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Sometimes I think this site is dedicated to lowering the price of Corvettes. I suspect some of the regulars who always seem to chime in on most of the pricing threads are dealers looking for a steal. I realize that after all these years some C4's are toast and some are still nice but overall the price quotes I see here are way to low.
When it comes to used car pricing I say KBB and the other valuation sites are **** and most of their pricing is driven by insurance companies and car dealers. They are good for common vehicle pricing but Corvettes are not common.
And here is why......
Consider the number of Corvettes produced vs the human population. They are not what you could consider plentiful and actually pretty rare.
They are fiberglass and they don't rust. You can pay a lot of money to have a metal car restored and watch it start to rust again. Great.
The average price for a new car these days is over $30,000.00 dollars. The price of a new Corvette is $60,000.00 to over $100,000.00 Anything decent that runs these days can bring 5k pretty easy. Any decent Corvette out there should be worth at least 15k or 1/4 the price of a new one. You can pay 15k and more for a zero turn mower or a ATV these days!
I would pay 20k for a nice low milage C4 any day before I would pay that price for a new Kia or Hyundai for Gods sake.
The C4 is still a very formidable vehicle compared to over 90% of the vehicles produced today. It can still corner at the 1G mark, it can hit the legal speed limit on a cloverleaf easily and the top speed is more than enough to out run most anything.
They get great milage. They don't work hard even driving vigorously. At the legal speed limit the engine is only running a little over a cold idle. You can't really run one hard a lot on the street unless you have a damn good lawyer.
INSURANCE - Some C4's qualify for classic car insurance now. If you have a decent driving record and the car is in good shape you can get a stated value policy of around 20k for under $200.00 a year.
PERFORMANCE - If you need more you can bump a C4 up to current levels (or more) for a lot less than the price of a newer Corvette even if you pay to have it done professionally. And that includes the price of the car. Have it painted, get the interior done if it needs it and still be lower or around the the price of the average new car. Then you have something special. They still turn heads.
MAINTENANCE - The tilting hood makes the C4 one of the easiest Corvettes to work on ever. Try working on a newer one if you don't believe it.
Having been around a while I can remember seeing used 427 Stingrays and split windows selling for around 2k. As they get older kids start getting hold of them and finish them off. The ones that survive spike in price tremendously once the realization hits that not many are left. Supply and demand. There are plenty of people out there who collect and enjoy older cars and its undoubtably desirable to have something unique. Which one of you here will not turn and look when you see a '63 split window or a decent old C1, C2 or C3?
The C4's time is coming soon..... Mark my words.
I had a friend back in the 70's that sold his mint '67 427 Stingray for $2,500.00 and it has haunted him ever since. That was about a average price then. It could easily bring 100k now but it was totaled pretty quick by the kid who bought it. He can't have a conversation without someone bringing it up and reminding him about it.
Remember how bad you wanted a Corvette? They are plenty of people out there who still want one.
Too be honest, I disagree, I don't think the people here lower the prices, most of the corvettes for sale on here are usually overpriced. I've watched corvettes that have been on craigslist since i bought mine in October and are still there, they're not horribly priced, the average person doesn't see a C4 corvette as a sleek, super performance car. The amount of them for sale Vs the amount of people that want them is pretty uneven, there's plenty of C4's for sale and no one to buy them, leaves C4 buyers with plenty to look at before picking theirs.
Keep in mind the newest C4 is 20 years old, the oldest being 32 years old, these cars are at the fine line where they're not worth much, and won't start going up for probably 15+ years, like you said the bad ones being taken out over the years. Pretty much everyone here is honest when people ask "what should I sell my corvette for" or "what is it worth?" we're not throwing low ball numbers because "we're" trying to get a "steal" we're throwing those numbers out, because no one is going to pay 10k for a corvette with a 150k miles that needs paint, seats redone and have small problems, we're just being realistic
Last edited by BrandensBeast; 09-15-2016 at 11:00 AM.
Sometimes I think this site is dedicated to lowering the price of Corvettes. I suspect some of the regulars who always seem to chime in on most of the pricing threads are dealers looking for a steal. I realize that after all these years some C4's are toast and some are still nice but overall the price quotes I see here are way to low.
When it comes to used car pricing I say KBB and the other valuation sites are **** and most of their pricing is driven by insurance companies and car dealers. They are good for common vehicle pricing but Corvettes are not common.
And here is why......
Consider the number of Corvettes produced vs the human population. They are not what you could consider plentiful and actually pretty rare.
They are fiberglass and they don't rust. You can pay a lot of money to have a metal car restored and watch it start to rust again. Great.
