AgentEran

So after all this time you mean to tell me there is still no picture of your 1997 LT1 vette?

are you sure its not your '97 trans am?? Or do you have both? Pic of both? No?

GREGGPENN

He only has a Trans Am. It was posted somewhere here/there. IDR when.

The real question is: So after all this time, you mean to tell us you figured out you might be able to modify/cut your hood after all?

Brother.

Phoenix'97

Does the metal strip running in front of the windshield on a fourth-gen F-body, which mounts the wiper motors, look like the hood to you?

With the plastic trim installed, it looks like I have much less room to work with than those pictures I found of the metal cowl frame itself. In order to get this to work, the very bottom of the cowl needs to cut into. I suppose that constitutes the "notch" I was referring to a ways back on one of my threads. If LS guys can fit a supercharged intake in there with some minor trimming of the cowl, then surely I can fit the TPI intake. One of those pictures has an LT1 with a fricken stealth ram, and that still looks like it could have cleared with some minor trim work on the metal cowl. So, to my amazement, the TPI intake may very well fit, but the problem comes in with fabricating the base to bolt up with my LT1 heads and to have enough material to port match it and seat it flush. I will have to painstakingly search for an Accel LT1 super ram base if any ever go up for sale. Otherwise, I need to make use of the base that comes with my TPI purchase in the future, and have a machine shop add material to it, if possible.

PatternDayTrader

So it turns out your intake will fit ? Do you think you should cut out a big chunk of the cowl panel anyway to its easier to get to the back manifold bolts ?

Phoenix'97

I am not going to butcher the cowl like the guy installing the Holley Stealth Ram or the guy who wanted to use a full carburetor on his LT1 or LS1 F-body. The Holley Stealth Ram is an extra 1/2 inch taller than the TPI intake at 9 1/2 inches tall. If you notice, the HSR is taller than the bottom portion of the metal cowl, yet the top portion of the metal cowl was completely removed anyways, eliminating the mounting location for the passenger wiper motor, unless this guy plans to reweld back on what he cut out to install the intake!

I want the shop to raise the motor into the bay with the intake installed to see if we can safely get by without modifying the cowl. The top of the rear of the plenum may actually hit the lowest recessed area of the bottom of the cowl, but will the motor still fit, and will I have enough room for future maintenance to remove the plenum from the runners to access the EGR valve or fuel pressure regulator? The shop will have to let me know. If you look at the pictures, I have a good inch, two, maybe even three, of gap from the bottom portion of the cowl to the upper portion which mounts the wiper motors and attaches the plastic trim.

Worse comes to worse, the shop needs to cut a notch into the cowl where the intake is to give me the extra clearance but avoid cutting into the top portion of the cowl where the passenger side wiper motor mounts. Then, they have to weld it up to maintain the rain water/snow drainage of the cowl, so there will be a bowed area right above the plenum that will still maintain the functionality of the cowl for diverting water.

The car is going to get sandblasted and repainted, so why the hell not spend the extra money to have this done.

PatternDayTrader

Just plan on cutting out a big chunk with a sawzall and a demolition blade. Once you have it together, you can make an access panel out of some 1/2 plate steel that you secure in place with some sheet metal screws.

Phoenix'97

aklim

Most of us wouldn't laugh at a guy in a wheelchair though no fault of his own. OTOH, someone who deliberately cuts a leg off, well....

Phoenix'97

What is your deal? Seriously, what do you have against me putting a TPI intake onto the LT1? I suppose it is backwards in thinking in the performance world but I see the value in the design of the TPI intake, and I want that value on my LT1. What is wrong with that?

AgentEran

The fact that your approach to gain torque from your LT1 is to put a TPI intake on it.. That's pretty bad man.

99% chance you would be satisfied with LTs, exhaust work and some bolt-ons.. It seems like a cam change and tuning in addition to the aforementioned would really get you where you need to be.

There are alot of guys on here with some really good points they all took the time to spell out for you.. These are guys that have put tons of parts on tons of engines and have the experience to know that LT1 intake mods RARELY yield the type of result you are looking for. There are TONS of high hp/tq LTx builds using the stock intake (and TB). The LT1 intake is not a huge hp opportunity like the tpi was on the L98.

Phoenix'97

I appreciate your candor and I appreciate the time everyone has put in, and still manages to have time for, commenting in the threads I have created pertaining to this subject. I understand, a camshaft emphasizing lower-end power production along with mild porting my stock heads or even upgrading to better flowing heads, with 1.7 RRs, the necessary valve-train upgrade to go with them, custom long-tube headers for my power production specifications, and all other parts to get this package to work in unison, and even a mild stroker, will yield good results. However, I want a long runner intake on my motor and then to build around this intake to bolster it's torque production using my stock camshaft and stock rear axle gear ratio, but improving air flow where it is needed and doing what can be done about the exhaust system. The car is a daily driver and my emphasis is on everything required to optimize my motor for low RPM operation, occasional launches, quick shifting, and preserving my daily driving experience and average fuel economy while boosting up power to a decent level but not horribly overkill, until I am ready for it and until I feel that the car can be driven in winter safely with the added low end torque...

