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were the 15" tire really better and perform better 40 years ago? or is it just that people get more hung up on nonsense like z rating that didnt even exist 40 years ago with corvettes? I believe that even the SUV marketed tires of today would out perform the tires that came on these cars... why should modern performance racing style tires be made for a classic car? if you want the old look you should be just as happy with the limited performance of the era right? Its kind of like complaining that they dont make a z rated wide whitewall when they never did..
Last edited by augiedoggy; 05-13-2016 at 07:10 PM.
I will add to Augiedoggy comment to say that this silliness of longing for performance tires implies that there is any significant number of people owning and driving C3 Corvettes on public roads as if they were race cars. I almost never even see another C3 Corvette on the roads of Pennsylvania, let alone see some guy slamming the curves in the back roads pushing the limits of a Goodrich Radial TA. I am sure there may be three or four people in the world that do this......As for guys racing cars on race tracks, I guess there is a reason for them to have better tires, but how many is that, 10 guys?
Most of these cars are owned by old men who NEVER drive their cars, or if they do they go to the Pizza Hut cars show on THursday night, a few weeks in the summer, and break out their lawn chairs and restoration books, with little stuffed animals sitting on the seats, for two hours, and then drive it back to the garage for another year in storage.
Really, who are these people who long for performance? Are they real? Note to you guys, BUY A REAL AND MODERN PERFORMANCE CAR if that is what you want.....and realize it might be a Honda Civic!
One more thing while I am at it.....putting 17 or 18 inch wheels on an C3 Vette might make the car handle better......it no longer looks like it did when they built it. Not criticizing someone for thinking they look better....its a matter of opinion! But its not a statement of fact....only an opinion.
I love my car, and think it is the most beautiful thing GM ever built, but it is what it is when it comes to "performance"....and as Augiedoggy implies, a Goodrich Radial TA is way more tire than you will ever need.
Last edited by Torqued Off; 05-13-2016 at 07:42 PM.
Cooper tires has some nice Cobra radial g t tires, similar to bfg radial ta's in 10 different 15" sizes. Available at many dealers. I just bought 2 255-70-15 cobras for $111 each shipped to my door. I think discount tire stores will sell for the same price. I believe they are still made in the USA. I have cobras on my 93 chevy stepside and they ride and corner great.
Me too I prefer the look of the 15' tyres. Each on his own.
As well, I am looking to buy a new set of rubber. So, Avon CR6 ZZ looks terrific and legal, Goodyear Blue Streak superb but not legal , Hoosier Racing vintage, DOT but not legal (?) and I read about the BFG Comp T/A R1. Does someone has experience with this one ?
Living in Australia, the choice for normal 15' is even poorer!
Price? I will pay what it is necessary to stay on the road, not wanting to soil myself at every tight corners.
About the Michelin TB. Excellent, I have experienced them on rally cars back then in France. But they wear out quite quickly. Well! My daily driver was my weekend rally car as well !! Things you do when you are young !!
I would add that it is no need to always criticise or put down other OP for, dare I say, to be different.
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Last edited by OZGreen69; 05-13-2016 at 09:01 PM.
Reason: bad mood
And yet there are times when people - **** or not - post questions and invariable someone asks did you do a forum search. So you do a forum search, post a statement or ask a question on something that wasn't made clear, and then you get blasted for bringing up an old post. Can't win for loosing.
I have written extensively about why ultra high performance summer only ZR tires in 17/18 sizes are far superior to the crap 15 inch S/T rated tires for C3's and it is NOT just about racing on the street or carving up canyon roads at absurd illegal speeds..not even close. I went from 255/60/15 BFG TA's which I hated since the car bounced all over the road with bumps, tracked poorly on smooth roads, and handling was marginal to 255/45/17 ZR tires. The difference in wet/dry traction, braking, steering response, tracking down the road and RIDE quality was night and day to the 255/60/15's.....zero comparison. I don't race my 78 nor do I drive like a lunatic on the street but the tire change transformed the character of the C3 for NORMAL driving. And Yes, if you want a modern high performance car, it is probably best to buy one since the C3 is not capable of competing without extensive upgrades and changes to the suspension....I have a 2010 C6Z06 for that....
