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The future of the NCRS

 
Old 03-24-2016, 06:22 AM
  #61  
530planeman
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Originally Posted by jnb5101 View Post
A "Brought Back From The Dead" category is needed. Awards should be given to those truly motivated enough to rebuild (not necessarily restore to OEM perfection because of availability or cost of parts) the 99% of these cars that have been wrecked, modified or otherwise neglected. If someone is fortunate enough to obtain an untouched 40 year old car, that person has a much better chance of meeting NCRS goals than the average Joe that starts with a basket case. By abandoning this 99% of the owners, the membership will continue to fall.
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Old 03-24-2016, 09:04 AM
  #62  
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Originally Posted by Vettebuyer6369 View Post
No one is comparing the two; they are completely different groups. Gold Certification and Survivor, of course, have been annual events (GC since the 70's) and no one's saying they provide what NCRS does. However, Gold Certification and Survivor judging is not "just an event." I'll politely disagree about the judges not knowing anything without NCRS and leave it at that. I'll also mention BG hasnt been in the Chicago area since 2012.
Good, because there is no comparison, IMO. I know Bloomington is in Indy, the Chicago judging event I was speaking of is the MCACN (part of the alleged "Triple Crown"). It is also a stand alone, once a year, one shot event that would not have Corvette judges without NCRS existing to train them, like Bloomington.

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Old 03-24-2016, 10:21 AM
  #63  
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Another GOOD thing in my opinion about a "close to factory build" ( which is what NCRS is good for ) is you know whats there. A highly modified car with custom wiring and what not no longer has a matching service manual. If you buy one or can not remember how you customized something years ago its a shot in the dark to trouble shoot a problem. Factory vacuum hoes have been mentioned but if you use the correct colors....you have a well documented layout of what each hoes does and where it goes....you use all black....and again you are back to figuring out whats there. I don't mind modifying some things on a car but go too far and a new buyer or yourself will have problems trouble shooting years down the road. Just my 2 cents.

I truly hope NCRS finds a way to survive. To me' they would be very much missed even though I have never nor will ever have a car capable of scouring high in any present category.....but why should that be a reason not to be involved?
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Old 03-24-2016, 01:32 PM
  #64  
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I think there is a bright future out there for the NCRS if they make the right moves today, to make that future happen, but I also think there is a very dim future out there for the NCRS if they continue just with business as usual.

As everyone here and elsewhere points out the members are only getting older, the meets smaller etc etc.

For some background I am a 30yr old NCRS member (completing my first year of membership next month) with a top flight 71 coupe. These are my unfiltered comments/thoughts on the future of the NCRS.

If the NCRS wants to reach more people of my generation and head down the path leading to the bright future without giving up on their principals of factory correct this is what I think they need to do:

1. Web Presence is key. Having a quarterly set of magazines worked very well during the origination of the club, but technology has moved rapidly forward and there is A TON the NCRS can do to capitalize on that front and modernize.

If the NCRS wants people to do factory correct restorations they need to make it easier to find the parts to do so and inject themselves into the center of the factory correct restoration business (ala Google). Yes the driveline is a godsend but shortening the cycle time between new releases and adding interactivity would definitely up its value immensely.

Here are just a couple of quick off the cuff ideas:

a. Online up to date listing of corvette part/accessory suppliers. Write reviews, allow user reviews on suppliers, make content searchable and easily findable. The NCRS can even charge both parties in this transaction.

b. Online recordings of judging schools and presentation materials plus youtube style how to videos for frequent maintenance/restoration tasks. In this manner when I am working on system X I can just go to the NCRS website and see all of the data they have on restoring/maintaining system X to factory specs. They can even tie this in with idea a, to help suppliers build business.

2. Stop focusing so hard on the mid year cars and even the chrome C3's.
We get it, these cars are awesome, but for 99% of people in my generation (esp the C2's) they are 100% totally unachievable unless they are in horrid shape. I am not saying that the NCRS should de-emphasize them, but rather make sure the issues of the Restorers are balanced across all eras of Corvettes. The number of articles focusing on mid year cars should not utterly dominate the number of articles on for instance urethane C3's or C4's and C5's. Clearly there can't be pure equality, but I believe a better balance can be struck.

3. Open up the shows to larger audiences/local corvette/car clubs.
If the NCRS is going to gain new blood they need to control/own the way that people first interact with and learn about the club. I would guess that statistically speaking the best place to find new NCRS members is to find corvette people (or even car people) who are not already NCRS members. By having local clubs participate in our shows you can then show those people the benefits of the NCRS, and the NCRS judging scheme. This raises attendance at meets, and gives regular car people the opportunity to watch the NCRS in process and make the decision for themselves if this is an organization they want to join. This goes hand in hand with

4. Equalize the value behind chapter top flights vs. regional/national top flights.
The whole point of the NCRS judging scheme in my eyes (beyond being factory 'correct') is that its as objective as a standard as you can reasonable reach. The fact that there is enough subjectivity in the application of that scheme that members consider one top flight different then another breeds animosity. This means the only way to "really" achieve in the NCRS is to go out buy a truck, buy a trailer, take off a week from work and hike your car out to god knows however far away the regional/national meets are. I think its this which really breeds the perception of the NCRS being pay to win, and it especially affects people who have less time and or money.

5. Offer "pre-"flight judging at chapter meets.
Tied into idea #3, for those who are interested sic a judge on their car for ~10 mins who can answer their questions about what appears to be factory, what definitely isn't, and how the judge thinks their car would rate on the scale of factory originality. This would be an opportunity for judges to share knowledge and build goodwill with others in the corvette community, and to properly set their expectations re: flight judging a certain car.

6. Encourage chapter participation in local car club shows.
As a way to build awareness and share these awesome cars setup chapter caravans to local shows. This serves to get these cars into the public eye, and gives people the opportunity to see that A. the people are cool, B. factory original corvettes do exist as more then trailer queens C. that the NCRS is about more then just judging on show-field.

What do you all think?
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Old 03-24-2016, 02:27 PM
  #65  
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Originally Posted by ThumpingLotus7 View Post
I think there is a bright future out there for the NCRS if they make the right moves today, to make that future happen, but I also think there is a very dim future out there for the NCRS if they continue just with business as usual.

As everyone here and elsewhere points out the members are only getting older, the meets smaller etc etc.

For some background I am a 30yr old NCRS member (completing my first year of membership next month) with a top flight 71 coupe. These are my unfiltered comments/thoughts on the future of the NCRS.

If the NCRS wants to reach more people of my generation and head down the path leading to the bright future without giving up on their principals of factory correct this is what I think they need to do:

1. Web Presence is key. Having a quarterly set of magazines worked very well during the origination of the club, but technology has moved rapidly forward and there is A TON the NCRS can do to capitalize on that front and modernize.

If the NCRS wants people to do factory correct restorations they need to make it easier to find the parts to do so and inject themselves into the center of the factory correct restoration business (ala Google). Yes the driveline is a godsend but shortening the cycle time between new releases and adding interactivity would definitely up its value immensely.

Here are just a couple of quick off the cuff ideas:

a. Online up to date listing of corvette part/accessory suppliers. Write reviews, allow user reviews on suppliers, make content searchable and easily findable. The NCRS can even charge both parties in this transaction.

b. Online recordings of judging schools and presentation materials plus youtube style how to videos for frequent maintenance/restoration tasks. In this manner when I am working on system X I can just go to the NCRS website and see all of the data they have on restoring/maintaining system X to factory specs. They can even tie this in with idea a, to help suppliers build business.

2. Stop focusing so hard on the mid year cars and even the chrome C3's.
We get it, these cars are awesome, but for 99% of people in my generation (esp the C2's) they are 100% totally unachievable unless they are in horrid shape. I am not saying that the NCRS should de-emphasize them, but rather make sure the issues of the Restorers are balanced across all eras of Corvettes. The number of articles focusing on mid year cars should not utterly dominate the number of articles on for instance urethane C3's or C4's and C5's. Clearly there can't be pure equality, but I believe a better balance can be struck.

