misfire? or not?
Racer
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 405
Likes: 0
From: 1984 crossfire, Alhaurin de la Torre Malaga, Spain
I do not know the kind of wires you have now, but isn´t it possible that you have both resistive wires AND resistive plugs? Than the double resistance and the wider gap may end up in too little spark to push through wet plugs. My 84 has quite a few times wet plugs when I start it at a cold day. Than a few cylinders won´t fire until I drive it a hundred yards. With double the resistance I know I should have that problem also.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 6,130
Likes: 2
From: seattle WA
awe-the simple things-you pulled the plug wires! put #1 back in the 5 oclock position-everything worked fine before this????? I say you goofed, pretty bold huh? Now you need to pull #1 plug, get the piston
up on compression stroke TDC, and check where your rotor is pointing, getting off a little is all to common, ask me how I know lol. If you're getting fuel and spark-but probably not in the right sequence. I know-I get bull headed and say I already checked that errrrrrrrrrrrr-but it's just to easy.sorry-just my 2 cents worth.
up on compression stroke TDC, and check where your rotor is pointing, getting off a little is all to common, ask me how I know lol. If you're getting fuel and spark-but probably not in the right sequence. I know-I get bull headed and say I already checked that errrrrrrrrrrrr-but it's just to easy.sorry-just my 2 cents worth.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,110
Likes: 0
From: JUPITER FLORIDA
I had those header plugs from accel. I gapped them my self to .35, my car idles a bit crappy but its my throttle body, old and might need to be cleaned a bit better. If the old plugs arent in bad shape I would just put those back in to make sure that is the problem. Dont get off track by checking other stuff until you check and make sure its the plugs. Remember you didnt have the problem before you touch those plugs, right?
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Originally Posted by rick lambert
awe-the simple things-you pulled the plug wires! put #1 back in the 5 oclock position-everything worked fine before this????? I say you goofed, pretty bold huh? Now you need to pull #1 plug, get the piston
up on compression stroke TDC, and check where your rotor is pointing, getting off a little is all to common, ask me how I know lol. If you're getting fuel and spark-but probably not in the right sequence. I know-I get bull headed and say I already checked that errrrrrrrrrrrr-but it's just to easy.sorry-just my 2 cents worth.
up on compression stroke TDC, and check where your rotor is pointing, getting off a little is all to common, ask me how I know lol. If you're getting fuel and spark-but probably not in the right sequence. I know-I get bull headed and say I already checked that errrrrrrrrrrrr-but it's just to easy.sorry-just my 2 cents worth.
While working on it last weekend I remove the cap and put the engine at TDC and the rotor facing at #1
Let me tell you what I have done tonight so far.
Replace all the accel plugs with new ACDelco's it was a PITA but got them in. Check out the voltage to the map sensor it read 5.2 volts. Checked my wires again before trying it and still nothin. This time the car didn't even start for a second. Only turned over. So I've eliminated the chance that it was the plugs.
But I'm still working on it.
Cplonner
No I didn't have the problem prior to replacing the plugs but did install a set of headers on it. Thought I was doing the right thing by replacing the plugs while I had it all apart.
Burning Brakes
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,110
Likes: 0
From: JUPITER FLORIDA
I had what sounds exactly like what you have, I mean the same exact thing, bad tps. car would start run for a second then die, the only way it would run at all is if I played with the gas pedal and never let of of it, the second I took my foot of the pedal it would die, I replaced the tps and it came right to life. All you gotta do is check that with a voltmeter to see if it is bad. Just another suggestion 
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Spent some time on it today and this is what I came up with. I followed the FSM.
TPS is working and not stuck open 5.2 volts
ESC also working with 5.1 volts
Map Sensor is working with 5.2 volts
IAC working with 5.1 volts
EGR solenoid is operating correctly
Both Injectors are working and spraying a lot of fuel, each wire tested for spark, firing order 18436572.
Distributor wasn't removed and when the cap was removed the engine was never turn over. According to the FSM it says it must be common HEI problem, but where?
Oh yeah, bought a scanner for it today and no codes.
So this thing should run fine, don't you think?
TPS is working and not stuck open 5.2 volts
ESC also working with 5.1 volts
Map Sensor is working with 5.2 volts
IAC working with 5.1 volts
EGR solenoid is operating correctly
Both Injectors are working and spraying a lot of fuel, each wire tested for spark, firing order 18436572.
Distributor wasn't removed and when the cap was removed the engine was never turn over. According to the FSM it says it must be common HEI problem, but where?
Oh yeah, bought a scanner for it today and no codes.
So this thing should run fine, don't you think?
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Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 6,130
Likes: 2
From: seattle WA
Don't see how it could be HEI if you're getting spark to each plug unless it's a weak spark, just bought a new coil for mine yesterday. Code 12 is normal. If your getting fuel,air, spark and compression it should start-since you didn't remove the dist. and you didn't turn the engine over, and it ran prior to this, it maybe possible that number 1
was not at the 5 oclock position you indicated-did you mark the cap
#1 with something like-I use masking tape?
was not at the 5 oclock position you indicated-did you mark the cap
#1 with something like-I use masking tape?