The average price for a new car these days is over $30,000.00 dollars. The price of a new Corvette is $60,000.00 to over $100,000.00 Anything decent that runs these days can bring 5k pretty easy. Any decent Corvette out there should be worth at least 15k or 1/4 the price of a new one. You can pay 15k and more for a zero turn mower or a ATV these days!
I would pay 20k for a nice low milage C4 any day before I would pay that price for a new Kia or Hyundai for Gods sake.
The C4 is still a very formidable vehicle compared to over 90% of the vehicles produced today. It can still corner at the 1G mark, it can hit the legal speed limit on a cloverleaf easily and the top speed is more than enough to out run most anything.
They get great milage. They don't work hard even driving vigorously. At the legal speed limit the engine is only running a little over a cold idle. You can't really run one hard a lot on the street unless you have a damn good lawyer.
INSURANCE - Some C4's qualify for classic car insurance now. If you have a decent driving record and the car is in good shape you can get a stated value policy of around 20k for under $200.00 a year.
PERFORMANCE - If you need more you can bump a C4 up to current levels (or more) for a lot less than the price of a newer Corvette even if you pay to have it done professionally. And that includes the price of the car. Have it painted, get the interior done if it needs it and still be lower or around the the price of the average new car. Then you have something special. They still turn heads.
MAINTENANCE - The tilting hood makes the C4 one of the easiest Corvettes to work on ever. Try working on a newer one if you don't believe it.
Having been around a while I can remember seeing used 427 Stingrays and split windows selling for around 2k. As they get older kids start getting hold of them and finish them off. The ones that survive spike in price tremendously once the realization hits that not many are left. Supply and demand. There are plenty of people out there who collect and enjoy older cars and its undoubtably desirable to have something unique. Which one of you here will not turn and look when you see a '63 split window or a decent old C1, C2 or C3?
The C4's time is coming soon..... Mark my words.
I had a friend back in the 70's that sold his mint '67 427 Stingray for $2,500.00 and it has haunted him ever since. That was about a average price then. It could easily bring 100k now but it was totaled pretty quick by the kid who bought it. He can't have a conversation without someone bringing it up and reminding him about it.
Remember how bad you wanted a Corvette? They are plenty of people out there who still want one.
Will you make the same mistake?
Finally something worth reading about on C4 values! I agree that when someone posts here asking "whats my car worth" many of the same people here come in with some really low prices claiming that they are all worth next to nothing. I've been around cars for MANY years restoring, building, buying, selling, and collecting them. I know what I'm doing and what I get selling them, because I know how to sell them. When the car being sold is aimed at a certain group of people, the price will be dictated by those people. High or low, those are the people who you have to listen to as far as offers. This forum is full of people who have never owned but one or two (special) cars. They then consider themselves experts on specialty car values. You have to know how to avoid those guys appraisals and do some homework of the car values in a professional arena. Using CL and free forums is not a real good idea of the whole picture concerning a Corvettes value. Know the car, its history, its production numbers, build statistics, maintenance history and who would really be in the market for that certain car. You'll find that many Corvettes that sell at very low prices are in need of lots of TLC at least or the car is a problem car. I'm sure someone will try to discredit my ramblings here, but I have had extremely good luck getting my HIGH prices on any (special) car I sell. Maybe because I stay with a positive attitude about the car itself and hit the buyer with facts and not opinions.
Last edited by FOURSPEEDVETTE; 09-16-2016 at 10:18 AM.
Reason: typo
I agree with Brandon.
As an example (and not denigrating the poster) there was a recent 'what should I sell my car for' thread that is the perfect proof. The gentleman expected this car would be enthusiastically snapped up for $14 - $15K and the reality was closer to $6K - $8K.
There are always exceptions, but these cars are viewed by knowledgeable forum members as being 20+ year old driven cars.
i gotta agree with Brandon. the site here does seem a little low from time to time but overall ide say its in line.. i have my 86 stickshift z51 with 60K miles, for under $3K. now it needed some work and I know i got a deal.. but those deals do exist out there and most of us willing to work on our own cars prefer that type of deal. there are plenty of descent c4's out there sub 10K and the average joe who just wants a vette or a hyundai.. isnt gonna pick the vette cuz they want a warranty and need to be able to haul more than 1 person, groceries etc. so the market becomes limited.. then looking at the people who want a sports coupe, and now the old c4's dont typically have the stature of a new one or a classic yet.. they are in that middle ground for the time being.
i personally am completely content with the value being low right now...
IMO they are undervalued.. and now is the perfect time to pick um up and wait for the market to go up.. looK at the 70's vettes... they were dogs and you couldnt give um away 10 years ago... could pick them up sub $5K all day... I turned down many of them. now they are right back up to 10-20K cars.
