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Just because one or two guys have a part fail doesn't mean the other 1000 guys will have a failure also. But then a myth spreads over cyberspace that all said parts are sh1tty. It can happen with a bad batch of parts or a poor design to begin with but then there would be many, many failures to justify it is a sh1tty part. Poly is nowhere near the sh1tty part status except in here.
Not shitty. Great stuff. However, to say they wont break or will outlast rubber is plain wrong.
Not shitty. Great stuff. However, to say they wont break or will outlast rubber is plain wrong.
This is a topic that will never end same things are said every time this subject get posted, and due to so many opinions and biases people are simple never going to agree with each other which is fine,
( unless a person has ego issues and has to always be right )
I am happy to hear your ball ends survived, not surprised,
That gives me some hope with mine which happen to be the Aurora brand,
On poly outlasting rubber, being "plain wrong", not so fast,
i have personally seen poly outlast rubber many times,
i have had rubber said to be good get cracks within months
I have also seen new poly bust for no reason i even helped bugpack with some R & D on acvw trans mounts,
My personal bias is VBP and their lack of standing behind what they sell,
My donor chassis was rebuilt with their transverse kits front and rear,
Then it sat a couple years and many not all the poly bushing cracked from just sitting,
Oddly it was mostly the bushing that are in the lesser of the stress points,
Deciding they were obviously defective i called VBP
I was told all bushings ( rubber or poly ) wear out, fail,
Thats life, oh well, use or no use doesnt matter, couple years old, sorry bout your luck,
He offered to sell me new ones full price no break at all, not even on shipping,
Yeah, like i would buy more from you when the ones i have from you are garbage,
Its not about the $$$ ill pay whatever good ones cost,
this was a defective part a noble company would have offered something, not a slammed door,
I see too many guys beat their cars way harder than i ever will with poly and have no problems to every worry about it, same goes with rubber for guys who want rubber,
Btw,
My car busted what appeared to be a good stock rear strut just hitting a mild pothole,
I have that, been told on here it will break from street use,
Waiting for someone will pop up and say they did break one from street use to confirm that opinion....
I have these competition adjustable struts with heim joints and they are VERY beefy...I seriously doubt they would break easier than the stock OEM struts since they are built MUCH stronger:
I was referring to this description from their website which was not my experience now for over 10 years using them:
Strut Rod Kit, 1963-1982 Competition
This 1963-1982 Corvette Racing Quality Strut Rod Kit is far stronger than stock and stops handling irregularities due to strut rod flex and bushing compression.
Not recommended for street use because of harsh ride.
This thread started with pro and con of poly bushings. The spherical bearing option offered by some has not been brought up. Could this be a good fix for trailing arms? Really sounds good. But it would have the same ride as poly or even a little firmer maybe?
This thread started with pro and con of poly bushings. The spherical bearing option offered by some has not been brought up. Could this be a good fix for trailing arms? Really sounds good. But it would have the same ride as poly or even a little firmer maybe?
If you mean Johnny Joints, I did bring that up. The ride is tighter, not harsh.
If you mean Johnny Joints, I did bring that up. The ride is tighter, not harsh.
I have 2 customers with these in their trailing arms and they are working as designed. An increase in harshness in ride would have to be detected by equipment that NASA would use. If you did not know they were in there you would never know it by the ride comfort.
And another thing...the installation of these 'Johnny Joints' is not for the faint of heart. Its is not a simple 'plug and play' scenario. Especially if a person wants to run a tube to re-grease the joints with ease.
If these are what is being called
" johnny joints"
They are not in a position to make the ride harsher, removing slop doesnt always mean you get harsh,
And i sure didnt find them at all hard to install,
The adjustment is lightyears better than the stock cam style...
I will never use poly bushing on anything again. On one vette , the poly bushing gave out on the rear camber rods. Sent me spinning out of control coming off the interstate.
On the 2nd vette, the poly spring bushing fell apart before it was ever put to use. Thee chassis was on jacks for the rebuild. I was cleaning up one day and the bushing pieces were on the ground. Never again.
You hole saw out the T/A bushing in the front, disassemble the joint, weld in the sleeve, then reassemble. The T/A bushing is now tight and basically forever.
As Dub said, you do need to grease them, so a remote zerk is good.
I'll try to find some of the pictures.
You hole saw out the T/A bushing in the front, disassemble the joint, weld in the sleeve, then reassemble. The T/A bushing is now tight and basically forever.
As Dub said, you do need to grease them, so a remote zerk is good.
I'll try to find some of the pictures.
Thanks bird..
