Low budget 5 Speed upgrade?
12-10-2017, 11:31 AM
#21
Drifting
This is a great thread. I too am watching for a way to improve the durability of WCT5.
I'm sure there has to be some upgraded parts that can be used in rebuild?
I saw some for sale that are supposed to be higher rated for power?
I would prefer to do this right the first time.
R
I'm sure there has to be some upgraded parts that can be used in rebuild?
I saw some for sale that are supposed to be higher rated for power?
I would prefer to do this right the first time.
R
12-10-2017, 11:54 AM
#22
Le Mans Master
Below is another pic of another rear mount, this isnt mine, just posting it for reference if it helps.
12-10-2017, 12:09 PM
#23
12-10-2017, 12:14 PM
#24
Le Mans Master
The top 3 pics in the above post were from my 68 T5 shifter. It was the 1st one I made .....and yes it was overkill to say the least.
You could probably pull an engine out of a car with it.
My 2nd shifter was on a diet.
Both work well though.
You could probably pull an engine out of a car with it.
My 2nd shifter was on a diet.Both work well though.
12-10-2017, 01:56 PM
#25
Safety Car
Hi Guys!
I definitely want a 5 speed as well but there is no way I am going to pay the $4-5K for the what the conversion kit vendors want.
I have been eyeing the GM WCT5 boxes for a while but need to know more about the exact year and model tranny from which GM cars and trucks will work and the different ratios that would be best? Maybe not specific part numbers but the car models to shoot for? I have a 4 speed with 3.70 gears presently...OEM.
Seems that the WCT5's came from the V6 F body cars? Should I buy a remanufactured one or a used one and then have it rebuilt by my expert builder near me...he could beef it up substantially, if necessary. My 355 L-82 with AFR heads and roller cam makes 425+ Gross HP but I am still using the OEM Doug Nash Super T-10.
Sounds like pulling the motor again for the install is best? I do have a 26 spline RAM HDX clutch with the rebuilt/upgraded motor now. I do not abuse the drivetrain now and roll into the throttle always...no clutch drops ever!
Besides the shortened driveshaft, what is involved with using the OEM shifter?, cutting of the tunnel (hopefully not)?, and hooking up the shifter rods with the GM WCT5.
Sorry lots of questions here, but the WCT5 conversion seems the best way to go for most of us since the conversion kits are way out of line. I can probably source a used GM WCT5 from another friend in the salvage car business for <$200. If my other friend rebuilt the used boxes and beefed it up, I would have a stronger than new WCT5 for <$1K. Estimates for the total conversion with me doing all the work?
Thanks for your input.
I definitely want a 5 speed as well but there is no way I am going to pay the $4-5K for the what the conversion kit vendors want.
I have been eyeing the GM WCT5 boxes for a while but need to know more about the exact year and model tranny from which GM cars and trucks will work and the different ratios that would be best? Maybe not specific part numbers but the car models to shoot for? I have a 4 speed with 3.70 gears presently...OEM.
Seems that the WCT5's came from the V6 F body cars? Should I buy a remanufactured one or a used one and then have it rebuilt by my expert builder near me...he could beef it up substantially, if necessary. My 355 L-82 with AFR heads and roller cam makes 425+ Gross HP but I am still using the OEM Doug Nash Super T-10.
Sounds like pulling the motor again for the install is best? I do have a 26 spline RAM HDX clutch with the rebuilt/upgraded motor now. I do not abuse the drivetrain now and roll into the throttle always...no clutch drops ever!
Besides the shortened driveshaft, what is involved with using the OEM shifter?, cutting of the tunnel (hopefully not)?, and hooking up the shifter rods with the GM WCT5.
Sorry lots of questions here, but the WCT5 conversion seems the best way to go for most of us since the conversion kits are way out of line. I can probably source a used GM WCT5 from another friend in the salvage car business for <$200. If my other friend rebuilt the used boxes and beefed it up, I would have a stronger than new WCT5 for <$1K. Estimates for the total conversion with me doing all the work?