My opinion is that the C4 is aging well, relative to other cars of its time, but prices will not jump until (if/when) like-minded enthusiasts agree. Eventually, there will be few enough clean C4s and if the demand maintains or increases, then yes, prices will trickle upwards.
Supply/demand. There are also bubbles... (i.e. air-cooled Porsche market right now)
One thing I will agree on is that C4s are undervalued right now, but it's because it is common compared to its competition from its time (I compare later C4s to the NSX, F355, Porsche 993, Supra, Viper, etc.).
Last edited by TractionControlOff; 09-15-2016 at 01:15 PM.
INSURANCE - Some C4's qualify for classic car insurance now. If you have a decent driving record and the car is in good shape you can get a stated value policy of around 20k for under $200.00 a year.
my insurance actually went down. the 07 4x4 Ranger I got rid of cost more to insure.
I had a friend back in the 70's that sold his mint '67 427 Stingray for $2,500.00 and it has haunted him ever since. That was about a average price then. It could easily bring 100k now but it was totaled pretty quick by the kid who bought it. He can't have a conversation without someone bringing it up and reminding him about it.
I sold the '65 I had in 1991 for just under $30,000 in today's money. I got good money for it back then, but regret it every day.
I just paid $15 for a '96 that had 11,850 miles on it when I picked it up. It was an old lady's car. We found her insurance cards in it and it drives like an old lady's car that had been babied. Do I feel like I paid too much ? Nope. Did I get a good trade in ? Yep. She had traded it in because at 70, they were having issues getting in it I suppose. I got almost 10K for a 07 Ford Range.
If I would have had a couple more to spend and one would have shown up to where I could have traded for it, I would have bought an LT4.
But there is something to say about a car with the amount of mileage that is on mine.
I agree that eventually folks are going to really catch on about the value of a C4. Maintenance costs on the C5's and beyond will really make people flinch as they age.
I originally wanted a C5 stick, but found out how much it would cost to have a clutch and slave cylinder put in it, etc. Most of the C5's that we would have been able to afford, were getting to the point of needing a clutch.
I'm the original owner of my '84 which has 26,000 miles. It's been BG Certified, Survivor certified, and NCRS Top Flight. To me it's worth about $20,000. Not planning to sell it anytime soon, but the best ones out there will definitely command the higher prices. It never will be in the '63-'67 price range but the good ones will eventually have some appreciation.
Not directing this post at anyone but if you look back every Corvette has become undervalued at some point in time. All of the older ones have increased in value and will continue to do so. They obviously don't lose their allure and they become rarer as time goes on.
Those who fail to learn from history.....
And who in their right mind buys a Corvette or any specialty car and then tell's everyone its not worth much? One would have to think that person was not the sharpest crayon in the pack. We are talking Corvettes here. Not Yugo's.
I personally don't care what you sell your car for or what you think its worth. Just sharing some history and what I have seen over the years. It starts here, this is where a lot of interested people look. You can bash the prices all you want but you are only putting off the inevitable and if you actually own one, cheating yourself.
IMO forums like this and KBB etc dont set the value by any means... places like craigslist or autotrader or ebay set the value... where a person can literally spend 5 minutes and find 50 c4 corvettes for sale.. then they get to weed out the bad/overpriced/etc.. then they take their pick of the litter.. and have done the majority of the work in an hour or two.
Its always been my findings that "for the most part" on forums people think their cars are amazing and attach emotional value to them.. "cuz its a super rare car that only had this one color combination that one year and they only made 500 of um with that bla bla bla..." and of course its like brown car with like orange interior and low options and no one wants it.. ( i hold that true not just this forum, but im on a lincoln forum, a mustang forum, a chevelle forum, and 2 camaro forums)
As the bad ones get worse and the good ones get rarer thats when the values will start going up.
but as long as the above situation exists our values will stay lowish.
of course the super low milage/ different engine/ options etc will always be higher than a base vette. but that goes for any collectable car.
Last edited by tomcamaro97; 09-15-2016 at 02:56 PM.
I call my C4's rolling inheritance as I will never sell them. The two ZR-1's would be hard to replace The Yellow/White 93 is one of only two ZR-1's produced in its color combination would love to live to live long enough to see how it fairs.
22k 89 6 spd Z51 mint just sold for 10k; personal friend on this board picked up a 5x.xxx mi LT1 for around what that 86 was listed for. And it was truly mint condition....super nice.
My old ZR1 which needed some love sold for just under 8000!
Decent C5s are dipping below 10k now.
These cars even many C3s are cheap...not collectors cars
Look how many guys buy a new C7 then fret about future values its like a friggin mental illness, these are not vintage Ferraris they are Chevys...fun and cheap. Is that bad?
