AmericanAuto Wire E-Choke
10-08-2017, 04:50 PM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
AmericanAuto Wire E-Choke
On the American Auto Wire FAQ's page it states if you have things like Idle stop solenoids, TCS spark control's, Turbo 400 kickdown power ect. you could use on of these for e-choke power. Is this accurate. I know the tan wire(s) is all part of the same key on the accessory circuit, not hot during cranking. thanks in advance. tom
10-08-2017, 06:59 PM
#2
Race Director
Tom,
I would assume that they are correct...but I would need to know how many amps this electric choke needs to operate....and then see if the cirucit that they are recommending to use is good to go for that....and that is assuming that IF that same wire circuit is actually being used for other components...that the amount of amp draw is not to excessive for the size (gauge) of the wire....which I seriously doubt....but it is still worth checking into.
DUB
I would assume that they are correct...but I would need to know how many amps this electric choke needs to operate....and then see if the cirucit that they are recommending to use is good to go for that....and that is assuming that IF that same wire circuit is actually being used for other components...that the amount of amp draw is not to excessive for the size (gauge) of the wire....which I seriously doubt....but it is still worth checking into.
DUB
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vette8121 (10-09-2017)
10-08-2017, 07:19 PM
#3
Instructor
Thread Starter
Tom,
I would assume that they are correct...but I would need to know how many amps this electric choke needs to operate....and then see if the cirucit that they are recommending to use is good to go for that....and that is assuming that IF that same wire circuit is actually being used for other components...that the amount of amp draw is not to excessive for the size (gauge) of the wire....which I seriously doubt....but it is still worth checking into.
DUB
I would assume that they are correct...but I would need to know how many amps this electric choke needs to operate....and then see if the cirucit that they are recommending to use is good to go for that....and that is assuming that IF that same wire circuit is actually being used for other components...that the amount of amp draw is not to excessive for the size (gauge) of the wire....which I seriously doubt....but it is still worth checking into.
DUB
harnesses and the carb idle solenoid & TCS stuff is not being used. I want to use the idle stop solenoid because it appears to be the same AWG(18) and it's close to the choke. tm
10-08-2017, 07:24 PM
#4
Race Director
Hi DUB, thanks for the feedback, I'm using AAW as my source because I've replaced my engine harness with one of their Factory Fit engine
harnesses and the carb idle solenoid & TCS stuff is not being used. I want to use the idle stop solenoid because it appears to be the same AWG(18) and it's close to the choke. tm
harnesses and the carb idle solenoid & TCS stuff is not being used. I want to use the idle stop solenoid because it appears to be the same AWG(18) and it's close to the choke. tm
Knowing that the wire is now going to be dedicated for your electric choke..I feel you should be okay with it...but I would still confirm on how many amps it needs to work. When it comes to electrical stuff...unless I know it like the back of my hand..I call and verify so I do not have any surprises. I have a saying at my shop..."Assumptions are the mother of all f-ups."
DUB
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vette8121 (10-09-2017)
10-08-2017, 09:07 PM
#5
Instructor
Thread Starter
Knowing that the wire is now going to be dedicated for your electric choke..I feel you should be okay with it...but I would still confirm on how many amps it needs to work. When it comes to electrical stuff...unless I know it like the back of my hand..I call and verify so I do not have any surprises. I have a saying at my shop..."Assumptions are the mother of all f-ups."
DUB
10-09-2017, 05:45 AM
#6
Team Owner
Once you find out the specs of the unit then you can figure out what protection you'll need.
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vette8121 (10-09-2017)
10-09-2017, 12:37 PM
#7
Instructor
Thread Starter
Your calculation are correct. I just can't see an electric choke pulling 8 amps to work. That's a lot. Are you sure it's not 150 or 1.5K ohms even 15 ohms? That makes a lot more sense to me. BTW I'm an electronics engineer by trade.
Once you find out the specs of the unit then you can figure out what protection you'll need.
Once you find out the specs of the unit then you can figure out what protection you'll need.
10-09-2017, 02:12 PM
#8
Burning Brakes
Member Since: Jan 2006
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I have used the idle solenoid power source to run the electric choke on a Holley Street Avenger with no issues on several occasions, so it should work on your carb as well.
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vette8121 (10-09-2017)
10-09-2017, 02:43 PM
#9
Instructor
Thread Starter
Hi Dan, thanks for the interest, this all started because I just installed a Holley 770cfm Street Avenger w/eChoke. Do you like the carb? Did you use a inline fuse? tm
10-09-2017, 03:16 PM
#10
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Thanks, I was using those #'s as an example, to make sure I'm doing it right, I measure resistance at the choke thermostat using 12volts, then use amps = voltage/resistance and go on from there. I know all this just for a choke seems to be a waist of time but I'm trying to understand automobile wiring. I don't want to make a mistake I might regret. I'm sure some folks are saying just tap in to the wiper motor! I just thought there's a wire(s) not doing anything, why not use it. Again many thanks to all. tm
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Last time I tested the current draw on an electric choke that was sitting around- it spiked at 6.5 amps and dropped to 1.3 amps. After that while the coil heats up, it steadily dropped from 1.3 and leveled out at about .75 amps. A 10A fuse should be fine.
