Autocross Seat Harness - Seat Brace Bar - suggestions?
03-15-2011, 05:42 AM
#1
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Autocross Seat Harness - Seat Brace Bar - suggestions?
Starting my first track days, dont want to buy racing seats right now - want to keep the car mostly stock form. Want to put in 5 point removable harness, do I need a harness bar for this or does it anchor to seat bolts? I am not very informed about the basics. In fact, the track days I am starting with doesnt require the extra belts but I would feel better.
thanks!
94 coupe
thanks!
94 coupe
03-15-2011, 11:32 AM
#2
Team Owner
First off, don't use a harness with stock seats. The stock seat backs don't have an opening for the shoulder belts to pass thru the back. There are sanctioning bodies that will not allow the use of a harness system with seat with no holes. The issue is that the shoulder harness belts can slip away from the seat back and the belts will fall off your shoulders.
A harness bar is necessary for the shoulder belts. The lap bets typically attach to the same mounting points for the OEM lap belts. A submarine belt is attached to a bar across the front seat mounting bolts or a special eye bolt that mounts to the floor pan.
Most harness bars use the mounting points for the factory shoulder belts but the factory belts can remain for street use. There are a number of good choices for bars so do a search in the Autocross and Road Racing section for "harness bar".
Right now, spend the money on making sure your brakes are in good condition. Flush the brake fluid and refill with a good DOT4 fluid like ATE Super Blue or TYP200 (same fluid, different colors). About $15 for a quart. New brake pads will be a good thing too. Are the rotors in good shape?? Can't hurt to replace them either.
Make sure the cooling system is in good condition; depending on the outside air temp, a dirty/clogged radiator can cause overheating. You can use a garden hose to clean between the fins and tubes. Spray from the fan side and watch the gunk come out.
Do you have a good helmet? A full-face helmet will be a good choice for track days/HPDE's. Get a SA2010 rated helmet if you don't have at least a SA2000 helmet.
A harness bar is necessary for the shoulder belts. The lap bets typically attach to the same mounting points for the OEM lap belts. A submarine belt is attached to a bar across the front seat mounting bolts or a special eye bolt that mounts to the floor pan.
Most harness bars use the mounting points for the factory shoulder belts but the factory belts can remain for street use. There are a number of good choices for bars so do a search in the Autocross and Road Racing section for "harness bar".
Right now, spend the money on making sure your brakes are in good condition. Flush the brake fluid and refill with a good DOT4 fluid like ATE Super Blue or TYP200 (same fluid, different colors). About $15 for a quart. New brake pads will be a good thing too. Are the rotors in good shape?? Can't hurt to replace them either.
Make sure the cooling system is in good condition; depending on the outside air temp, a dirty/clogged radiator can cause overheating. You can use a garden hose to clean between the fins and tubes. Spray from the fan side and watch the gunk come out.
Do you have a good helmet? A full-face helmet will be a good choice for track days/HPDE's. Get a SA2010 rated helmet if you don't have at least a SA2000 helmet.
03-15-2011, 11:54 AM
#3
Tech Contributor
First off, don't use a harness with stock seats. The stock seat backs don't have an opening for the shoulder belts to pass thru the back. There are sanctioning bodies that will not allow the use of a harness system with seat with no holes. The issue is that the shoulder harness belts can slip away from the seat back and the belts will fall off your shoulders.
A harness bar is necessary for the shoulder belts. The lap bets typically attach to the same mounting points for the OEM lap belts. A submarine belt is attached to a bar across the front seat mounting bolts or a special eye bolt that mounts to the floor pan.
Most harness bars use the mounting points for the factory shoulder belts but the factory belts can remain for street use. There are a number of good choices for bars so do a search in the Autocross and Road Racing section for "harness bar".
Right now, spend the money on making sure your brakes are in good condition. Flush the brake fluid and refill with a good DOT4 fluid like ATE Super Blue or TYP200 (same fluid, different colors). About $15 for a quart. New brake pads will be a good thing too. Are the rotors in good shape?? Can't hurt to replace them either.