Thanks for your input.
You have a 3.70 rear, that is nice, I like it :- )
I would find a 0.63 in 5th, if I was you, you will also go from 2.20 or 2.52 in 1th to 2.95
As I told above, then I also added a SFI 23lbs flywheel.
Maybe it would be easy for you, without taking the engine out. But for me, with a welded crossmember, then I would take out the engine, maybe it is just me :- )
It is a nice small project, for small money, with great value.
But take the time, to find the right transmission for you. I looked for 1 year
12-10-2017, 02:17 PM
#26
Safety Car
BTW regarding cost:
Transmission my was $650
Bracket, you make can it yourself.
26 spline clutch plate $100 (the rest of my clutch was almost brand new)
Cable adaptor $60
Shorten up driveshaft, I know one that did it for free.
Oil change $30
The 176 transmission was a bit had to get, my had very low miles on it, so the price was (2-3 years ago) $650
Transmission my was $650
Bracket, you make can it yourself.
26 spline clutch plate $100 (the rest of my clutch was almost brand new)
Cable adaptor $60
Shorten up driveshaft, I know one that did it for free.
Oil change $30
The 176 transmission was a bit had to get, my had very low miles on it, so the price was (2-3 years ago) $650
12-10-2017, 02:58 PM
#27
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
WOW!
Great info! Thanks all for the replies!
I have a 454 BBC with centerforce...not sure on spline, but it is a stock muncie 20.
I am gonna start my researching...and reviewing of the great info from you all!
Thanks!
Ron
Great info! Thanks all for the replies!
I have a 454 BBC with centerforce...not sure on spline, but it is a stock muncie 20.
I am gonna start my researching...and reviewing of the great info from you all!
Thanks!
Ron
12-10-2017, 04:51 PM
#28
Drifting
I did a little digging and found this thread on 3rd Gen.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tran...-t5-t-5-a.html
The consensus seems to be for a slightly built and not abused, a rebuilt T-5 will work quite well. After that things get iffy. There is a lot of aftermarket support. Some guys think build it stronger after each blow up.
Others just replace 1 $300 trans w/another $300 trans.
A lot of good info.
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tran...-t5-t-5-a.html
The consensus seems to be for a slightly built and not abused, a rebuilt T-5 will work quite well. After that things get iffy. There is a lot of aftermarket support. Some guys think build it stronger after each blow up.
Others just replace 1 $300 trans w/another $300 trans.
A lot of good info.
12-10-2017, 05:28 PM
#29
Le Mans Master
Well my salvage buddy says his source would be a dead end since they do not inventory parts that go back to the 80's.early 90's. He suggested car-part.com and I did look but most of the WCt5's were for V6's and VERY few V8's. The V8 .63 OD units seem very scarce...This is going to take some work..
12-10-2017, 05:32 PM
#30
Le Mans Master
The same for me, I don't drive my cars hard, I drive with my kids or wife. So I don't want tp spend $5k for at 5 speed kit. Also because I think a T5WC is strong enough for me, the way I drive my cars.
You have a 3.70 rear, that is nice, I like it :- )
I would find a 0.63 in 5th, if I was you, you will also go from 2.20 or 2.52 in 1th to 2.95
As I told above, then I also added a SFI 23lbs flywheel.
Maybe it would be easy for you, without taking the engine out. But for me, with a welded crossmember, then I would take out the engine, maybe it is just me :- )
It is a nice small project, for small money, with great value.
But take the time, to find the right transmission for you. I looked for 1 year
You have a 3.70 rear, that is nice, I like it :- )
I would find a 0.63 in 5th, if I was you, you will also go from 2.20 or 2.52 in 1th to 2.95
As I told above, then I also added a SFI 23lbs flywheel.
Maybe it would be easy for you, without taking the engine out. But for me, with a welded crossmember, then I would take out the engine, maybe it is just me :- )
It is a nice small project, for small money, with great value.