Richard
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vette8121 (10-09-2017)
10-09-2017, 03:32 PM
#11
Instructor
Thread Starter
There are two ignition sources-
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Last time I tested the current draw on an electric choke that was sitting around- it spiked at 6.5 amps and dropped to 1.3 amps. After that while the coil heats up, it steadily dropped from 1.3 and leveled out at about .75 amps. A 10A fuse should be fine.
Richard
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Last time I tested the current draw on an electric choke that was sitting around- it spiked at 6.5 amps and dropped to 1.3 amps. After that while the coil heats up, it steadily dropped from 1.3 and leveled out at about .75 amps. A 10A fuse should be fine.
Richard
10-09-2017, 04:19 PM
#12
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And make sure it doesn't interfere w/ the linkage
Plus- use the right wire- there is 'primary wire' sold just about everywhere- autoparts stores- Summit- Jegs etc- BUT get the "SXL" type wire that is designed to handle the heat under the hood and whatever else (gasoline) might come in contact with.
I know Summit sells this wire and I believe NAPA does as well-16GU is fine.
Last edited by Richard454; 10-09-2017 at 04:19 PM.
10-09-2017, 06:10 PM
#13
Race Director
'vette8121'
Please excuse me for a moment due to I need to reply to what 'Richard454' wrote....adn it does apply to this thread in some n context.
Richard.
You know that I know that you know wiring....right? And I feel you know that I also know wiring...but maybe not on the level that you are taking your build.
But I am a bit confused and I will explain.
You wrote:
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Where I am confused is this and here are my thoughts. An electric choke does not need 12 volts going to it when the engine is being cranked...because it is spring loaded and will set when the gas pedal is pressed if the engine is cold or choke has not recently been used and is no longer hot and allowing the choke to re-set. But the choke does need 12 volts when the key is in the run position and the engine is running in order for it to do what it is designed to do.
So having the 12 volt power come from ACC is fine...the way I am thinking...becasue as long as the choke is getting 12 volts when the key is in the run position...it should not have to have it come from IGN. Unless you know something I am not aware of.
When I am wiring a bunch of 'things' in on a custom build....I often times make every attempt to use the ACC circuit as much as possible so those new components do not draw any current when the engine is trying to crank. Knowing that the cranking circuit is the one circuit that commands the most amps ...I feel that each and every amp can make a difference.
Your views and philosophy on this would be greatly appreciated.
DUB
Please excuse me for a moment due to I need to reply to what 'Richard454' wrote....adn it does apply to this thread in some n context.
Richard.
You know that I know that you know wiring....right? And I feel you know that I also know wiring...but maybe not on the level that you are taking your build.
But I am a bit confused and I will explain.
You wrote:
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Where I am confused is this and here are my thoughts. An electric choke does not need 12 volts going to it when the engine is being cranked...because it is spring loaded and will set when the gas pedal is pressed if the engine is cold or choke has not recently been used and is no longer hot and allowing the choke to re-set. But the choke does need 12 volts when the key is in the run position and the engine is running in order for it to do what it is designed to do.
So having the 12 volt power come from ACC is fine...the way I am thinking...becasue as long as the choke is getting 12 volts when the key is in the run position...it should not have to have it come from IGN. Unless you know something I am not aware of.
When I am wiring a bunch of 'things' in on a custom build....I often times make every attempt to use the ACC circuit as much as possible so those new components do not draw any current when the engine is trying to crank. Knowing that the cranking circuit is the one circuit that commands the most amps ...I feel that each and every amp can make a difference.
Your views and philosophy on this would be greatly appreciated.
DUB
10-09-2017, 08:57 PM
#14
Burning Brakes
Member Since: Jan 2006
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The SA is my go to carb when I have issues with the original Holley, which is a fairly frequent thing. It always ran fine with the SA. I did not use an inline fuse, but that’s probably not a bad idea.
10-09-2017, 09:48 PM
#15
Le Mans Master
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'vette8121'
Please excuse me for a moment due to I need to reply to what 'Richard454' wrote....adn it does apply to this thread in some n context.
Richard.
You know that I know that you know wiring....right? And I feel you know that I also know wiring...but maybe not on the level that you are taking your build.
But I am a bit confused and I will explain.
You wrote:
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Where I am confused is this and here are my thoughts. An electric choke does not need 12 volts going to it when the engine is being cranked...because it is spring loaded and will set when the gas pedal is pressed if the engine is cold or choke has not recently been used and is no longer hot and allowing the choke to re-set. But the choke does need 12 volts when the key is in the run position and the engine is running in order for it to do what it is designed to do.
So having the 12 volt power come from ACC is fine...the way I am thinking...becasue as long as the choke is getting 12 volts when the key is in the run position...it should not have to have it come from IGN. Unless you know something I am not aware of.
When I am wiring a bunch of 'things' in on a custom build....I often times make every attempt to use the ACC circuit as much as possible so those new components do not draw any current when the engine is trying to crank. Knowing that the cranking circuit is the one circuit that commands the most amps ...I feel that each and every amp can make a difference.
Your views and philosophy on this would be greatly appreciated.
DUB
Please excuse me for a moment due to I need to reply to what 'Richard454' wrote....adn it does apply to this thread in some n context.
Richard.
You know that I know that you know wiring....right? And I feel you know that I also know wiring...but maybe not on the level that you are taking your build.
But I am a bit confused and I will explain.
You wrote:
ACC- is powered when in the ACC and ignition - but is not powered when the starter is engaged.
IGN- not on in ACC - but on during ignition and while starting.
The wiper and radio are powered in ACC- so using the wiper power wire is NOT a good idea- as when you are engaging the starter the choke is not powered. PLUS when the the car is ACC the choke is engaged- pulling power.
Ignition is for the gauges and coil - this would be the best choice for the choke.
Where I am confused is this and here are my thoughts. An electric choke does not need 12 volts going to it when the engine is being cranked...because it is spring loaded and will set when the gas pedal is pressed if the engine is cold or choke has not recently been used and is no longer hot and allowing the choke to re-set. But the choke does need 12 volts when the key is in the run position and the engine is running in order for it to do what it is designed to do.
So having the 12 volt power come from ACC is fine...the way I am thinking...becasue as long as the choke is getting 12 volts when the key is in the run position...it should not have to have it come from IGN. Unless you know something I am not aware of.
When I am wiring a bunch of 'things' in on a custom build....I often times make every attempt to use the ACC circuit as much as possible so those new components do not draw any current when the engine is trying to crank. Knowing that the cranking circuit is the one circuit that commands the most amps ...I feel that each and every amp can make a difference.
Your views and philosophy on this would be greatly appreciated.
DUB
I'll be in Charlotte weekend after next- either Sat or Sun for the GoodGuys event- I'll call you as it gets closer....
Here's the situation- engine is HOT- choke will stay open with power- HOWEVER you have a vapor lock or gas has boiled out and you are engaging the starter longer than normal-pumping the gas pedal- the choke closes and exaggerates the no start problem. My buddy's 69 BB Camaro- watched the choke close as he was trying to start it one really hot day...
I too believe in nothing on while starting- I even added a timed delay for large current draw accessories- AC-electric power steering- fans (about 6 seconds) after the car starts-
Richard
10-10-2017, 05:53 PM
#16
Race Director
Here's the situation- engine is HOT- choke will stay open with power- HOWEVER you have a vapor lock or gas has boiled out and you are engaging the starter longer than normal-pumping the gas pedal- the choke closes and exaggerates the no start problem. My buddy's 69 BB Camaro- watched the choke close as he was trying to start it one really hot day...
Give me a 'heads-up' if you have a chance when you plan to stop by.OK then...I do not dispute what happened. It has...for whatever that might be worth...has never happened to me.
Just one more thing to add the otehr others things that I need to remember.I really like your wiring schematic!
DUB
10-11-2017, 03:30 PM
#17
Instructor
Thread Starter
Give me a 'heads-up' if you have a chance when you plan to stop by.OK then...I do not dispute what happened. It has...for whatever that might be worth...has never happened to me.
Just one more thing to add the otehr others things that I need to remember.I really like your wiring schematic!
DUB
10-11-2017, 05:16 PM
#18
Race Director
10-25-2017, 08:54 PM
#19
Instructor
Thread Starter
10-25-2017, 10:37 PM
#20
Le Mans Master
Member Since: May 2003
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Yep-AND it was good for my wife to see organized chaos is a way to work on cars...or rather Dub could be my brother from another mother!!!
Turned out great
The number wire markers will save a tremendous amount of time and frustration!!!
The only thing I would do? Protect the glass fuel filter.
GO to Lowes/Home Depot- buy some PVC Schedule 40 Conduit- electrical non-metallic- 1 1/4" might work -as they have several different sizes.
Cut a piece the length of the filter to slide over and protect it. Can slice it so it's easily removed w/o disconnecting the lines. About $5.
Richard
Turned out great
The number wire markers will save a tremendous amount of time and frustration!!!
The only thing I would do? Protect the glass fuel filter.
GO to Lowes/Home Depot- buy some PVC Schedule 40 Conduit- electrical non-metallic- 1 1/4" might work -as they have several different sizes.
Cut a piece the length of the filter to slide over and protect it. Can slice it so it's easily removed w/o disconnecting the lines. About $5.
Richard