What is the problem with that?
The economy sucks, everything is selling for cheap nowadays look around. Good if youre buying not so much if youre selling unless someone falls in love with what you have and doesnt do theri homework.
1. I don't believe anyone on the forum is trying to devalue the C4. The problem I believe is that we are all scattered across the US (and other countries) and each area has a different Corvette market.
2. I do not believe the collector car market will ever make it back to what it was in the first part of 2000. Baby boomers are getting older and seem to have moved on from cars as money investments. The upcoming generations do not seem to have the desire to spend money on these items either. Lack of interest is driving prices down along with over saturation of availability (people selling out). So now it is a buyers market (supply vs demand).
3. Future of C5/C6 vs C4 due to repairability? Really? When was the last time you tried to buy a new ZF transmission? How about having one repaired? How many computers are on a C4? Who still makes them? Have you tried to buy any emissions equipment for a C4? How about a new LT1 or LT4 motor? I predict that soon (5 years) you will not be able to buy a new opti-spark. Oh, don't get me started on dash/gage, seat or any other interior part and their associated repairs and replacements. At least the LS motors are still being serviced by the aftermarket.
Don't get me wrong. I love my C4 and I bought it because I wanted a C4 not because I settled for a C4. I will not sell it EVER. I just don't know how long I will be able to service it when big items fail that are no longer being supported.
I'll pick one subject out of your rant and address it.
Only the body and springs are fiberglass. There is plenty of rust-prone steel in a Corvette.
Is a '72 Corvette inherently worth more than a '72 Camaro?? While it was when they were both new, today they are worth about the same.
22k 89 6 spd Z51 mint just sold for 10k; personal friend on this board picked up a 5x.xxx mi LT1 for around what that 86 was listed for. And it was truly mint condition....super nice.
My old ZR1 which needed some love sold for just under 8000!
Decent C5s are dipping below 10k now.
These cars even many C3s are cheap...not collectors cars
Look how many guys buy a new C7 then fret about future values its like a friggin mental illness, these are not vintage Ferraris they are Chevys...fun and cheap. Is that bad?
What is the problem with that?
The economy sucks, everything is selling for cheap nowadays look around. Good if youre buying not so much if youre selling unless someone falls in love with what you have and doesnt do theri homework.
Does my C4 peform as well as (or better than) many cars costing 2 or 3 times as much? Yes
Does my C4 turn heads? For sure
Are a lot of C4s seen around on the streets? Definitely not
So why aren't they valued higher? I have no idea
Maybe it's because they are highly impractical cars. Yes I know it's a sports car and inherently impractical. But there are sports sedans with great performance and big trunks that will seat 4 comfortably, and a lot of people probably find that functionality and utility more attractive than a sports car.
Maybe it's because many people view C4s as cheesy or gauche. Like, "Mr. Miami Vice, hairy chest, gold chains and polyester suit" gauche. This is not my view nor is it the view of people on CF of course, but many in the average public do see these cars in that light.
Maybe because they have an undeserved reputation of being unreliable. Every model has its issues, and unfortunately with Corvettes they always get lots of press and blown out of proportion. I've had 2 C4s and they have both been completely bulletproof. No issues, period.
I dunno, I'm just thinking out loud at this point. Those are my suspicions. My cherry 1995 LT1/ZF6 coupe will remain all stock, for several reasons... one being that it will pull a better price when I eventually sell.
Also this part at the end of the original post made me laugh hard (rotating MB ad showed up at the perfect time):
09-15-2016, 09:42 AM
C4 pricing. Think about this first.
Finally something worth reading about on C4 values! I agree that when someone posts here asking "whats my car worth" many of the same people here come in with some really low prices claiming that they are all worth next to nothing.
I've been around cars for MANY years restoring, building, buying, selling, and collecting them. I know what I'm doing and what I get selling them, because I know how to sell them. When the car being sold is aimed at a certain group of people, the price will be dictated by those people. High or low, those are the people who you have to listen to as far as offers. This forum is full of people who have never owned but one or two (special) cars. They then consider themselves experts on specialty car values. You have to know how to avoid those guys appraisals and do some homework of the car values in a professional arena. Using CL and free forums is not a real good idea of the whole picture concerning a Corvettes value. Know the car, its history, its production numbers, build statistics, maintenance history and who would really be in the market for that certain car. You'll find that many Corvettes that sell at very low prices are in need of lots of TLC at least or the car is a problem car. I'm sure someone will try to discredit my ramblings here, but I have had extremely good luck getting my HIGH prices on any (special) car I sell. Maybe because I stay with a positive attitude about the car itself and hit the buyer with facts and not opinions.
