C3 Tech/Performance V8 Technical Info, Internal Engine, External Engine, Basic Tech and Maintenance for the C3 Corvette
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Has there been any giant scientific gains in removing broken header bolts?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 10-04-2016, 07:45 PM
  #21  
'75
Le Mans Master
 
'75's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2007
Location: McHenry Illinois
Posts: 6,416
Received 582 Likes on 504 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by Scottd
The bolt is NOT rusted in and IS most likely bottomed out. I dont think there will be enough sticking above the head to weld a nut on. I was hoping that some kind of reverse drill bit and a centering tool existed. Im sure that once a drill bit grabs it, it will twist right out...but getting in there is going to suck.
I think that if a drill bit grabs it, then you will have a broken drill bit in the hole also! You said the bolt is bottomed out and torqued hard enough to break it, it will take at least that much torque to get it loose from the bottom of the hole.

If the bolt is broken off flush with the head or even below, welding the washer on gets good heat to the bolt and easy to get penetration, the nut is welded on to the washer to add more heat and a place to put the tool. If a little weld gets on the head around the bolt, it wont stick, head is cast iron. But if you can't weld then you're stuck with less effective methods.

I'm a heavy equipment mechanic by trade and have removed hundreds of broken bolts from places you wouldn't believe. I made a lot of mistakes before I got good at it, there was no internet or youtube back then.
Old 10-04-2016, 07:58 PM
  #22  
mark79,80
Melting Slicks
 
mark79,80's Avatar
 
Member Since: Oct 2000
Location: Englewood FL
Posts: 2,121
Received 181 Likes on 131 Posts

Default

Your safest way to remove the broken bolt is to have a nut welded to the end, and then remove with a socket or wrench. I would be leary of using a right angle drill, as it would be easy to get it off center and damage the head. Also if you are drilling in preparation for using an easy out, and it breaks off, you have more problems.

If you don't have a mig welder, I would contact a tire/muffler shop as they deal with broken bolts on a regular basis. I have used a store in Ithaca called Trombley Tire to remove some broken bolts with good success, and they use the mig welding nut method. They also have a store in Cortland if you can't find a shop closer.

Another alternative would be to have a welder come to your garage. In my area I see ads in the local shopper and in the automotive service section on Craig's list for welders that offer mobile service.
Old 10-05-2016, 06:37 PM
  #23  
terry82
Le Mans Master
 
terry82's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 2000
Location: columbia city in
Posts: 6,636
Received 158 Likes on 144 Posts

Default

I have removed broken bolts using a engraving tool.the vibration of the tool helps to back it out.
Old 10-05-2016, 07:03 PM
  #24  
DUB
Race Director
 
DUB's Avatar
 
Member Since: Apr 2009
Location: Charlotte NC
Posts: 19,294
Received 2,713 Likes on 2,321 Posts

Default

Originally Posted by redvetracr
you want new technology? find someone with an EDM machine
I got one. Unfortunately...I can only use it with the part off the car. I wish it could be more mobile or hand held...but that is just not going to happen.


Originally Posted by Scottd
Removing the head will be my LAST resort, absolute last ditch, I cant get anything to work option. Hell, I may pull the engine out of the car to get at the bolt before I rip the head off.

I can clearly understand why you are thinking this. I often times have to 'think' like that also because I am doing this on customers Corvettes. And depending on the year model Corvette I am working on. I can pull an engine faster than doing a head gasket....and then having to tell a customer all of the 'unknowns' that I just found by pulling the head. It can quickly 'snowball' out of control.


Im still looking at the sheared bolt and I think the remnant is going to be flush with the head or just below. Im praying I can knock it loose with a hammer and chisel. After that I will explore drilling it, but Illl need to invest in a right angle drill and some way to make sure I stay perpendicular to the screw. Its all going to come down to how much room I have in the engine bay. I may even unbolt the drivers side motor mount to get it up an extra inch or two.
Hopefully your method works. I HAVE BEEN there...so I do know. i have to weigh the options...and sometimes...I have no choice but to remove a part. Because IF I can find way that will allow me to get the broken bolt out faster and still do it right...I will go that route. BUT...I also know when to 'throw in the towel'...and begin taking parts off.

DUB
Old 10-06-2016, 12:36 PM
  #25  
69FASTFUN
Drifting
 
69FASTFUN's Avatar
 
Member Since: Aug 2006
Location: Scottsdale Arizona
Posts: 1,671
Received 178 Likes on 140 Posts

Default

You might try this product from Loctit it freezes the bolt and releases the rust

http://www.na.henkel-adhesives.com/a...=8797940809729

http://www.mscdirect.com/product/det...rItem=74233156
Old 10-07-2016, 02:23 AM
  #26  
bmans vette
Race Director
Support Corvetteforum!
 
bmans vette's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2006
Location: Athens GA
Posts: 19,446
Received 351 Likes on 304 Posts
St. Jude Donor '12-'13, '15- '16-'17-'18-'19, '21

Default

Did not see any mention of what material the heads are made of.....iron or aluminum.
No mention that I recall of how long the bolt was in the head either.

Quick reminder...if steel bolt and aluminum head make sure to use anti-seize on the threads.
I'd also go with ARP studs if they will fit.

