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Jeez! The OP wanted to know how to get a better sound and a few more ponies out of his car and now we're in some esoteric discussion "scavenging, flow, back pressure, etc". You guys are going to compare organ size forever! I don't think the OP is taking his car to Le Mans any time soon. And Mr, Newbie - probably not scoring any points picking a fight first time out of box! Good luck in your future posts.
Chest pounding about how knowledgeable a guy thinks he is aside
Actually i saw a lot of great related tech in this thread,
What would be a good 'longtube header' size then (pipe diameters...)?
I am going for a 2.25" inch exhaust pipe, because I think it won't do that mush in HP for an L48...
The things I'm going to do extra are: an open element cleaner, Edelbrock alu RPM intake, recurve distributer and set a 'better' timing.
What HP gain will that give me? From 180HP to ...?
Here is what I think. You may feel like the simple mods you are looking at will suffice for you now, but what about in the future? It sucks having to replace things like headers and exhaust if you decide to step up later to a bigger hop up or maybe a crate engine. Get a long tube header with 1 3/4" primaries and run 2.5 inch exhaust pipes. There's no downside to it. It won't be much difference in price and it's not going to kill bottom end power. You will gain power through the entire rpm range and it will be an improvement you can feel and hear.
Jeez! The OP wanted to know how to get a better sound and a few more ponies out of his car and now we're in some esoteric discussion "scavenging, flow, back pressure, etc". You guys are going to compare organ size forever! I don't think the OP is taking his car to Le Mans any time soon. And Mr, Newbie - probably not scoring any points picking a fight first time out of box! Good luck in your future posts.
Originally Posted by Street Rat
You guys should settle this in a new thread.
You guys are right. The replies should just address the OP's question. I just have a hard time ignoring bad information from somebody who read a book and thinks he is an expert now. Such is the internet though.
Here is what I think. You may feel like the simple mods you are looking at will suffice for you now, but what about in the future? It sucks having to replace things like headers and exhaust if you decide to step up later to a bigger hop up or maybe a crate engine. Get a long tube header with 1 3/4" primaries and run 2.5 inch exhaust pipes. There's no downside to it. It won't be much difference in price and it's not going to kill bottom end power. You will gain power through the entire rpm range and it will be an improvement you can feel and hear.
Mike
Thank you very much for the info!
And thank you also to the rest for all the technical stuff!
Think I will go for the 2,5 pipes then.
It is my first Vette I bought, so I think I will never sell it... So It's better to do upgrades that stay.
Would you guys go for a Stainless steel system or normal steel for the exhaust pipes. Not the headers! These will be normal steel, because SS headers are to pricey (sound versus durability).
What do you have under your cars?
Another set of questions (sorry guys). I found an Edelbrock Performer intake 2101 for 100€ second hand! Will that do much for HP (is it worth it)?
Will it fit on my Qjet? What do I have to check on the Intake (because it's second hand)?
Thank you very much for the info!
And thank you also to the rest for all the technical stuff!
Think I will go for the 2,5 pipes then.
It is my first Vette I bought, so I think I will never sell it... So It's better to do upgrades that stay.
Would you guys go for a Stainless steel system or normal steel for the exhaust pipes. Not the headers! These will be normal steel, because SS headers are to pricey (sound versus durability).
What do you have under your cars?
Another set of questions (sorry guys). I found an Edelbrock Performer intake 2101 for 100€ second hand! Will that do much for HP (is it worth it)?
Will it fit on my Qjet? What do I have to check on the Intake (because it's second hand)?
Obviously the stainless will never rust, so it should last for decades. It is more expensive though. I have steel exhaust with mandrel bends that I built. I painted the complete exhaust with high heat ceramic paint. Not as good as ceramic coating or stainless for rust prevention, but as long as the exhaust is brought up to temp to get the moisture out when driven, steel can last for a long time.
Speaking of ceramic coating. I would definitely recommend ceramic coated headers. You want them coated inside and out. It lowers the heat being thrown off them and underhood and floors temps as well. It also is a rust prevention coating.
The 2101 intake will work with your quadrajet. It is a good manifold for your lower rpm engine. It may not add a lot of power, but it is lighter, and reducing weight is the same as gaining power. Power to weight ratio. If you add a mild cam to the mix, the manifold, headers and exhaust will make quite a bit of difference.
Mike
PS: I want to add that you should recurve your distributor. This will add performance you can feel also. Lars has a good tech paper on how to do it. here on the forum.
St. Jude Donor '09-'10-'11-12-'13-'14-'15-'16-'17-‘18
NCM Sinkhole Donor
I personally would go with the normal steel. Simply because they are cheaper and they will wear out and rust through. By that time you will probably know whether or not you are happy with them and better technology may come around.
As I said before; I would go with stainless steel if you are planning on keeping the car. The difference in sound is negligible but the durability increases well beyond the additional expense.
If your wallet is tight (and who's isnt?) and you have the luxury of time you can scour craigslist, these forums, and ebay for a good deal to come along.
I managed to get a complete Allens stainless chambered exhaust setup: stainless hangers, stainless clamps, and all pipes from the headers back for $300.
The deals are out there, you just have to spend a little time digging.
If you do decide to go with regular steel, be sure to coat them with something as V2 suggested. Rattle can stuff is better than nothing but if you have a compressor and a spray gun you can get the actual air dry ceramic coating from Cerakote (we used them in the firearms business) for about $100 to do your entire system. Not cheap but when you consider how much it would cost to replace it in a few years when it rots out, it makes sense.
Obviously the stainless will never rust, so it should last for decades. It is more expensive though. I have steel exhaust with mandrel bends that I built. I painted the complete exhaust with high heat ceramic paint. Not as good as ceramic coating or stainless for rust prevention, but as long as the exhaust is brought up to temp to get the moisture out when driven, steel can last for a long time.
Speaking of ceramic coating. I would definitely recommend ceramic coated headers. You want them coated inside and out. It lowers the heat being thrown off them and underhood and floors temps as well. It also is a rust prevention coating.
The 2101 intake will work with your quadrajet. It is a good manifold for your lower rpm engine. It may not add a lot of power, but it is lighter, and reducing weight is the same as gaining power. Power to weight ratio. If you add a mild cam to the mix, the manifold, headers and exhaust will make quite a bit of difference.
Mike
PS: I want to add that you should recurve your distributor. This will add performance you can feel also. Lars has a good tech paper on how to do it. here on the forum.
I shall look further for someone who instals normal steel exhausts. But the problem is... Here in Belgium, but also in the Netherlands, it is extemely hard to find workshops who instal normal steel exhausts... I have contacted nearly every customshop in Belgium and the Netherlands, and 19/20 they say the same: "We don't do in steel exhausts because they don't last long."
They also say: "The difference in price of the material isn't that big. In total around 100 euro. It are the working hours (installation) that makes SS more pricey." Guess I continue contacting workshops for exhausts.
Wouldn't it be a good substitute for ceramic headers, if I just sandblast a pair of painted steel headers and paint the outside with a high heat ceramic paint?
I found this camshaft: Edelbrock Performer Plus Cam & lifters 2102. For 150 euro... Would that be a good set? Or would that give problems?
I asked some dealers for the price of Ceramic coated longtube headers for Chevy small blocks. They are about €750..... Is it me or is that VERY expensive for ceramic headers?
I asked some dealers for the price of Ceramic coated longtube headers for Chevy small blocks. They are about €750..... Is it me or is that VERY expensive for ceramic headers?
$790 is about the going price for Hooker Super Comp 1 3/4" in silver ceramic. So with shipping and monetary conversion, that would be about right.
.....But the problem is... Here in Belgium, but also in the Netherlands, it is extemely hard to find workshops who instal normal steel exhausts... I have contacted nearly every customshop in Belgium and the Netherlands, and 19/20 they say the same: "We don't do in steel exhausts because they don't last long."
Not trying to be a "wise guy" here, but I've been following this discussion since it's beginning, and this appears to be the first time that you've mentioned that you're not located in the US. When asking for recommendations that could become very specific, it's helpful if the people on the Forum know that you're in Europe, so they can potentially make recommendations that will be helpful to you. For instance, recommending "Pete's Custom Pipe Bending Shop", located on an alley off Main Street, in Chicago, would be of little help......
Not trying to be a "wise guy" here, but I've been following this discussion since it's beginning, and this appears to be the first time that you've mentioned that you're not located in the US. When asking for recommendations that could become very specific, it's helpful if the people on the Forum know that you're in Europe, so they can potentially make recommendations that will be helpful to you. For instance, recommending "Pete's Custom Pipe Bending Shop", located on an alley off Main Street, in Chicago, would be of little help......
