Tom400CFI

Ghey.

v8vette84

96-02' Viper GTS is my dream car. Always has been. I love my Corvette and all Corvettes BUT there's nothing like a Viper. Like was said before me, you see 100 vettes to one Viper. Hell, it's probably a higher ratio than that near me.

Lingenfelter

I was going to get a 2001-02 Viper, love almost everything about it except the lack of traction control and skid control. Bought a C5Z instead and couldn't be more happier.

v8vette84

THAT is the reason you passed on a Viper?

Lingenfelter

Yup! Right after I saw one spin out and crash into a building. Most of the weight is in the front and with no nannies what's so ever, it's a pretty scary car. Kind of like if I turn off skid control in my Z, but even worse.

v8vette84

I guess if you can’t handle a semi powerful car... I’ve never had an issue handling my 383 84’ and a Viper is WAY more competent of a vehicle. To each his own I guess. I personally hate those systems that “help” you. If you can drive you shouldn’t need assists imho.

lotsofspareparts

I agree.

Learning how to handle and harness that kind of power takes time. If your tires start spinning..... lift your foot.

Jared

dmaxx3500

cslr owned lambo,,bought it for $11 mil,sold it for $110mil to audi

RockyL32

The weight balance of the first gen is 49/50 it’s a fairly balanced car. The issue a lot of people had with trying to drive one hard is the torque. If you do not know how to apply power coming out of a turn it will come around on you. I think people that have never had a car without the nanny safety features (abs, traction control, etc) May have a hard time learning to really drive a car. Those that can drive, find even the first gen Viper to be a great track car.

drcook

GM owned Lotus, who worked on the design of the original LT5 engine. Both domestic automakers had help in coming up with their "exotic" engines. GM also sold Lotus but the articles I have found so far haven't said for how much.

MatthewMiller

Well...this topic went pear-shaped with misinformation in a hurry!
As already noted, this is not true. The Viper is pretty well balanced, and has fat wheels and tires (i.e., lots of grip). The early Vipers didn't even come with tons of power in our modern way of thinking about power: the first and second generations had less or equal power to a base C7! It's a little over the top to say they are dangerous cars. That said...

I don't know v8vette84 at all, so the following isn't about him in particular. My experience is that most people who think they know how to handle a powerful car don't. They've been riding along as a passenger in their own car for years, on a wing and a prayer that they don't ever really get into a situation that demands skills. Put them in a situation where they actually need to use some skills to manage it, and they're screwed. Of course, this is not a good reason to pass on a Viper. It's a good reason to go learn how to really drive!


^^^Case in point^^^. This is the surest way to recreate all the youtube videos of cars wiping out when leaving cars-n-coffee events.

Lingenfelter

I found the C5Z in competition mode (traction control off/ skid on) to be non intrusive and a lot more fun and safer then the Viper. It's also a much better balanced, stiffer and predictable sports car to drive when pushing it hard.

Tom400CFI

To each their own, I guess.

Objectively, I doubt that the C5 is stiffer than a Viper. You mean frame rigidity? Or suspension? I doubt the C5 is stiffer in either.


I'd take a Viper in a split second, over a C5. It's a lot closer to the "amusement park ride, that you control", experience that I prefer.

TLS_Addict

So much bad information about Vipers, it's sad some people call themselves a "car guy/gal".

As said, Vipers are well balanced vehicles with wide tires and lots of torque.

I don't get the entire "No nannies so I will take this car instead..." Well, how many old school cars without nannies have been modded to more hp than the stock Viper? A **** ton. I bet those guys are just lining up to trade in for a full nanny car.

Stop being a pansy. Learn how to tame your car when it gets squirrelly (it's a humbling experience I can assure you). Or is your argument about not getting a Viper and your opposition towards it based on other limiting factors?

If you hate on the Viper because some Viper owners hated on the C4 that's comical. Hell, most Corvette generations hate on the C4, do you hate those as well?

Lingenfelter

If you're talking about me, I already said I love Vipers especially the 2nd generation. I think they look like nothing else on the road and it's still true today. I also have a Numbered edition Lingenfelter C4 and absolutely love the C4. Go drive the Viper and then a C5 Z06. You'll be amazed how raw the C5Z feels and drives. I personally love having the ability to either turn on traction control/ stability control or put it in competition mode or just turn off the system completely if you want. BTW, the last generation Viper has this ability as well.

Lingenfelter

I didn't even consider a C5 having already a special C4. Viper was all I thought about. I had a CTS-V II. One day I'm driving with 4 people in my car and a 2nd generation Viper (exactly like the one I was looking to buy) starts playing with me. My CTS-V was a manual, basically stock except for Billy Boat exhaust and an Airaid CAI. While his tail was going side to side trying to get traction, I'm passing him by. Make a long story short I see a Z06 for sale, drove it and while it's not as raw as a Viper, it's pretty close. It has almost no insulation, thinner glass and titanium exhaust. The Z felt more in control, I knew exactly where the car was going and 400 pounds lighter is very noticeable. Go drive one and report back. I've driven a C5 before and a Z is a completely different beast.

Tom400CFI

[QUOTE=Lingenfelter;1599436621Go drive one and report back. I've driven a C5 before and a Z is a completely different beast.[/QUOTE]
I have. Also owed a C6 (similar performance). Not a completely different beast. But...it's cool that you like yours!

Lingenfelter

Sorry, but a base C5 or a base C6 feels nothing like a track ready Z. It's way more raw and if you've driven one you would instantly feel/ know it. And thanks I do love my corvettes.

Tom400CFI

Pssst! Hey...look!....

TLS_Addict

C5Z is an easy car to live with day to day but drive a C6Z or C7Z like you can a C5Z and you will end up dead and do so quickly. I didn't find the C5Z raw at all. And much like most magazines tests it's the car your mother could drive every day without issue. They are very civil but run like hell when pushed. Raw though is not a word I would equate with the C5Z. It's an awesome car but nothing even remotely close to a Viper of the same vintage. That's not a slight against the C5Z, that's a compliment of the engineering. The only "raw" feeling is maybe the way the power comes on like a rush vs how the LS2 feels more linear.

The C5Z is track capable but not track ready. 01 had ring seat issue, 02/early 03 need valve springs swapped, rear diff needs cooling help, tranny cooler, 04 are an upgrade over the prior years shocks but aftermarket are leaps and bounds above, 01 weak shift fork, windows that pop away from the body on high speed runs, pretty sad seats for lateral holding and terrible stock shifter.

That being said the C5Z is one of the best deals on a super high performance car out there. Easy to mod and fun to drive and I would be proud to have one. I loved both my LS3 cars, especially the one that produced 700 hp. lol turn all the nannies off on that and you have a raw car. My soon to be 750 hp Camaro SS WTH no traction control is going to be raw but that's what it's built for.

This stigma of the Viper being a shoddy handler and easy to crash is because you had people used to driving Vettes with 245 hp jump in a 450 torque vehicle and try to drive it the same way. You cant drive it like that. It takes restraint when you have that much power.

Please don't think I am bashing your C5Z, those are great cars. More interested in your C4 though.