confident that any of the other suppliers would have ran into the same backlog if we ended up ordering from them. It took 2 complaints to give them the F rating and I wouldn't be surprised if it came from folks in the group buy. At the end of the day the quality of the product and the customer service after you get the product is the most important thing in my opinion and they delivered on those two fronts.

Billysvette

I didnt report them,but i felt like it at times.I am not a patient person,but i am working on it . AP did at the end give a nice kit to us.I have a slight vibration at about 1800 to 2000 rpms ,im guessing its not exactly centered ,i will try to shim it later on.does anybody have a pic of the shims or how it suppose to look like.

68/70Vette

I'd guess the 621 bellhousing was a repro. In another forum there was a posting that the repro bell housings are not that accurate. The posting said the transmission bolt holes were 0.020 inches off. The transmission bolt holes were stripped?....that 's weird. A new bell housing? I have a TKO 600 in my 68 and 70. I have the dual disk McLoed in the 70. The 68 has a single disk Centerforce.

I really like the TKO 600 in my 68. Before it was 3000 rpm at 70 mph with the Muncie. With the TKO, it's about 2000 rpms at 70 mph. The short shift is nice, it's mostly wrist motion with a little arm motion, unlike the significant arm motion with the Muncie. My 70 is not yet driveable.

After several transmission installs and removals, the threads in my original GM 621 bellhousing became stripped. I had a machine shop install new steel inserts to restore the threads.


For people not familiar...you can't replace a Richmond 5 speed with a TKO 500 or 600 and vice versa. The Richmond 5th speed is 1:1 and the TKO 600's 5th speed is 0.64:1 (?).
If you're going to switch from one to the other, you are most certainly going to have to change your differential gearing.

Billysvette

Are you guys talking about a dowel pin that sticks out of the back of the block? and is that the dowel pin that is off set? My problem with that is,my bellhouseing is real tight,if i were to move it with the dowel pin ,my transmission bolts wont bolt up ,like i said ,my bell houseing doesnt give you much at all to play with.Any pics of them?

Also ,was there anybody who didnt use the dowel pins?