Make sure the cooling system is in good condition; depending on the outside air temp, a dirty/clogged radiator can cause overheating. You can use a garden hose to clean between the fins and tubes. Spray from the fan side and watch the gunk come out.
Do you have a good helmet? A full-face helmet will be a good choice for track days/HPDE's. Get a SA2010 rated helmet if you don't have at least a SA2000 helmet.
A harness bar is necessary for the shoulder belts. The lap bets typically attach to the same mounting points for the OEM lap belts. A submarine belt is attached to a bar across the front seat mounting bolts or a special eye bolt that mounts to the floor pan.
Most harness bars use the mounting points for the factory shoulder belts but the factory belts can remain for street use. There are a number of good choices for bars so do a search in the Autocross and Road Racing section for "harness bar".
Right now, spend the money on making sure your brakes are in good condition. Flush the brake fluid and refill with a good DOT4 fluid like ATE Super Blue or TYP200 (same fluid, different colors). About $15 for a quart. New brake pads will be a good thing too. Are the rotors in good shape?? Can't hurt to replace them either.
Make sure the cooling system is in good condition; depending on the outside air temp, a dirty/clogged radiator can cause overheating. You can use a garden hose to clean between the fins and tubes. Spray from the fan side and watch the gunk come out.
Do you have a good helmet? A full-face helmet will be a good choice for track days/HPDE's. Get a SA2010 rated helmet if you don't have at least a SA2000 helmet.
Good advice.If it's your first track day, you'll have more pressing issues to worry about than a harness. On a C4, especially if you'll be on a technical track, brake cooling is where I'd be concerned.
Everybody wants to go fast. They all forget they have to be able to slow down too.
03-16-2011, 07:58 AM
#4
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Got the brakes and cooling up to specs I think. I am now looking for a harness bar. I am just doing track days, no racing for now. I have thousands of track laps on superbikes but this is my first four wheel outing.
03-17-2011, 11:32 PM
#6
Tech Contributor
on the brake cooling. Without it, you would be surprised and disappointed at how easy it is to fade the pads or boil the fluid during a track day. This is especially true if you push even moderately on a course with moderate to heavy braking requirements.For track days, I've never seen someone disable the airbag. I've seen people experience the benefit of their deployment unfortunately.
You'd have to look in the service manual. Not sure what else runs off the airbag fuse...but it's more than the airbags.
03-18-2011, 09:30 AM
#7
Le Mans Master
I don't have a race seat in the 92 yet, so event at 130+ I'm still using the stock belts.
Don't worry guys the seat is next when I get back from vacation. It will be in before next Road Atl event. I really need it before I go to Charlotte!
You could use the valvoline syntec brake fluid, its about $8 and found at almost every auto parts store. Dry & wet boiling is close to the ATE fluid.
What track are you going to? How long are the sessions? Which organization is running your event?
Don't worry guys the seat is next when I get back from vacation. It will be in before next Road Atl event. I really need it before I go to Charlotte!
You could use the valvoline syntec brake fluid, its about $8 and found at almost every auto parts store. Dry & wet boiling is close to the ATE fluid.
What track are you going to? How long are the sessions? Which organization is running your event?
03-18-2011, 10:12 AM
#8
Le Mans Master
I have a Arizona Speed & Marine bar and it works real good. If you dont want to buy a seat just buy the harness grommets to put in the seat.
and as you can see I still retain the use of the stock belts.
and as you can see I still retain the use of the stock belts.
03-18-2011, 01:59 PM
#10
I've been getting a lot of email and IMs asking how hard is it, instructions, pictures etc. Here are some photos I took while doing my seat. Many thanks to Meldog. Without his help it might not have been as easy.
First step is to remove the seat. Easy enough, remove the front covers and then the 4 nuts holding the seat in. I then prop the front up to give me room to unhook the power seat connector on the drivers side.
Find the end of the zipper that is tucked up in the back. I attach a zip tie to make working the zipper easier. You will be putting the seat cover on several times during this process.