3. Open up the shows to larger audiences/local corvette/car clubs.
If the NCRS is going to gain new blood they need to control/own the way that people first interact with and learn about the club. I would guess that statistically speaking the best place to find new NCRS members is to find corvette people (or even car people) who are not already NCRS members. By having local clubs participate in our shows you can then show those people the benefits of the NCRS, and the NCRS judging scheme. This raises attendance at meets, and gives regular car people the opportunity to watch the NCRS in process and make the decision for themselves if this is an organization they want to join. This goes hand in hand with

4. Equalize the value behind chapter top flights vs. regional/national top flights.
The whole point of the NCRS judging scheme in my eyes (beyond being factory 'correct') is that its as objective as a standard as you can reasonable reach. The fact that there is enough subjectivity in the application of that scheme that members consider one top flight different then another breeds animosity. This means the only way to "really" achieve in the NCRS is to go out buy a truck, buy a trailer, take off a week from work and hike your car out to god knows however far away the regional/national meets are. I think its this which really breeds the perception of the NCRS being pay to win, and it especially affects people who have less time and or money.

5. Offer "pre-"flight judging at chapter meets.
Tied into idea #3, for those who are interested sic a judge on their car for ~10 mins who can answer their questions about what appears to be factory, what definitely isn't, and how the judge thinks their car would rate on the scale of factory originality. This would be an opportunity for judges to share knowledge and build goodwill with others in the corvette community, and to properly set their expectations re: flight judging a certain car.

6. Encourage chapter participation in local car club shows.
As a way to build awareness and share these awesome cars setup chapter caravans to local shows. This serves to get these cars into the public eye, and gives people the opportunity to see that A. the people are cool, B. factory original corvettes do exist as more then trailer queens C. that the NCRS is about more then just judging on show-field.

What do you all think?
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Old 03-24-2016, 03:02 PM
  #66  
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I think there should be an alliance between the Corvette Museum and the NCRS. There should be a artifact library of club and GM documents yo support the restoration hobby. Most European manufacturers have a historical division where they even do their best to provide correct parts for their vintage models and keep them on the road some even offering restoration services.

My big problem with NCRS events lies in the judging and....you can get that part correctly rebuilt/refinished by "so and so" who might also happen to be a judge. There seems to be a network of cronies involved and I'm not interested in joining that club. I see the engine compartments graced with what were raw aluminum castings that now are refinished and coated with various things that GM never had on the part when it was sold but, this is now the accepted standard. I also don't think it is right to have such a drastic points reduction on a 30-50 year old automobile for replacement parts such as ball joints and other critical safety items that in order to win in the judging contest those parts have to be marginal condition originals rather that SAFE replacement parts.....takes away from the "DRIVING" aspect of owning a older Vette. I have known a few cars to undergo "Top Flight" judging and be marked down for having original parts due to a judges personal opinion or bias.

NCRS will never be my "cup of tea" but, I respect people who want to preserve the legacy. GM should step up along with the Corvette Museum and build a historical archives library along with a parts restoration center for Corvette enthusiasts.
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Old 03-24-2016, 05:26 PM
  #67  
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Originally Posted by 7T1vette View Post

If NCRS restructures....and they can find some good and REASONABLE folks {I'm sure there are many within the club--but maybe not in the "inner circle"} to provide needed leadership, that group might actually turn out to be better for the rank and file membership.
There's an adage that applies to any group - decisions are not made by the brightest, but by those who show up.

*I'm back to reading.
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Old 03-24-2016, 05:32 PM
  #68  
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Originally Posted by ThumpingLotus7 View Post
I think there is a bright future out there for the NCRS if they make the right moves today, to make that future happen, but I also think there is a very dim future out there for the NCRS if they continue just with business as usual.

As everyone here and elsewhere points out the members are only getting older, the meets smaller etc etc.

For some background I am a 30yr old NCRS member (completing my first year of membership next month) with a top flight 71 coupe. These are my unfiltered comments/thoughts on the future of the NCRS.

If the NCRS wants to reach more people of my generation and head down the path leading to the bright future without giving up on their principals of factory correct this is what I think they need to do:

1. Web Presence is key. Having a quarterly set of magazines worked very well during the origination of the club, but technology has moved rapidly forward and there is A TON the NCRS can do to capitalize on that front and modernize.

If the NCRS wants people to do factory correct restorations they need to make it easier to find the parts to do so and inject themselves into the center of the factory correct restoration business (ala Google). Yes the driveline is a godsend but shortening the cycle time between new releases and adding interactivity would definitely up its value immensely.

Here are just a couple of quick off the cuff ideas:

a. Online up to date listing of corvette part/accessory suppliers. Write reviews, allow user reviews on suppliers, make content searchable and easily findable. The NCRS can even charge both parties in this transaction.

b. Online recordings of judging schools and presentation materials plus youtube style how to videos for frequent maintenance/restoration tasks. In this manner when I am working on system X I can just go to the NCRS website and see all of the data they have on restoring/maintaining system X to factory specs. They can even tie this in with idea a, to help suppliers build business.

2. Stop focusing so hard on the mid year cars and even the chrome C3's.
We get it, these cars are awesome, but for 99% of people in my generation (esp the C2's) they are 100% totally unachievable unless they are in horrid shape. I am not saying that the NCRS should de-emphasize them, but rather make sure the issues of the Restorers are balanced across all eras of Corvettes. The number of articles focusing on mid year cars should not utterly dominate the number of articles on for instance urethane C3's or C4's and C5's. Clearly there can't be pure equality, but I believe a better balance can be struck.

3. Open up the shows to larger audiences/local corvette/car clubs.
If the NCRS is going to gain new blood they need to control/own the way that people first interact with and learn about the club. I would guess that statistically speaking the best place to find new NCRS members is to find corvette people (or even car people) who are not already NCRS members. By having local clubs participate in our shows you can then show those people the benefits of the NCRS, and the NCRS judging scheme. This raises attendance at meets, and gives regular car people the opportunity to watch the NCRS in process and make the decision for themselves if this is an organization they want to join. This goes hand in hand with

4. Equalize the value behind chapter top flights vs. regional/national top flights.
The whole point of the NCRS judging scheme in my eyes (beyond being factory 'correct') is that its as objective as a standard as you can reasonable reach. The fact that there is enough subjectivity in the application of that scheme that members consider one top flight different then another breeds animosity. This means the only way to "really" achieve in the NCRS is to go out buy a truck, buy a trailer, take off a week from work and hike your car out to god knows however far away the regional/national meets are. I think its this which really breeds the perception of the NCRS being pay to win, and it especially affects people who have less time and or money.

5. Offer "pre-"flight judging at chapter meets.
Tied into idea #3, for those who are interested sic a judge on their car for ~10 mins who can answer their questions about what appears to be factory, what definitely isn't, and how the judge thinks their car would rate on the scale of factory originality. This would be an opportunity for judges to share knowledge and build goodwill with others in the corvette community, and to properly set their expectations re: flight judging a certain car.

6. Encourage chapter participation in local car club shows.
As a way to build awareness and share these awesome cars setup chapter caravans to local shows. This serves to get these cars into the public eye, and gives people the opportunity to see that A. the people are cool, B. factory original corvettes do exist as more then trailer queens C. that the NCRS is about more then just judging on show-field.

What do you all think?
Your hired, but is that really a win? good points, I've got you by a dozen years so cynicism is kicking in - I don't think it will happen; there's too many doing things one way that would lose their position in the pecking order (of a minor organization that has a circle of influence of zero).

That said, I think it would be nice if they sought to be part of the larger group of Corvette owners. That would require public flogging of those who snark on someone else's Corvette - but in the end, it would make it far less of us v. them.
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Old 03-24-2016, 05:41 PM
  #69  
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SuperBuickGuy you're right, what I listed out is not something I am able to do and it requires a group effort with effective leadership to accomplish. It always does come down to the people....

As you also said

There's an adage that applies to any group - decisions are not made by the brightest, but by those who show up.
which holds sooo true
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Old 03-24-2016, 05:44 PM
  #70  
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Originally Posted by ThumpingLotus7 View Post
I think there is a bright future out there for the NCRS if they make the right moves today, to make that future happen, but I also think there is a very dim future out there for the NCRS if they continue just with business as usual.