Well just to clarify The point I was trying to make is the 15" tires avaliable now outperform the original 15" tires that were around in the c3 hay days... As I see it, to complain that their isnt a higher performance z rated 15" tire is like complaining they dont make High definition tapes for ones VCR... The design limitations and lack of demand make it an unprofitable venture for the tire manufacturers. especially since lower profile wheels are the avaliable high performance option for the people that wish to have it.
Well just to clarify The point I was trying to make is the 15" tires avaliable now outperform the original 15" tires that were around in the c3 hay days... As I see it, to complain that their isnt a higher performance z rated 15" tire is like complaining they dont make High definition tapes for ones VCR... The design limitations and lack of demand make it an unprofitable venture for the tire manufacturers. especially since lower profile wheels are the avaliable high performance option for the people that wish to have it.
I am not looking to beat this issue to death but in 1983 I replaced the OEM 255/60/15 Eagle GT's on my 78 with another set of Eagle GT's which were on the car until the 90's. At that time, I replaced the second set of Eagle GT's with BFG Radial TA's 255/60/15 (which are still on my OEM 15 inch rims in the garage) and I have to tell you that there was no difference in performance, handling, steering, and ride between the OEM Goodyear Eagle GT's that came on the car when made (October 1977) and the later BFG's...none...both were pretty much mass market passenger tires with raised white lettering. Is there a difference between a BFG Radial TA and the early C3 bias ply tires...absolutely but more a function of the superior construction of radial tires versus Bias ply tires....Until you put a set of true high performance Z rated tires on a C3, you just cannot believe the difference.....
I have written extensively about why ultra high performance summer only ZR tires in 17/18 sizes are far superior to the crap 15 inch S/T rated tires for C3's and it is NOT just about racing on the street or carving up canyon roads at absurd illegal speeds..not even close. I went from 255/60/15 BFG TA's which I hated since the car bounced all over the road with bumps, tracked poorly on smooth roads, and handling was marginal to 255/45/17 ZR tires. The difference in wet/dry traction, braking, steering response, tracking down the road and RIDE quality was night and day to the 255/60/15's.....zero comparison. I don't race my 78 nor do I drive like a lunatic on the street but the tire change transformed the character of the C3 for NORMAL driving. And Yes, if you want a modern high performance car, it is probably best to buy one since the C3 is not capable of competing without extensive upgrades and changes to the suspension....I have a 2010 C6Z06 for that....
Not to change my previous comments, but I do respect your regular postings on performance, including tires. My problem is that 17 and 18 inch wheels, no matter which ones, just don't look right on my 77 Corvette.....I don't even like them on new cars. I guess a guy born in 1958, who likes older cars and their simple technology, has different priorities. I have no doubt they might do all that you say they do, but I find my Corvette to do exactly what I need it to do on 15 inch Goodrich Radial TA, and I think they look perfect on the car. And that goes to my primary point....many of us who own C3 Corvettes, bought and own C3 Corvettes for exactly what they where when built.....and thats good enough....in fact, I think my car is the best car on the planet.
Last edited by Torqued Off; 05-15-2016 at 08:07 PM.
Fair enough... But as can be seen by many of the posts in this forum, many of us prefer to modify our cars to make them more enjoyable to drive, and do enjoy driving our cars hard - just as many people modified them and drove them hard when they were new. Also, there did used to be 15" tyres available that were performance road tyres, whereas now you have to choose between short lived and expensive race rubber, or rock hard rubbish street tyres... Not to mention the 15" tyres are more expensive than 17 and 18" tyres, and less available. If I could have chosen a decent street performance 15" tyre I probably would have stayed with my 15"s. As it was, I bought my 17"s and some good performance street tyres for the same cost as I was looking at for a set of ok 15" tyres.
...I went from 255/60/15 BFG TA's which I hated since the car bounced all over the road with bumps, tracked poorly on smooth roads, and handling was marginal to 255/45/17 ZR tires.
I'm shopping for 18's and 255/55/18 tires myself but I do respect the classic look and those that prefer it...Some like the look more and I can also see this as an age thing as the older I get the more I dislike change..
I think 17 or 18" wheels actually look great with the extreme curvy body lines. I imagine if there were a lot of people around who bought the early 50's vettes new they would not care for the c3s exaggerated lines for the same reasons. look at how many older vette guys dont like the newer vettes..