Originally Posted by leadfoot4 Not trying to be a "wise guy" here, but I've been following this discussion since it's beginning, and this appears to be the first time that you've mentioned that you're not located in the US. When asking for recommendations that could become very specific, it's helpful if the people on the Forum know that you're in Europe, so they can potentially make recommendations that will be helpful to you. For instance, recommending "Pete's Custom Pipe Bending Shop", located on an alley off Main Street, in Chicago, would be of little help......
Originally Posted by Novusuhu
Sorry, I'll think of it in the future!
Actually Novu didn't want or ask for any technical information or a bend shop that could do his work, at least in his original post. To me sound improvements and a few more ponies are the same in Baltimore as they are in Budapest. This thread didn't get out of hand and terribly off topic until the techies and numbers guys got involved and their ego's clashed. The "my info is superior to yours" syndrome is pretty common in this forum and across the board in any forum whether it is antiques or zeppelins. If posters trying to help would stick to relevant answers maybe more people, who want to enjoy their ride at less than 6,000 rpm, would ask for help.
End of rant, Jerry
Originally Posted by leadfoot4 Not trying to be a "wise guy" here, but I've been following this discussion since it's beginning, and this appears to be the first time that you've mentioned that you're not located in the US. When asking for recommendations that could become very specific, it's helpful if the people on the Forum know that you're in Europe, so they can potentially make recommendations that will be helpful to you. For instance, recommending "Pete's Custom Pipe Bending Shop", located on an alley off Main Street, in Chicago, would be of little help......
Actually Novu didn't want or ask for any technical information or a bend shop that could do his work, at least in his original post. To me sound improvements and a few more ponies are the same in Baltimore as they are in Budapest. This thread didn't get out of hand and terribly off topic until the techies and numbers guys got involved and their ego's clashed. The "my info is superior to yours" syndrome is pretty common in this forum and across the board in any forum whether it is antiques or zeppelins. If posters trying to help would stick to relevant answers maybe more people, who want to enjoy their ride at less than 6,000 rpm, would ask for help.
End of rant, Jerry
While you hit the nail on the head,
The forum is all some of these guys have to spew their opinion as facts,
But its not a big issue and easy to deal with,
When i see a cat start listing off why he thinks he is the end all authority on a subject and should be worshipped i stop right there and write them off as being a walking pile of fertilizer and i move on,
True knowledgeable guys dont feel they have to list credentials to somehow prove themselves.
I think I found a workshop that I'm going with in the Netherlands.
I'm going for SS exhaust pipes.
Ceramic headers or not... that I'm not sure of yet.
I asked the shop for headers and they recommended these header size:
Primary tubes: 1 5/8" diameter.
Collector: 3" diameter.
What do you guys think?
Here are some pics and further info:
Flange thickness is a little thin, i would prefer 3/8" for a better seal and less chance of warping. You won't find anyone here to tell you long tube headers are bad. Ceramic coating will keep engine compartment heat down somewhat but will add cost to the set. The only other thing I would suggest is a heat shield for your starter. Headers will be very close to the large diameter starter on your vette. When I did my headers I put a small diameter starter on and wrapped it in an exhaust heat wrap tape. I hope things go smoothly and you don't have any fitment problems.
Jerry
Here is what I think. You may feel like the simple mods you are looking at will suffice for you now, but what about in the future? It sucks having to replace things like headers and exhaust if you decide to step up later to a bigger hop up or maybe a crate engine. Get a long tube header with 1 3/4" primaries and run 2.5 inch exhaust pipes. There's no downside to it. It won't be much difference in price and it's not going to kill bottom end power. You will gain power through the entire rpm range and it will be an improvement you can feel and hear.
Mike
You suggested to go for a set of long tube header with 1 3/4" primaries. The product data that I posted says:
'Primary tube diameter: 1 5/8" (in.)'
This is a little bit smaller than 1 3/4" or is that normal because it are the dimensions of the innerside?
1 5/8" primary sized headers are suggested for low-mid RPM street usage, while 1 3/4" (and larger) are more suited to high RPM usage. The 1 5/8" headers will also provide more clearance to access spark plugs, and around the starter.
01-05-2018, 01:55 PM
You guys are going to compare organ size forever! I don't think the OP is taking his car to Le Mans any time soon. And Mr, Newbie - probably not scoring any points picking a fight first time out of box! Good luck in your future posts.