But take the time, to find the right transmission for you. I looked for 1 year
12-10-2017, 06:48 PM
#31
I have a feeling after looking today that an F body WCT5U .63 OD V8 unit is going to take some looking and I doubt $650 today is going to be the price today. I did find a no core rebuilt WCT5 V8 on ebay with a warranty BUT it was .73OD...no good for me. I have to have the .63OD.....
Rebuilt Fox Mustang units are $650 all day. The guts are the same as the Camaro unit so worse case you pick up a core for $50 and have a Mustang shop rebuild it.
Have you tried the Facebook marketplace or any of the Facebook Buy/Sell/Trade pages? Those pages seem to have eclipsed CL for many items.
also try www.Racingjunk.com ?
https://knoxville.craigslist.org/pts...369751320.html
R
Last edited by Dynra Rockets; 12-10-2017 at 06:58 PM.
12-10-2017, 07:01 PM
#32
Le Mans Master
Rebuilt Fox Mustang units are $650 all day. The guts are the same as the Camaro unit so worse case you pick up a core for $50 and have a Mustang shop rebuild it.
Have you tried the Facebook marketplace or any of the Facebook Buy/Sell/Trade pages? Those pages seem to have eclipsed CL for many items.
also try www.Racingjunk.com ?
https://knoxville.craigslist.org/pts...369751320.html
R
Have you tried the Facebook marketplace or any of the Facebook Buy/Sell/Trade pages? Those pages seem to have eclipsed CL for many items.
also try www.Racingjunk.com ?
https://knoxville.craigslist.org/pts...369751320.html
R
12-10-2017, 07:03 PM
#33
The Mustang case is entirely different. The Mustang guts are the same as the GM guts (except for input spline and length, but if rebuilding just have changed to whatever you want). I meant pick up a GM core for $50 and have a Mustang shop rebuild it.
Last edited by Dynra Rockets; 12-10-2017 at 07:06 PM.
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jb78L-82 (12-10-2017)
12-11-2017, 10:42 AM
#34
Safety Car
I would also for a 0.63 when you have 3.70 rear.
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...nsmission.html
12-12-2017, 02:58 AM
#35
Race Director
Member Since: Nov 2006
Location: Athens GA
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St. Jude Donor '12-'13, '15- '16-'17-'18-'19, '21
Good thread but you guys are missing out on a lot of pre-existing info right here on the forum.
Use the Advanced Search function button and type in WC T5 transmission.
MANY guys did this conversion about 5-8 yrs ago before the T56s became popular and the drop-in kit guys like Powertrain, Shaffir(?), etc started making full conversion.
Old time Norvahl was one of the first and ran a huge HP motor in front of a T5.
I bought a T5 on ebay real inexpensive. Got the highest rated GM version model. The Ford T5's are easier to find.
Make sure you go WC = World Class.
I sold mine before even using it as I ended up going to a T56 which is stronger and better suited for my application.
As far as bellhousings and scattershields...there are several ways to go. Make an adapter (the input shaft length is different depending upon which model and what you are bolting it up to) or go with the offset Lakewood version that uses the outer mounted hydraulic slave cylinder setup.
There are LOTS of variations on this project so check out that search function.
The more you search for parts and the more you can fabricate yourself....this can be very inexpensive.
Good luck with your projects.
There was a guy from NYC... Paul who specializes in T5s but not sure if he is still around. I lost track of him.
Bman
Use the Advanced Search function button and type in WC T5 transmission.
MANY guys did this conversion about 5-8 yrs ago before the T56s became popular and the drop-in kit guys like Powertrain, Shaffir(?), etc started making full conversion.
Old time Norvahl was one of the first and ran a huge HP motor in front of a T5.
I bought a T5 on ebay real inexpensive. Got the highest rated GM version model. The Ford T5's are easier to find.
Make sure you go WC = World Class.
I sold mine before even using it as I ended up going to a T56 which is stronger and better suited for my application.
As far as bellhousings and scattershields...there are several ways to go. Make an adapter (the input shaft length is different depending upon which model and what you are bolting it up to) or go with the offset Lakewood version that uses the outer mounted hydraulic slave cylinder setup.