Hell im still in my 30's and I cant stand this new "Bro country" rap stuff thats mostly about getting drunk and smoking up it seems.. My nephew just thinks im old. But life goes on and things change... Classic country doesnt sell/ perform like it used to. I still complain about it every chance I can and I guess thats no different that this.
I guess I just think if someone was that interested in performance they would move to an all around superior tire with more advantages over a 15" wheel with huge sidewalls no matter what tpye of rubber its made of. The 15" classic car tires are sold for aesthetics these days and thats what likely 99% of people are more interested in who use them... If there really was a larger demand It would make sense that a tire manufacturer would still be making them instead of discontinuing them right?
Last edited by augiedoggy; 05-16-2016 at 09:12 AM.
Sure, until a ******** cuts you off and that POS Radial T/A doesn't have enough grip for you to avoid the accident.
I seriously doubt this is true, and at the point at which they won't grip, you have far exceeded 95% of the average drivers ability to control the car anyway. Only race boys have the experience to handle it when it gets to this point, not the average C3 Corvette owner.
Following your arguments, there is no reason to upgrade 60's era cars with disk brakes or larger swaybars or any other handling improvements either.
I agree, whats wrong with stock four wheel disc brakes, and stock sway bars, again, the theory is the average guy knows anything at all about how to drive a real performance car. I certainly don't claim to, and most of the people who THINK they know how to drive a performance car end up dead or killing someone else. The highways are for the public, not race boy wannabees
I dumped the Radial T/A's that were on my 65 Impala. They were too little tire for that car and that car performs way worse than a C3.
Whatever
Last edited by Torqued Off; 05-17-2016 at 06:00 PM.
I am going to jump back in here. The difference in braking between a "good tire" and a pos t/a radial type tire is significant to say the least. This is saying nothing about the differences in construction between a typical s or t rated tire and h or above. Hopefully it is never needed but you would notice the difference.
S and T rated tires have no cap ply over the belts whereas h usually has a full cap. V rated and up usually have 2 caps. Which categories do you think have most tire failures? And which categories do you think have next to none?
Lionelhutz was trying to give you some good information, and a little searching and you can learn a lot about tires. You may be right that most don't need anymore than the crappy s and t rated tires, but some of us use our cars in a way to see a difference. A higher speed rated tire is safer in ALL circumstances, and at any speed. If you were to drive on 3 identical tires with the only variable being speed rating, you would feel the difference immediately. In handling and braking.
But, WHATEVER, sounds like you already got it all figured out.
Most of these cars are owned by old men who NEVER drive their cars, or if they do they go to the Pizza Hut cars show on THursday night, a few weeks in the summer, and break out their lawn chairs and restoration books, with little stuffed animals sitting on the seats, for two hours, and then drive it back to the garage for another year in storage.
I kind of fit into that category but it's Hardee's in Stanley on Friday's. My Corvette does not stay parked for the rest of the year either. I'll often take a ride someplace just for fun because the weather is good through all four seasons.
Here's a picture from a few weeks ago.
As far as performance I've got 195 HP so I'm not tempted to try to beat the car up, not to mention the thousands of dollars I've spent and the hours of labor trying to keep it road worthy.
17 or 18-inch performance tires are fine but I like the rims that I have so I kept 15" tires on mine.
PS: to jb78L-82 if you are not a tire salesman you should be as you surely make a convincing argument why we should upgrade. LOL!
Pete.
As mentioned, an original look is important to me as well, however, enjoyable driving is important also.
My compromise was 17" rally wheels. I have manual steering and one of the benefits of the Michelin tires was an incredible improvement in steering.
I wasn't looking to go around corners faster, just to have a car that felt more stable and was more of a pleasure to drive.
Yes, better traction, lower sidewall heights and a stiffer carcass do nothing to improve braking or car stability during fast steering maneuvers.
The disk brakes and big swaybars I put on my Impala also did nothing to improve the car's braking and stability either.
For me, it is not about trying to be a "race boy" or any other BS you keep posting. It's about improving my older cars so they at least have a fighting chance against the capabilities of the cars of today.
EVERYONE on the road should be capable of handle their car at it's limits in an emergency situation.
Also, I didn't post about improving 60's era Corvettes with disk brakes and bigger swaybars, I posted 60's era cars, most of which came with drum brakes and only small front swaybars. Maybe you should learn to read?
Last edited by lionelhutz; 05-18-2016 at 01:50 AM.
05-13-2016, 07:04 PM