I am sold on the TPI intake for my LT1 and, I am hell bent, to make it work.

AgentEran

Is this your first modification to your car?

Phoenix'97

It will be.

AgentEran

You can tell.

I'm not trying to rag on you here, and in fact I wont comment further in your thread. You do have a point in not allowing nay sayers to curtail your actions, however engines are SUPER complex mechanisms that reading forums alone cannot educate anyone enough to trump real world empirical data gained from experience.

I cannot count how many times a rock solid concept did not work out in practice. Everything makes since on paper but on the dyno the result was not had, or other issues rose from complexities unforeseen in planning.

In this case, the planning is not rock solid and the concept is misguided. As explained many times before, what you plan to do to the tpi intake will not make the result you project. People have even posted comparisons of dynos showing the inferior torque curve the L98 has vs LT1. Looking at those charts, any experienced enthusiast would immediately realize the benefits in keeping the LT1 intake and modding other areas that would easily advance power production rather than mess with the intake geometry which can actually have the opposite effect.

I believe the lure to your posts is how incredulous you are to everyone trying to lead you to water. This forum is an invaluable reference for those willing to learn. I personally have gained an immense amount of information from these cats here on this forum that I couldn't get anywhere else. People are willing to pay for the level of expertise these men have. There are many members here whom possess extremely valuable information gained by decades of tooling around with YOUR MOTOR.

Yet you argue with them, all with the grand experience you have gained in your bone stock f-body that has yet to receive a single mod.

Phoenix'97

I am not interested in producing power beyond 5000 RPM. I keep saying this, again, and again, and again, and again! The torque curve of the L98 should be superimposed and increased to that of the LT1 to get an idea of the kind of performance I am looking for, low-end to mid-range torque versus torque produced at higher RPM! I am building a daily driver, not a race car! It has been made apparent in my research that long runner intakes will boost low end to mid-range torque while sacrificing high end torque production, which is something I won't use anyways in my daily driving which is limited by speed, traffic laws, and the often slow nature of some pretty bad drivers out there, or those who are seeking an easy lawsuit.



Yes, I appreciate their advice and some of it I will take into consideration for my build as it pertains to daily driving performance. Other than that, I don't know of ANY of them having tried to put on a TPI intake on an LT1 motor to pursue a different philosophy on performance, one from the low to mid RPM range. These wonderful gentleman know how to make raw power up on high, and the L98 guys know how to improve performance for their motors, but I am the oddball because no one with a "performance" oriented mind has ever tried to put a TPI intake on an LT1 motor but a few have inquired about it only to get shot down by "those who know best", as if high RPM torque production is the only thing I must be mandated to do for my LT1. No, the LT1 needs it's older cousin as an intake, the TPI. I wish to make it happen.

rocco16

I'll answer your initial question:

No, a machine shop cannot "squish" the runners down at all. Here's why;
the runners are cast aluminum, probably (alloy) 356. As such they are not malleable. I.e. they will fracture if you try to bend them. I'm also betting there are other components under the plenum that would prevent the lowering of said plenum.
If you want to restrict both max torque and high end power, just put a throttle stop on the throttle body and adjust it to where you are comfortable.

Tom400CFI

No. It has been made apparent that the TPI intake boosts MID RANGE TQ. Go back...A-GAIN...and look at the tq graphs that I took my good time, to post...just for you. Where is the "boost"? It's from about 2500 - 3500 RPM or so....which is smack dab in the middle of "MID RANGE" on a idle to 5500 RPM engine. ~2500-~3500 is NOT, "low end". The TPI intake does not boost tq from idle to ~2500 RPM or so, in a meaningful way. Use your eyeballs and LOOK at the graph.



Dude....people have literally lead you to the waters of low RPM tq. And yet, here you are again, stating the horse **** in bold above. The root problem is that you simply, refuse to learn and/or listen. Both your quotes above are proof of that. I can't fathom how college is going for you. Yikes.

aklim

It's backwards in any realistic world. This is the idea of trying make something work despite the fact that it won't. What you are trying to do with your conditions is to push the only answer into the TPI intake. Exactly why you can't name a price for it. It will cost way more than any intake to make it work, assuming it would ever work. On top of that, you are looking for a someone to say it can be done.

aklim

If it doesn't involve a TPI intake, he will never be satisfied.

aklim

Exactly. You also want everyone to feel like you in spite of the fact it is crazy. Why can't you name a number you will be willing to spend to get it to work? Because it is yet another impossibility that is concrete