As everyone here and elsewhere points out the members are only getting older, the meets smaller etc etc.

For some background I am a 30yr old NCRS member (completing my first year of membership next month) with a top flight 71 coupe. These are my unfiltered comments/thoughts on the future of the NCRS.

If the NCRS wants to reach more people of my generation and head down the path leading to the bright future without giving up on their principals of factory correct this is what I think they need to do:

1. Web Presence is key. Having a quarterly set of magazines worked very well during the origination of the club, but technology has moved rapidly forward and there is A TON the NCRS can do to capitalize on that front and modernize.

If the NCRS wants people to do factory correct restorations they need to make it easier to find the parts to do so and inject themselves into the center of the factory correct restoration business (ala Google). Yes the driveline is a godsend but shortening the cycle time between new releases and adding interactivity would definitely up its value immensely.

Here are just a couple of quick off the cuff ideas:

a. Online up to date listing of corvette part/accessory suppliers. Write reviews, allow user reviews on suppliers, make content searchable and easily findable. The NCRS can even charge both parties in this transaction.

b. Online recordings of judging schools and presentation materials plus youtube style how to videos for frequent maintenance/restoration tasks. In this manner when I am working on system X I can just go to the NCRS website and see all of the data they have on restoring/maintaining system X to factory specs. They can even tie this in with idea a, to help suppliers build business.

2. Stop focusing so hard on the mid year cars and even the chrome C3's.
We get it, these cars are awesome, but for 99% of people in my generation (esp the C2's) they are 100% totally unachievable unless they are in horrid shape. I am not saying that the NCRS should de-emphasize them, but rather make sure the issues of the Restorers are balanced across all eras of Corvettes. The number of articles focusing on mid year cars should not utterly dominate the number of articles on for instance urethane C3's or C4's and C5's. Clearly there can't be pure equality, but I believe a better balance can be struck.

3. Open up the shows to larger audiences/local corvette/car clubs.
If the NCRS is going to gain new blood they need to control/own the way that people first interact with and learn about the club. I would guess that statistically speaking the best place to find new NCRS members is to find corvette people (or even car people) who are not already NCRS members. By having local clubs participate in our shows you can then show those people the benefits of the NCRS, and the NCRS judging scheme. This raises attendance at meets, and gives regular car people the opportunity to watch the NCRS in process and make the decision for themselves if this is an organization they want to join. This goes hand in hand with

4. Equalize the value behind chapter top flights vs. regional/national top flights.
The whole point of the NCRS judging scheme in my eyes (beyond being factory 'correct') is that its as objective as a standard as you can reasonable reach. The fact that there is enough subjectivity in the application of that scheme that members consider one top flight different then another breeds animosity. This means the only way to "really" achieve in the NCRS is to go out buy a truck, buy a trailer, take off a week from work and hike your car out to god knows however far away the regional/national meets are. I think its this which really breeds the perception of the NCRS being pay to win, and it especially affects people who have less time and or money.

5. Offer "pre-"flight judging at chapter meets.
Tied into idea #3, for those who are interested sic a judge on their car for ~10 mins who can answer their questions about what appears to be factory, what definitely isn't, and how the judge thinks their car would rate on the scale of factory originality. This would be an opportunity for judges to share knowledge and build goodwill with others in the corvette community, and to properly set their expectations re: flight judging a certain car.

6. Encourage chapter participation in local car club shows.
As a way to build awareness and share these awesome cars setup chapter caravans to local shows. This serves to get these cars into the public eye, and gives people the opportunity to see that A. the people are cool, B. factory original corvettes do exist as more then trailer queens C. that the NCRS is about more then just judging on show-field.