Remove the seat release clip
Front view with cover off
Rear view showing the seat frame.
Mark the center location using an ice pick or similar tool.
Not a lot of choice for grommet location. Putting the grommets in backwards allows the lip to hold it in place for measuring.
Mark the grommet locations with a felt tip pen.
Hold your breath and grab the carving knife!
Please note the knife blade will need to be cleaned with rubbing alcohol often! You will feel the knife drag on the foam when it needs to be cleaned.
Both grommets installed from rear.
After installing the grommets, replace the seat cover. Pressing on the vinyl you can feel where the seat grommets are positioned. After ensuring that you are happy with the grommet locations, you can cut a slot crossways. Then two small cuts from the center up toward each corner. Your cut should look like this
>----<
Remove the seat cover and the seat grommets. Replace the seat cover and install the grommets. If everything looks good, use some glue to keep the front and rear grommets securely together.
Finished product.
First step is to remove the seat. Easy enough, remove the front covers and then the 4 nuts holding the seat in. I then prop the front up to give me room to unhook the power seat connector on the drivers side.
Find the end of the zipper that is tucked up in the back. I attach a zip tie to make working the zipper easier. You will be putting the seat cover on several times during this process.
Remove the seat release clip
Front view with cover off
Rear view showing the seat frame.
Mark the center location using an ice pick or similar tool.
Not a lot of choice for grommet location. Putting the grommets in backwards allows the lip to hold it in place for measuring.
Mark the grommet locations with a felt tip pen.
Hold your breath and grab the carving knife!
Please note the knife blade will need to be cleaned with rubbing alcohol often! You will feel the knife drag on the foam when it needs to be cleaned.
Both grommets installed from rear.
After installing the grommets, replace the seat cover. Pressing on the vinyl you can feel where the seat grommets are positioned. After ensuring that you are happy with the grommet locations, you can cut a slot crossways. Then two small cuts from the center up toward each corner. Your cut should look like this
>----<
Remove the seat cover and the seat grommets. Replace the seat cover and install the grommets. If everything looks good, use some glue to keep the front and rear grommets securely together.
Finished product.
03-18-2011, 05:31 PM
#12
Team Owner
Keep in mind that some sanctioning bodies may have strict rules on how harnesses are to be used in a car. For example, PCA (Porsche Clubs of America) won't allow harnesses to be used at their track day events if there are no holes in the seat back or the sides of the seat bottom.
They want seats made specifically for harnesses. No home made holes and they also require a hole in the seat bottom for the sub strap if you use a 5-point harness setup.
Also some organizations require the same setup on the passenger side if you have an instructor ride along. You just have to check out the rules for the organization running the event.
Some race-style seats can be easily swapped in for track days. Seats from Sparco, Corbeau, Kirkey are designed to use brackets that attach to the factory studs and it only takes 15-20 minutes to swap from stock seats to a race set. The lap belt part of a harness set usually shares the same bolts used by the factory lap belt, so the harness belts stay in the car.
They want seats made specifically for harnesses. No home made holes and they also require a hole in the seat bottom for the sub strap if you use a 5-point harness setup.
Also some organizations require the same setup on the passenger side if you have an instructor ride along. You just have to check out the rules for the organization running the event.
Some race-style seats can be easily swapped in for track days. Seats from Sparco, Corbeau, Kirkey are designed to use brackets that attach to the factory studs and it only takes 15-20 minutes to swap from stock seats to a race set. The lap belt part of a harness set usually shares the same bolts used by the factory lap belt, so the harness belts stay in the car.
03-18-2011, 08:20 PM
#13
Le Mans Master
I have not had any tech at any event so far say They were not safe or not useable. My seat bottom comes off during speed events and the subbelt goes through the slot in the seat bottom.
03-19-2011, 08:27 AM
#16
Pro
Member Since: Feb 2009
Location: charlottesville Virginia
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I just made one and put in my car for the same reason, maybe you could do the same. I had my seats reupholstered by a local guy and had him cut the slots for the harness. here are some pictures:
