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My 1973 Black L82 Corvette

Old 07-25-2019, 11:44 PM
  #41  
Tooch1
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Consider yourself very lucky the previous owner kept all the smog items with the car. And more importantly your pump still turns freely and wasn't locked up. That can be very expensive to replace, as I'm sure you already know.
Another cool place to check for crayon marks is behind the metal kick up pan in the rear of the passenger side fenderwell. If your lucky you'll find a three digit number in white crayon. That will be your car's job number, which is found up in the top left box on your buildsheet.
Have fun, but clean things very carefully.
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Last edited by Tooch1; 07-25-2019 at 11:48 PM.
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Old 07-27-2019, 11:53 PM
  #42  
Paul Borowski
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...love this Black '73. Very cool. What are your future plans with the car long term as far as shows and possible awards? Going for NCRS Bowtie or Bloomington Gold "Survivor"? My favorites are the original Survivor type cars, especially unique, rare, cool Corvettes such as this. Thought the "special", "spec" paint cars especially were always undervalued for their "uniqueness", if that's a word. I can only imagine at cruise-ins & car shows the "There was no such thing as a Black painted '73 Corvette when new" comments.

...also what about having to "prove" the Black paint was factory? I know some people commented that to be judged it has to be shown "in primer"? Hope someday I can see the car in person at maybe a future event. In 5yrs, '73 will be the feature 50th anniversary model year @ Carlisle & Bloomington.
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Old 07-28-2019, 01:10 AM
  #43  
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Originally Posted by Paul Borowski
In 5yrs, '73 will be the feature 50th anniversary model year @ Carlisle & Bloomington.
Hi Paul. The 73 has a big handicap in the anniversary game since it shares the anniversary with the 53. The 73 turns 50 but all the focus will be on the 53 turning 70. One of the disadvantages to my favorite Vette.
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Old 07-28-2019, 03:55 AM
  #44  
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Great looking C3! Congratulations, Black on Black Looks tough on a C3, in my opinion... I also enjoy the way the car sounds! It has factory ram horns and supposed to be factory replacement mufflers, It sounds nice and crisp, that is how I would like mine to Sound. I do have a 383 with 10:5 but it sounds much more mellow with the magnaflows at idle... I like Your Sound better, much better!!!!
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:10 AM
  #45  
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Originally Posted by Tom73
Hi Paul. The 73 has a big handicap in the anniversary game since it shares the anniversary with the 53. The 73 turns 50 but all the focus will be on the 53 turning 70. One of the disadvantages to my favorite Vette.
This is true, hopefully both my 73s the Camaro and corvette will be in Chicago at the Nationals in 2023.
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:53 AM
  #46  
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Direct from the latest version of the 1973-1974 NCRS Technical Information Manual And Judging Guide

Special and Primer Jobs
Chvcrolet built very few Corvettes in special colors or in primer. In 1973, approximately thirty cars were painted black, but the paint code used was unclear. One 1973 is reported to have a SPEC code. An owner must document carefully, 1 1973 with black body color.

If the color is not designated for regular Corvette production, the paint code is different from those listed. If the car was built in primer or special color, the space on the tag before PAINT may read PRIME, SOL, SPECIAL, or some other indicator of nonstandard paint finish. The owner is responsible for documenting such deviations from standard production before judging (my emphasis). A car with SPEC or SPECIAL for the paint code without documentation (my emphasis), is assumed to have been painted in primer withour color applied. A car with a primer paint code is judged as primer. Any color coat on a car delivered in primer is causes for full deduction for wrong color. All jobs received two coats of primer, the first red and the second gray.

Back to me:

My suggestion is to look hard for a GMAD Manifest sheet for that car. If it has not been disassembled, there may be one on the gas tank, or stuck behind the dash, or under the seats, or under the carpet, or possibly even stuck in one of the frame rails. The ones I have seen for real black 1973 cars has the work "black" written on them.

You have a solid case for a black 1973 car, but the documentation is lacking. Good luck on the search for it. It will turn out to be the Holy Grail for this car.

One black 1973 that I have seen had a paint code of 4001XA, which MAY be the Ditzler paint code for Black.

You have a beautiful car.
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Old 07-28-2019, 11:02 AM
  #47  
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FYI,
I’ll be starting the resto mod on my 73 at the end of the year. I’ll have many original parts up for grabs including original suspension, everything under the hood, complete running big block, th400 numbers matching to the car.
The list will be pages long.
Once you see me start, pm me with anything you need.
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Old 07-28-2019, 01:11 PM
  #48  
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Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
I have yet to find the build sheet for the car. It was delivered to Hory Chevrolet who ordered all 30 of the black cars. It was built in the time frame of these cars. It was Documented factory black paint at the NCRS national show this year. 4001xa is the rpo code for special paint. I have that manual as well. The factory paint code for black is 848.
Then your worries are over. NCRS has confirmed it as an original black car. That is all you need.
Congrats on locating and helping preserve this rare and beautiful car.

I have also heard that 4001xa is the RPO code for special paint, and I have heard that it is the paint code for Ditzler black.

I have not seen any documentation either way.

Last edited by emccomas; 07-28-2019 at 01:14 PM.
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Old 07-28-2019, 07:55 PM
  #49  
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Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
I have yet to find the build sheet for the car. It was delivered to Hory Chevrolet who ordered all 30 of the black cars. It was built in the time frame of these cars. It was Documented factory black paint at the NCRS national show this year. 4001xa is the rpo code for special paint. I have that manual as well. The factory paint code for black is 848.
Out of curiosity, what type of documentation did NCRS provide?
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Old 07-28-2019, 10:43 PM
  #50  
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Easy there, was just curious about the documentation you said they provided. Just concerned about the judging since Spec will be judged as primer unless there is documentation of factory paint. More then likely this is one of the 30 that was painted black but in the absence of documentation it turned into a primer car as far as judging is concerned. But out side of judging it does not make any difference.

Jealous? YES, I do miss my 73 big-block 4 speed 3 owner 50k mile car that I sold last year. Really wish I had it back. 73s are the best.

Last edited by Tom73; 07-28-2019 at 10:44 PM.
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Old 07-29-2019, 02:55 AM
  #51  
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The judging manual says the owner must provide documentation, but in my experience (started judging in January of 1986), the judging team lead and other officials are going to have a lot to say about how that car is dealt with.

"Documentation" does not always mean original paperwork.

"Documentation" takes on many forms, one of which is possibly a statement by the appropriate NCRS officials that, in their opinion, the car is a factory original black car. Making that sort of determination varies from car to car, but is the case of this car, that seems to be a pretty easy call to make. Just my humble opinion.

Now, if you presented with 1973 with factory YJ8 wheels, the criteria for acceptance would go UP dramatically.

Nice car, good luck with it.

Last edited by emccomas; 07-29-2019 at 02:56 AM.
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Old 07-29-2019, 03:02 AM
  #52  
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Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
I have yet to find the build sheet for the car. It was delivered to Hory Chevrolet who ordered all 30 of the black cars. It was built in the time frame of these cars. It was Documented factory black paint at the NCRS national show this year. 4001xa is the rpo code for special paint. I have that manual as well. The factory paint code for black is 848.
It was delivered to Hory Chevrolet who ordered all 30 of the black cars. 4001xa is the rpo code for special paint.

Do you have some evidence to confirm either one of these statements. I know Hory Chevrolet ordered a bunch of the black cars, but I have heard some information nthat the numkber that went to Hory was 25 (of the 30).

Confirmation of this information would be valuable information to add to the 1973 Judging manual. Can you help?
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Old 07-29-2019, 10:13 AM
  #53  
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Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
Did you help write the judging manual? If so please dm me. I have had in depth conversations with people who did. I do have a certificate of of origin from the NCRS stating this car was delivered to Hory. I have seen copies of build sheets that have that 4001xa on them for the rpo code for special paint.
I did help write the 73-74 manual. We are always looking for info like this, particularly if it has supporting documentation.

I hsve seen your NCRS certificate, and I do not doubt that you have a real black 73.

My qyestions are more toward the statement that ALL 30 black cars were ordered through Hory. Like I said, I have also heard that Hory got 25 of the 30 black cars, with the other 5 coming through other dealer(s).

My email address is emccomas57@gmail.com. Pleaae email me so we can chat more about this fascinating subject.

Thanks

Ed McComas
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Old 07-29-2019, 10:45 AM
  #54  
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Let's not get ahead of our ski's, so to speak, on this.
Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
It has been verified factory black paint. I will let hunt4cleanair comment on that if he wants to.
The 73 to date, has not been entered into a formal, NCRS, judging event. A few selected, curious members with judging credentials looked at the car due to its unique heritage and in light of the revised 3rd edition of the 73-74 tech manual. The early preliminary indications or indicators show what appears to be factory paint. However, it has not gone through the rigors of a formal judging process. For example, on the passenger side door jamb (wish I took a picture of this), the paint finish had been aggressively polished to the extent that one can see black paint, red primer, and gray fiberglass, in that order. The mechanicals are there along with a trim tag as shown above that is stamped SPECIAL and the October build date. All of which is consistent with what we know about 30 black painted Corvettes in 1973.

It was delivered to Hory Chevrolet who ordered all 30 of the black cars. 4001xa is the rpo code for special paint.
The owner, juggernaut, currently is limited to the NCRS shipping document which shows a Hory Chevrolet delivery.

What follows is information we got from Lyle and is information he gathered from a 1973 survey a number of years back that includes buildsheets and the4001XA code from other known 73 special paint schemes. Thus, the RPO code is ZP3, not 4001XA. So there is some extrapolation and connecting the dots. However I got conflicting information, one source says its the Ditzler black paint code while other's state it is the cost code for black paint. The owner is charged $15.00 for paint and it shows on the window sticker. The actual black paint code is 848.

Having said all that, its truly a most interesting car and one worthy of campaigning through the flight judging process.
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Old 07-29-2019, 12:48 PM
  #55  
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This is why many people despise the NCRS -
FWIW one of the most recent classes on broach pads stated that if you as a judge are not 100% sure the deference always goes to the owner.
SOOOO Unless someone can explain the BLUE VIN STICKER AND WEATHER STRIPPING being over the BLACK PAINT the deference on the paint should go to the owner.