What do you all think?
you have some valid points although a lot of what you talk about already exist through such things as the corvette forum and it's free
.as far as the judging issue you re correct a lot of politics and personal opinions without doing more current research .I have gone to several NCRS shows and seems unless you have a newer super shiny corvette you ain't s#%$% . AS FAR AS "ORIGINAL CONDITION" when were chrome bumper corvettes painted with base coat clear coat method ??I have two chrome bumper corvettes and in the process of restoring them and one has some rust in the frame (very repairable) and was told in an e mail by a NCRS judge change it to another frame .What happened to "numbers matching original " I haven't found that an original part was not out there ,it might cost you some but it is out there .I am sure this will get straightened out as far as NCRS just hope they have been listening to some of these comments . Maybe some different judging classes.
1. Trailer kings or queens
2 original no reproduction parts
3 modified for safety and roadability
(a driver )
4 Customized
Just a thought for what it's worth
wes
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Old 03-24-2016, 05:52 PM
  #71  
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Originally Posted by Solid LT1 View Post
I think there should be an alliance between the Corvette Museum and the NCRS. There should be a artifact library of club and GM documents yo support the restoration hobby. Most European manufacturers have a historical division where they even do their best to provide correct parts for their vintage models and keep them on the road some even offering restoration services.
Respectfully you are mistaken on all three counts of the above paragraph.

As far as the alliance you suggest goes, it was the NCRS and some NCRS members that started the Corvette Museum project. NCRS had a greater presence there at one time. NCRS has also contributed a substantial amount of money to the Corvette Museum. The Executive Director Wendal Strode since he came on board has moved away from Corvette history and particularly the NCRS for the late model segment. Where he has found the money is. Strode has reduced the NCRS presence there.

NCRS has a collection of GM and "club" documents held in trust at the AACA library Hershey PA. due to Strodes move away from NCRS. The museum has an archive or library at the Museum which was started by and part of the original NCRS plan/project.

The European auto makers approach to their vintage cars is very admirable. But it is no the purview of the NCRS. You need to take that idea to the manufacturer GM. An admirable thought but I think you will find it isn't in GMs budget or a large enough revenue stream for them. Further the bean counters there contracted out that out years ago when they reduced GMs overall inventory. The company that administers GM Restoration parts has clearly demonstrated they only care about the money and not accuracy/quality/correctness.
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Old 03-24-2016, 06:23 PM
  #72  
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Originally Posted by ThumpingLotus7 View Post
I think there is a bright future out there for the NCRS if they make the right moves today, to make that future happen, but I also think there is a very dim future out there for the NCRS if they continue just with business as usual.

As everyone here and elsewhere points out the members are only getting older, the meets smaller etc etc.

For some background I am a 30yr old NCRS member (completing my first year of membership next month) with a top flight 71 coupe. These are my unfiltered comments/thoughts on the future of the NCRS.

If the NCRS wants to reach more people of my generation and head down the path leading to the bright future without giving up on their principals of factory correct this is what I think they need to do:

1. Web Presence is key. Having a quarterly set of magazines worked very well during the origination of the club, but technology has moved rapidly forward and there is A TON the NCRS can do to capitalize on that front and modernize.

If the NCRS wants people to do factory correct restorations they need to make it easier to find the parts to do so and inject themselves into the center of the factory correct restoration business (ala Google). Yes the driveline is a godsend but shortening the cycle time between new releases and adding interactivity would definitely up its value immensely.

Here are just a couple of quick off the cuff ideas:

a. Online up to date listing of corvette part/accessory suppliers. Write reviews, allow user reviews on suppliers, make content searchable and easily findable. The NCRS can even charge both parties in this transaction.

b. Online recordings of judging schools and presentation materials plus youtube style how to videos for frequent maintenance/restoration tasks. In this manner when I am working on system X I can just go to the NCRS website and see all of the data they have on restoring/maintaining system X to factory specs. They can even tie this in with idea a, to help suppliers build business.

2. Stop focusing so hard on the mid year cars and even the chrome C3's.
We get it, these cars are awesome, but for 99% of people in my generation (esp the C2's) they are 100% totally unachievable unless they are in horrid shape. I am not saying that the NCRS should de-emphasize them, but rather make sure the issues of the Restorers are balanced across all eras of Corvettes. The number of articles focusing on mid year cars should not utterly dominate the number of articles on for instance urethane C3's or C4's and C5's. Clearly there can't be pure equality, but I believe a better balance can be struck.