With my heath issues i have good and bad, today is bad and in that i got totally mucked up,
I thought discussion went to heim strut rods hence my pictures but you guys where talking trailing arm pivot, i was off in lala land,
If i grasp what you are saying the johnny joint is a bolt and sleeve for the pivot,
In my vw kit car & trike stuff i have used heims as the trailing arm pivot, in fact we have made entire trailing arms just to look cool,
But i never thought of this johnny joint for that i have used that concept for things like the pivot for tilt front or rear clips on buggies, kits etc
Now a bit stepping to the side but on topic,
On the c3 trailing arm the rubber trailing arm pivot allows changes in toe and camber with loading and movement, not desirible,
Some say this is why with poly limiting that dont use poly, ( poly will break )
Well, guys do you poly there without it breaking,
but with that johnny joint that will eliminate pretty much any of the ta camber and toe changes which is good,
but for street use, i wonder what the life span of a well cared for jj would be,
Im intrigued as the installation wouldnt be bad if the arms have already be apart in the last few years, and it might have merits in that location over a roller bearing...
This is what I have seen..and what was done...the zerk was removed and replaced with a tube that would extend out so at the end of that tube...a zerk can be installed so when greasing of the joint is needed...it is simple.
Sorry..I have no photos of the ones that I have seen.
I've had poly in my front a-arms, and rear control arms & camber strut rods for ~20 years without any durability issues; however, I am slowly replacing them with rod ends, steel bearings, and johnny joints due to binding and friction with the poly.
When I replaced my upper VBP arms that had poly with SC&C uppers with steel bearing the ride actually got smoother and less noisy because the friction was actually reduced. Obviously, I have to grease the pivots periodically now so that is a slight drawback.
Since I track my car, I tend to run a fairly aggressive toe-in on the rear suspension so the outer tire never goes into a "toe-out" condition in a corner as the suspension compresses. There is so much stiction from the binding of the poly in the rear joints that I can actually hear them popping as they break free inside my helmet mid corner. When I have the toe set more conservatively I don't get this issue, so for the street this is a non issue.
To eliminate this source of binding, which is not good for ultimate handling characteristics I am switching to rod ends and johnny joints in the rear suspension this winter. Due to my local GM dealer screwing up my rear bearing rebuild, I decided to just purchase whole new trailing arms from Vansteel with the johnny joints already installed. Below is a view of their bare trailing arms.
I've had poly in my front a-arms, and rear control arms & camber strut rods for ~20 years without any durability issues; however, I am slowly replacing them with rod ends, steel bearings, and johnny joints due to binding and friction with the poly.
When I replaced my upper VBP arms that had poly with SC&C uppers with steel bearing the ride actually got smoother and less noisy because the friction was actually reduced. Obviously, I have to grease the pivots periodically now so that is a slight drawback.
Since I track my car, I tend to run a fairly aggressive toe-in on the rear suspension so the outer tire never goes into a "toe-out" condition in a corner as the suspension compresses. There is so much stiction from the binding of the poly in the rear joints that I can actually hear them popping as they break free inside my helmet mid corner. When I have the toe set more conservatively I don't get this issue, so for the street this is a non issue.
To eliminate this source of binding, which is not good for ultimate handling characteristics I am switching to rod ends and johnny joints in the rear suspension this winter. Due to my local GM dealer screwing up my rear bearing rebuild, I decided to just purchase whole new trailing arms from Vansteel with the johnny joints already installed. Below is a view of their bare trailing arms.
Thanks,
Its nice to hear about suspenion stuff from a guy who actually goes on a track,
I now would believe for my street cruiser poly is fine in my trailing arms,
Just for how sweet they look i wanted the a arms you posted but was told on here they are track only that street use will break them, bummer
Seeing that the discussion has gotten around to spherical joints, I would be interested in what the assemblage thinks of the particular joints that are installed in the Global West arms that are on my car. Here is some blurb from the GW web site
At the forward location of the swing arm Global West installs a Teflon lined spherical bearing that allows the swing arm to move through the suspension arch without bind. The result makes it easier to tune the suspension because the spring rate is not being affected. As you may already know suspension bind equates to spring rate increases.
Note: A Teflon lined bearing does not require lubrication; it is self lubricated.
I would include a picture of the arms but it doesn't add anything to the text. I have had no problems with the arms other than some fitment issues early on.
11-22-2017, 09:54 PM
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I have 2 customers with these in their trailing arms and they are working as designed. An increase in harshness in ride would have to be detected by equipment that NASA would use. If you did not know they were in there you would never know it by the ride comfort. 