If the car had been repainted of course there would be questions, however the issue here is the car hasn't been repainted, even the paint judges stated such.
FORCING SOMEONE to change an original NEVER RESTORED CAR with the original paint in order to get ZERO deductions for wrong paint is STUPIDITY..

Furthermore the judges must provide an UNEQUIVOCAL EXPLANATION AS TO how the weatherstripping along with the BLUE VIN STICKER AND tire pressure decals were placed over the black paint because the blue VIN sticker was required by federal law to be affixed to the vehicle. IT would not have been shipped separately to the dealership for the dealer to affix after painting the car.
Without providing the above answers no amount of reasoning can overcome the obvious. FACTORY AFFIXED STICKERS AND SEALS ARE OVER BLACK PAINT which must be explained in order to come to a different conclusion.
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Old 07-29-2019, 01:09 PM
  #56  
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Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
The car will never be judged or taken to any show like that. I’m so done.....
good bye.. this account will be deleted after today....
At my age and financial situation, I know I will never have the good luck to own a car like yours. I have followed the thread with great interest since its start. Unless some posts have been deleted, nothing I have read seems that demeaning. Perhaps if I was in your shoes, I would feel differently. I hope you reconsider leaving the forum. I joined to learn and renew my 50 year love affair with C3s, and offer my opinion if appropriate. Good luck with your 73 and your decision.
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Old 07-29-2019, 02:33 PM
  #57  
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You're going off without reading my post above!
Originally Posted by firstgenaddict
This is why many people despise the NCRS -
FWIW one of the most recent classes on broach pads stated that if you as a judge are not 100% sure the deference always goes to the owner.
SOOOO Unless someone can explain the BLUE VIN STICKER AND WEATHER STRIPPING being over the BLACK PAINT the deference on the paint should go to the owner.
There was no judging!
If the car had been repainted of course there would be questions, however the issue here is the car hasn't been repainted, even the paint judges stated such.
There were no paint judges!

Furthermore the judges must provide an UNEQUIVOCAL EXPLANATION AS TO how the weatherstripping along with the BLUE VIN STICKER AND tire pressure decals were placed over the black paint because the blue VIN sticker was required by federal law to be affixed to the vehicle. IT would not have been shipped separately to the dealership for the dealer to affix after painting the car.
Without providing the above answers no amount of reasoning can overcome the obvious. FACTORY AFFIXED STICKERS AND SEALS ARE OVER BLACK PAINT which must be explained in order to come to a different conclusion.
What's the point...stickers under the paint?
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Old 07-29-2019, 02:34 PM
  #58  
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Originally Posted by slammin
At my age and financial situation, I know I will never have the good luck to own a car like yours. I have followed the thread with great interest since its start. Unless some posts have been deleted, nothing I have read seems that demeaning. Perhaps if I was in your shoes, I would feel differently. I hope you reconsider leaving the forum. I joined to learn and renew my 50 year love affair with C3s, and offer my opinion if appropriate. Good luck with your 73 and your decision.
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Old 07-29-2019, 03:12 PM
  #59  
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Originally Posted by juggernautZ06
So when you told me that a paint judge looked at it and told you it was factory painted. I guess that was bull **** uh? This is exactly why I am done... This is the kindergarten bull **** I don’t have time for. Either it is factory paint or it isn’t. I’m going to the woods to to prepare for deer season. I’m done with what everyone thinks. The funny thing is you think I actually care. Because I don’t... I don’t need anyone to validate the car. Good bye
The Corvette was in a vendor space and not subjected to the rigors of an NCRS judging process. But the views of knowledgeable individuals were promising but, as the owner, do not deny the organization the benefit of a comprehensive review. Your comments suggest you are jumping to the end and claiming victory without the patience of the often criticized process of deliberation and study. Like it or not...that's the reality. The paint application hasn't changed...it's still what it is as noted above. Be appreciative.
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Old 07-29-2019, 06:32 PM
  #60  
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My suggestion to the OP, and the owner of the car in. question is to STOP getting into these needless debates. They are meaningless, and frustrating.

LET THE CAR SPEAK FOR ITSELF!

Who cares what other people think, what matters is how the car presents itself, and how it "speaks" for itself.

I have lost count over the number of owners that have gotten in a tizzy over something they THINK someone said, and dropped out of the process.

Let the process do it's job, one of which is to let the car speak for itself. Ignore all of the other banter.

You have a fascinating car, with some real potential to have it established as something special and rare.

The NCRS paint judges know what they are doing, and they know all of the tricks that many people have tried over the years. They do not have to prove anything to anyone.

They may, as a courtesy, explain their process, and how they arrived at their decisions after completing their examination.

So, stop talking about the car, and let the car start talking.

When someone posts something inflammatory, IGNORE IT.

I hope you bring to car the NCRS, and let the process do its job. I think you will be pleasantly surprised. But even if not, you still have a fascinating car.

Ed
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