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Glad to hear someone say Code 12 is normal. I got reading that FSM last night and it was starting to confuse me. I use a the high voltage cap from Mallory and at the 3 oclock postion is the wires for the tach and such. Just below that is the #1 connection. I used the tach wire hook up location as the guideline.
If the sensor the the A/C clutch compressor is disconnected will it effect start up. The manual 6e2-54, "stall after start" refers to a good connection to this unit
If the sensor the the A/C clutch compressor is disconnected will it effect start up. The manual 6e2-54, "stall after start" refers to a good connection to this unit
Race Director
Joined: Sep 2000
Posts: 17,298
Likes: 33
From: The Top of Utah
Is it stalling after start up? Are you trying to start the car with the A/C "ON"?
"at the 3 o'clock position is the wires for the tach and such. Just below that is the #1 connection." That may be fine the way your car is set up. You can install the distributor to put the #1 wire anywhere you want. Typically, the #1 wire is in the 5 o'clock position, one notch clockwise from where *I* understand you to have it.
RACE ON!!!
"at the 3 o'clock position is the wires for the tach and such. Just below that is the #1 connection." That may be fine the way your car is set up. You can install the distributor to put the #1 wire anywhere you want. Typically, the #1 wire is in the 5 o'clock position, one notch clockwise from where *I* understand you to have it.
RACE ON!!!
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Originally Posted by CFI-EFI
Is it stalling after start up? Are you trying to start the car with the A/C "ON"?
No, after reading more of the FSM the A/C is not on
Originally Posted by CFI-EFI
"at the 3 o'clock position is the wires for the tach and such. Just below that is the #1 connection." That may be fine the way your car is set up. You can install the distributor to put the #1 wire anywhere you want. Typically, the #1 wire is in the 5 o'clock position, one notch clockwise from where *I* understand you to have it.
RACE ON!!!
I got my second 84 yesterday and have that in the garage with the hood up to help.
Each spark plug wire was then tested for spark and I am back to using the AC Delco's
Le Mans Master
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 6,130
Likes: 2
From: seattle WA
Well if you think it's flooding hold the gas pedal to the floor while cranking-that should throw the computer into flood mode and it should start ifn everything else is correct.Like CFI said, you can actually have number 1 in a different location-I know what you're saying as far as they show it-that's why I asked if you marked (I use masking tape) where your #1 plug wire was originally in your cap?
Last edited by rick lambert; Mar 5, 2006 at 02:30 PM.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
FINALLY! It runs, little rough but I'll get that. Come to find out it was fuel, even though it was spraying a good amount into the tbs, it wasn't enough. I unplugged the relay for the fuel pump and re-attached it and the pump turned on for the 2 or 3 seconds it needs to. I thought it was before because mine has always been quiet. Through all this I did learn alot about sensors and there functions. Thanks guys for your help and making me think.
Racer
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 476
Likes: 0
From: Tucson, AZ. L98-85 AUTO COUPE: 120k MILES: daily driver. SOUND OFF IF YOU'VE BEEN THERE. Ex-Jumpin' Junky-82nd Airborne-2/505 PIR: 1st ID-1/16th Inf: Recon Marine Retread. GOD BLESS GRUNTS.
BOOYAH!!!!
this just goes to show, wet plugs don't always mean adequate fuel--a lesson learned. now i know if i don't hear the pump pressurizing the system, i may have a problem. listening for the pump and click before a cold start is a good habit i have--reduces crank time/start-up wear too.
guess the time i spent typing this crap was minor compared to the time you spent finding the problem. but that's what it's all about.
if you had the money to pay for a mechanic, and didn't, i'm proud of you for sticking with it. hell, good job either way.
frog.
this just goes to show, wet plugs don't always mean adequate fuel--a lesson learned. now i know if i don't hear the pump pressurizing the system, i may have a problem. listening for the pump and click before a cold start is a good habit i have--reduces crank time/start-up wear too.
guess the time i spent typing this crap was minor compared to the time you spent finding the problem. but that's what it's all about.
if you had the money to pay for a mechanic, and didn't, i'm proud of you for sticking with it. hell, good job either way.
frog.
Last edited by parafrog; Mar 5, 2006 at 10:29 PM.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Originally Posted by parafrog
BOOYAH!!!!
this just goes to show, wet plugs don't always mean adequate fuel--a lesson learned. now i know if i don't hear the pump pressurizing the system, i may have a problem. listening for the pump and click before a cold start is a good habit i have--reduces crank time/start-up wear too.
guess the time i spent typing this crap was minor compared to the time you spent finding the problem. but that's what it's all about.
if you had the money to pay for a mechanic, and didn't, i'm proud of you for sticking with it. hell, good job either way.
frog.
this just goes to show, wet plugs don't always mean adequate fuel--a lesson learned. now i know if i don't hear the pump pressurizing the system, i may have a problem. listening for the pump and click before a cold start is a good habit i have--reduces crank time/start-up wear too.
guess the time i spent typing this crap was minor compared to the time you spent finding the problem. but that's what it's all about.
if you had the money to pay for a mechanic, and didn't, i'm proud of you for sticking with it. hell, good job either way.
frog.
Thread Starter
Melting Slicks
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,658
Likes: 4
From: Clifton Park NY
Originally Posted by rick lambert
glad you fiqured it out. Suppose you could use a new fuel filter.