IMHO

Bman (Dennis)
Old 10-07-2016, 09:55 AM
  #27  
jnb5101
Le Mans Master
 
jnb5101's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 2006
Location: charlotte north carolina
Posts: 8,117
Likes: 0
Received 100 Likes on 92 Posts

Default

Don't use the standard copper anti-sieze with aluminum heads. Use the special anti-seize made for aluminum.
Old 10-07-2016, 10:48 AM
  #28  
Scottd
Drifting
Thread Starter
 
Scottd's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jul 2011
Location: Syracuse NY
Posts: 1,697
Received 139 Likes on 80 Posts

Default

The bolt is snapped about 1/16th below the head. I have a cheap HF gasless MIG welder that Im somewhat proficient with, but I don't understand how I can attempt to weld to this bolt without the weld flowing onto and into the bolt threads?

Im planning on making a centering jig and drilling it in successfully larger sizes until it spins out.
Old 10-07-2016, 05:59 PM
  #29  
DUB
Race Director
 
DUB's Avatar
 
Member Since: Apr 2009
Location: Charlotte NC
Posts: 19,294
Received 2,713 Likes on 2,321 Posts

Default

NOT that what I going to write will help you...but it has worked for me.

I have been in this situation..and took my Dremel tool and cleaned the broken end of the bolt so it is clean to weld on....because normally it has been broken for a long time and rusted or crap has gotten on the end of it.

I then take my oxy/acetylene torch and pre-heat JUST the bolt....so I get a good pin point on my torch and get the bolt hot...so I know when I go and use my MIG welder...the weld will usually take and penetrate a bit better than if I try to weld it with the bolt being cold. I usually do a 1/2 second or 3/4 second blast with my welder...which as you know depends on your wire speed and heat range you have set it at. But I get the first weld to stick good..and then when it goes off of being cherry red...I weld on that first weld spot again...and I keep doing that until I actually build out a small shaft that I can either clamp a set of Vise-grips on or weld something onto that.

THEN...it is hoping that my FIRST WELD took good...and I begin the process of slowly rocking my pliers back and forth and hope I can get the bolt to begin to move. Because if I can get it to move a 'frog hair' ..I know I WON and I can get it out.

I will also often times try to use some wax so it can wick into the threaded area...depending on the angle I am working on.

DUB
Old 10-07-2016, 07:55 PM
  #30  
tommy1727
Pro
 
tommy1727's Avatar
 
Member Since: Dec 2005
Location: Orlando Fl.
Posts: 577
Received 1 Like on 1 Post

Default

I faced a very similar dilemma just this week, albeit it during an attempt to install headers on a 1979 that had not been touched since new. All but one original manifold bolt came out without a hitch. Unfortunately one broke off flush. I thought about pulling the head., but decided to drill with it on. Big mistake! Not much room in there and I could have swore I center punched the stud dead in the center on the second attempt, but alas I had not! Some mistakes you can't back up from! I'm now buying new heads, which was planned down the road, just not now. Live and learn. Sometimes shortcuts work out, mostly they don't. Long and short of this diatribe...take the head off. chances of success increase dramatically in my now humble opinion! I wish you success. If anyone has head recommendations, I'm all ears.
Old 10-09-2016, 08:37 AM
  #31  
metal tech
Racer
 
metal tech's Avatar
 
Member Since: Mar 2003
Location: OKC OK
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 33 Likes on 28 Posts

Default

http://maniboltdriller.com

Give this a look, it maybe be something your looking to use
The following users liked this post:
Rescue Rogers (10-09-2016)
Old 10-10-2016, 07:29 PM
  #32  
bmans vette
Race Director
Support Corvetteforum!
 
bmans vette's Avatar
 
Member Since: Nov 2006
Location: Athens GA
Posts: 19,446
Received 351 Likes on 304 Posts
St. Jude Donor '12-'13, '15- '16-'17-'18-'19, '21

Default

Originally Posted by jnb5101
Don't use the standard copper anti-sieze with aluminum heads. Use the special anti-seize made for aluminum.
Old 10-12-2016, 10:10 AM
  #33  
bluedawg
Safety Car
 
bluedawg's Avatar
 
Member Since: Jan 2009
Location: anchorage ak
Posts: 3,736
Received 55 Likes on 53 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by '75
The reverse drill bit only works if the bolt is not tight by rust or being bottomed out. In that case it works the same as a regular bit, just drills out metal. If the bolt is bottomed out, then trying to use an easy out will likely not end well either. If I were doing it, I would remove the header and weld a washer to the bolt, then weld a nut to the washer, put a box end wrench on it and gently try to loosen it. If the washer and nut breaks off, weld on another set, it will eventually come out.
Originally Posted by vbgod1
Left hand bit set, a 90 degree drill and center punch. Punch, go slow in left hand direction. If the gods choose to smile on you today...

Example. http://www.irwin.com/tools/drill-bit...drill-bit-sets
Originally Posted by Scottd
Im a little embarrassed to admit this....as explained earlier, I had to make a spacer to fit the alternator bracket to the head. I didn't have the proper length bolt around so I filed one down. It must have bottomed against the hole and I just kept twisting. To make matters worse, there was no 'grading' marks on the bolt head, so it was probably sub standard to begin with.

My biggest worry is actually getting in there to work. Not much room at all, and I doubt I can even get a center punch in there.

I've always had this work for me even with rusted in bolts. The thing to use is a pneumatic drill as they are a lot smaller, center punch the shank if you can, and start drilling slowly and be ready for it to grab. If you go slow and easy you won't break the bit, if it don't work, you needed a hole drilled in it any how. Good luck.

Last edited by bluedawg; 10-12-2016 at 10:13 AM. Reason: Shitty spelling, bad coffee and I suck at typing on my phone while driving...



Quick Reply: Has there been any giant scientific gains in removing broken header bolts?



All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:51 PM.