3. Open up the shows to larger audiences/local corvette/car clubs.
If the NCRS is going to gain new blood they need to control/own the way that people first interact with and learn about the club. I would guess that statistically speaking the best place to find new NCRS members is to find corvette people (or even car people) who are not already NCRS members. By having local clubs participate in our shows you can then show those people the benefits of the NCRS, and the NCRS judging scheme. This raises attendance at meets, and gives regular car people the opportunity to watch the NCRS in process and make the decision for themselves if this is an organization they want to join. This goes hand in hand with

4. Equalize the value behind chapter top flights vs. regional/national top flights.
The whole point of the NCRS judging scheme in my eyes (beyond being factory 'correct') is that its as objective as a standard as you can reasonable reach. The fact that there is enough subjectivity in the application of that scheme that members consider one top flight different then another breeds animosity. This means the only way to "really" achieve in the NCRS is to go out buy a truck, buy a trailer, take off a week from work and hike your car out to god knows however far away the regional/national meets are. I think its this which really breeds the perception of the NCRS being pay to win, and it especially affects people who have less time and or money.

5. Offer "pre-"flight judging at chapter meets.
Tied into idea #3, for those who are interested sic a judge on their car for ~10 mins who can answer their questions about what appears to be factory, what definitely isn't, and how the judge thinks their car would rate on the scale of factory originality. This would be an opportunity for judges to share knowledge and build goodwill with others in the corvette community, and to properly set their expectations re: flight judging a certain car.

6. Encourage chapter participation in local car club shows.
As a way to build awareness and share these awesome cars setup chapter caravans to local shows. This serves to get these cars into the public eye, and gives people the opportunity to see that A. the people are cool, B. factory original corvettes do exist as more then trailer queens C. that the NCRS is about more then just judging on show-field.

What do you all think?
Let me answer this with what my experience has been as an active NCRS member for some years for a few items:

2. The C2s and C3s, to some extent though smaller, are what the members WANT to buy, own, and restore. They are just the most popular and maybe always will be. You judge what shows up, that's all you can do.

3. Judging meets, like chapter, regionals, nationals, are judging meets, not car shows. People are allowed in to look if they like, happens all the time, sometimes they charge a fee at the larger meets. Advertising it as a car show and trying to pack it with people would really degrade the character of the judging meet and it is crowded enough on the judging field as it is.

4. The quality of the TF at the chapter, regional, and national levels is not supposed to be the same, since the judges and their expertise and thoroughness is different. Chapter meets are mostly about learning about your car and getting encouragement, help, and tips to improve, by the time you are in the Nationals, it should be the best it can be so no punches are pulled, you are not learning anymore. The levels should be different.

5. Pre-judging or using your car as a "guinea pig" to have judging school training is quite common, at least in the chapters I belong to, and help from the most experienced judges before chapter judging is readily available in my experience, happens all the time.That is what chapter meets are for.

6. The chapters I belong to are very involved in local car shows, and a dozen or more members almost always attend the local car shows with their Corvettes. I go to probably 4 a year, and about a dozen Cars and Coffee informal gathering a year too. Many chapter members are officers of other car clubs and help organize their shows, very common.

If your local chapter is not doing these things, I suggest you suggest they do, since most all do.
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Old 03-24-2016, 09:21 PM
  #73  
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Default My experience in NCRS

As one who was a teenager in the 60's and car crazy I always wanted a Corvette. Flash forward 40 years later and I could finally afford a mid year. I loved my '65 "numbers matching" big block and started going to lots of car shows and winning many awards. It was at a very large show that two self proclaimed NCRS "Master Judges" decided on their own and unsolicited, to point out what they considered wrong with my car. You can imagine my opinion of the NCRS. The '65 ended up in a museum and I purchased a '70 numbers matching car. In spite of my experience with the two NCRS guys; a NCRS Top Flight was always on my "bucket list". In 2013, in spite of my misgivings, I took the '70 to a Regional. Hard to admit that as a retired fighter pilot I was nervous as hell but good or bad, I had to see this through. It's hard to watch 4 teams of national judges pour over your car writing down every little thing and in my mind seeing points fly out the window. But this is where it gets better. My preconceived opinion of NCRS people was changed. Every single judge made a point of taking the time to explain there comments, offer encouragement, help with suggestions as to how to correct items and genuinely care about the hobby. I can say that I met and made a lot of friends at the Judging. Because of this experience I returned in 2015 to another Regional. I came to realize that in any organization there are individuals that may not represent the company, club, etc. in the most positive light. NCRS isn't for everybody but in my case being into originality; it is. When the national team leader and his judges take the time to care about the owner and their car like I observed; I have to appreciate their dedication to the sport. Their incredible knowledge about the cars and willingness to spend their own time and money traveling to these meets hopefully is an omen that the NCRS is in good hands. Just my two cents
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Old 04-01-2016, 08:29 AM
  #74  
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Over on the C1/C2 forum we've decided that cars shows need to change. We can't to the same thing all the time. I was at the recent Miami Beach Concours. They are setting new standards for a car show.