There are LOTS of variations on this project so check out that search function.
The more you search for parts and the more you can fabricate yourself....this can be very inexpensive.
Good luck with your projects.
There was a guy from NYC... Paul who specializes in T5s but not sure if he is still around. I lost track of him.
Bman
12-12-2017, 06:50 AM
#36
(the input shaft length is different depending upon which model and what you are bolting it up to)
The spacer plates for the 4 and V6-60 units are commercially available now as it is common to use those (S10 and base Camaro) in 30-40's hotrods and 20-30's streetrods See sites like HAMB. My thought is if going with a 4 or v6-60 trans than might as well get a Mustang GT unit as the level of effort is about the same and the Mustang GT unit is a better trans than non WC units and has proper V8 1st gear ratios.
Last edited by Dynra Rockets; 12-12-2017 at 12:34 PM.
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bmans vette (12-12-2017)
12-12-2017, 01:13 PM
#37
Le Mans Master
Hey Guys!
I have been reading about the conversions for years and have seen Norval's write up as well about the Ford WCT5 he did. I really appreciate the effort here to up date the info.
I think I am going to patiently look for a F body WCT5U with the higher torque rating as a first step and give that search some time to find the speedo cable version. IF I can find an acceptable unit, then I will move forward with the swap and the mods needed to make it fit.....
I have been reading about the conversions for years and have seen Norval's write up as well about the Ford WCT5 he did. I really appreciate the effort here to up date the info.
I think I am going to patiently look for a F body WCT5U with the higher torque rating as a first step and give that search some time to find the speedo cable version. IF I can find an acceptable unit, then I will move forward with the swap and the mods needed to make it fit.....
12-12-2017, 04:47 PM
#39
Race Director
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Location: Athens GA
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St. Jude Donor '12-'13, '15- '16-'17-'18-'19, '21
Haha. It is my experience very few people actual use the search here, or even a Google search. That is why every month there is the same question about Holleys and every spring there are the same questions about getting AC to work. But I guess without people asking the same repeated questions all the time there would be no forum community then.
For the GM T5, only the 4 and V6-60 have longer input shafts. The V8 and V6-90 have correct input shaft lengths to work with our current bellhousings. That is why above I said to look for a 'U' code.
The spacer plates for the 4 and V6-60 units are commercially available now as it is common to use those (S10 and base Camaro) in 30-40's hotrods and 20-30's streetrods See sites like HAMB. My thought is if going with a 4 or v6-60 trans than might as well get a Mustang GT unit as the level of effort is about the same and the Mustang GT unit is a better trans than non WC units and has proper V8 1st gear ratios.
For the GM T5, only the 4 and V6-60 have longer input shafts. The V8 and V6-90 have correct input shaft lengths to work with our current bellhousings. That is why above I said to look for a 'U' code.
The spacer plates for the 4 and V6-60 units are commercially available now as it is common to use those (S10 and base Camaro) in 30-40's hotrods and 20-30's streetrods See sites like HAMB. My thought is if going with a 4 or v6-60 trans than might as well get a Mustang GT unit as the level of effort is about the same and the Mustang GT unit is a better trans than non WC units and has proper V8 1st gear ratios.
The adapter plate is for the Ford version which there are many more available and therefore likely to be cheaper to find.
Look at that ebay listing for the remanufactured GM 176 unit.
That is pretty high and a 6 month warranty starts the day you buy it, not the 3 months later when it gets installed. That is why I shy away from these online warranty deals.
Glad to see the fabricating hot rod spirit still exists here......
Last edited by bmans vette; 12-12-2017 at 04:48 PM.
12-12-2017, 05:06 PM
#40
Race Director
Member Since: Nov 2006
Location: Athens GA
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St. Jude Donor '12-'13, '15- '16-'17-'18-'19, '21
A CF member has a Ford WC trans partial setup for sale.
Check it out....
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...post1596166332
Check it out....
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...post1596166332