NCRS and Corvette at Carlisle need to see what is happening. The same with Bloomington Gold.

The average age was 25 years younger than any show I've ever been to.







The Miami Beach folks have shown us a new approach. Even better it worked.

Richard Newton
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Old 04-01-2016, 02:50 PM
  #75  
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As a 17 year old in 1969 I bought a 59 with 98,000 miles and drove it and loved it and improved the car to the best of my ability and finances would allow. Over the winter I painted it pearl white, with horizon blue coves. The paint turned out well, and I put a set of 63 wheelcovers on for a different look. During the summer of 1970 I drove the car from Chicago to Road America in Elkhart Lake WI to watch a Can Am and Trans Am race. I parked it in the Corvette Corral and was out watching the races when I was paged to return to my car. When I got to the car there was a rep from Chevrolet who asked if I would like to have my car included in the front line of their display. I said sure, and moved the car to their display. At the lunch break i was sitting near the car eating a sandwich and had my first exposure to NCRS when a member asked if it was my car, and proceeded to tell me what he thought was wrong with the car. When he was through, I asked him where his car was. He responded that he would never bring his car to a dusty event like that. If NCRS survives so be it. If they did not come off as **** know it all's perhaps they would thrive.
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Old 04-01-2016, 07:47 PM
  #76  
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Well said Bob.
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Old 04-02-2016, 06:42 AM
  #77  
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Why is it that no one here is trashing Bloomington Gold? Is it because it's a private company and not a club?
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Old 04-03-2016, 08:48 AM
  #78  
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I have been a member of the NCRS for years and believe it has contributed more to the Corvette restoration hobby over the years than any other group. I am not in favor of changing the mission of NCRS just to attract a few more members. While they need to do some belt tightening with their finances I think the NCRS will be around for many years and predictions of it's demise are being blown way out of proportion.
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Old 04-03-2016, 09:24 AM
  #79  
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Originally Posted by blue67ragtop View Post
I have been a member of the NCRS for years and believe it has contributed more to the Corvette restoration hobby over the years than any other group. Agreed, without a doubt....

I am not in favor of changing the mission of NCRS just to attract a few more members. I don`t think anyone is suggesting that the mission should be changed, but it sounds like there are complaints about the way some of the Generals are carrying out that mission.

While they need to do some belt tightening with their finances new members would help, but as mentioned, they are more likely other problems as well

I think the NCRS will be around for many years and predictions of it's demise are being blown way out of proportion.
It sounds as if the main complaint is in the way some members represent the club. "First Impressions" mean a LOT. It only takes one bad experience, from one member, to taint someones` outlook of the whole club.
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Old 04-03-2016, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by oldgto View Post
It sounds as if the main complaint is in the way some members represent the club. "First Impressions" mean a LOT. It only takes one bad experience, from one member, to taint someones` outlook of the whole club.
Yup.

My only experience with ncrs people is two guys walked up to my car at a all makes / models show and proceeded to give me a lecture on why my "restomod" is bad for the hobby and how I destroyed the value of an all original car, and if I wanted a race car I should have just bought one...

The way I look at it it is my car, if I can change it how I want, heck I can light it on fire and watch it burn if I want; after all it's mine...

I very much believe that the NCRS has a place, I love seeing factory correct cars, and it's great that there are a group of people keeping the knowledge of this history of original corvettes alive. However I believe that some of their members come across as elitist a-holes and it gives the organization a bad rap.

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