95BLKVette

Just purchased the $EE / $EEB ECM files for use with the Tuner 2.25V program. Was able to connect to my PCM and read the Bin file with my LT-1 Edit cable.

Question is, can't seem to find the fan temperature On / Off settings in Tuner and some of the other functions I can see in Lt-1 edit.

Does the program display these differently?

I basically was interested in Tuner as it can change the display fuel use settings as I have 30# injectors. You can't edit that in LT-1 edit.

Any comments are appreciated

STL94LT1

It is located about halfway down the second column of Tables, "Fan enable vs coolant temp vs speed".

95BLKVette

Yes, but the table only shows 4 numbers that are apparently in MPH

Even when you graph it it's a diagonal line with mph on the left vertical axis and fan 1 to fan 2 along the bottom.

This is the table view:

Fan Enable Coolant Temp (Deg. C) Vs. Speed

Fan # MPH
Low High
1 79.25 79.25
2 85.25 85.25

Am I missing something?

Is there some formula combining the temp in the numbers?

STL94LT1

I don't know why they listed the values in mph, just ignore the mph and use Celsius.

95BLKVette

Gee thanks, that was easy.

BTW, how come in the ECM definition help file they don't list all the items you se in the table screen?

Would be very helpful if they did

STL94LT1

TunerCat keeps updating their ECM files, guess the help section is lagging behind.

Also, on the fan changes I like my fan's on/off temps to be different temp settings. For example, Fan #1 low 82* high 85*, fan #2 low 87* high 90*.

Think how confusing all of these tables can be to the newbee tuner.

95BLKVette

Actually, I wonder if the program values you believe are on and off temperature limits actually are that!

This is the LT-1 edit user definitions for the high/low values:

Under each stage there are two settings, the PCM uses the first setting when the car speed in MPH is below the Fan Speed threshold, the second setting is used when the car road speed is over the Fan Speed threshold.

The Hysteresis is the temperature drop required before the fans turn off. The upper Hysteresis value is used when the road speed is below threshold, and the lower value is used when the road speed is above the threshold.

The values I see when I look at the same PCM file in the two programs are the under and over speed values, not lower and upper temperature values. I think I'm going to ask the TC guy to explain these....

BTW, I think I'm correct as the fan hysteresis values are in the ECM constants listing and they match my LT-1 edit definitions.

So, the values you think are low and high fan temps are actually fan turn on temps at below and above the MPH threshold.

The hysteresis is the deg C temp drop before the fans turn off.

Also, the MPH threshold speed is in the ECM constants list just below the hysteresis values and they match my zero speed value in LT-1 edit

STL94LT1

In earlier versions of the $EE definition file the fans on/off were in the ECM Constant tables, which was less confusing. When I recieved an update of the def file I couldn't find the fan settings, so I emailed TC and they responded with the table "Fan enable vs coolant temp vs speed" controls the fan temps on/off.

Let me know what you find out.
-Mike

95BLKVette

TC hasn't responded yet, however, I know I'm correct based on comparing the values in LT-1 edit and tunercat using my bin to lt-1 file type converter....I can open the exact same data file information in each program and compare them side by side. Then I use the Lt-1 manual which has the details of what each value is that TC doesn't explain.

Like I stated before, the LT-1 edit hysterisis values are the same as the TC constant values, etc.

I don't know who told you that those table values were the low and high temperatures, but that is unfortunately not the case. They are the fan turn on C temps above and below the vehicle set mph for fan 1 & fan 2.

Sorry

STL94LT1

No your wrong, I'm 100% sure that I'm right.

Care to place a friendly wager on it?

95BLKVette

I really appreciate your truly tactfull Opinion, but it's just that, an Opinion

Tuner Cat, LT-1 Edit, RT Tuner, etc. are all just ECM bin file readers/editors that permit editing the values in GM's original data tables. They cannot combine data or alter the arrangement of the data tables, nor add additional data items, as the ECM base operation system or BIOS programing would need to be altered. So, whatever LT-1 edit reads and defines, has to be the same in all the other edit programs. Your explanation of the table values unfortunatley does not agree with this logic.

We have too much invested in our vehicles to be guessing what controls what.

I'm a professional engineer, and not much of a gambler

I'd like to confirm the data fan table values definition from the author so all the Forum members can benefit.

Below is a copy of the email I just resent requesting a Yes/No response from TC on this topic:



Sorry to bother you again, but another member of the Corvette Forum is challenging me on this and we need to have a Yes or No from you on the following:

Thanks in advance......

Was discussing your fan enable temperture (C) vs speed table.

It shows 4 values.

When I lookup the same 4 values in LT-1 edit

They define them as follows:

Under each stage there are two settings, the PCM uses the first setting when the car speed in MPH is below the Fan Speed threshold, the second setting is used when the car road speed is over the Fan Speed threshold.

The Hysteresis is the temperature drop required before the fans turn off. The upper Hysteresis value is used when the road speed is below threshold, and the lower value is used when the road speed is above the threshold.

Is this the same definition as for your values?

Thanks so much,

95BLKVette

96z51

oh this should be good.

STL94LT1

"Sorry for the confusion. The Fan on/off points were recently moved to a table called 'Fan Enable Coolant Temp Vs. Speed' located in the tables section. This was done to free up some space to add some new constants. The help file hasn't been updated yet.

Best regards,

TC"

STL94LT1

Why doesn't this surprise me!!

95BLKVette

Sorry, TC's explanation doesn't agree with with the table title....I wonder if they actually know whats in the ECM table!

Was almost ready to purchase the program as I have purchased the ECM constant file to see how it works.....

Staying with LT-1 edit...at least I know what its doing

95BLKVette

The current response from TC as of today is in agreement with me as follows (this makes logical sense based on what is in the constant tables as I noted previously):


Hi Al,

Sorry I guess you didn't receive our last e-mail for some reason.

Yes, the temperatures in the Low column are used when the vehicle speed is less than the 'Fan High/Low Vehicle Speed Threshold' constant value. For speeds above this value the temperatures in the 'High' column are used.
Once the coolant temperature rises above these thresholds the fan will stay on until the coolant temperature drops below the threshold minus the 'Fan Temp. Hysteresis - Low Vehicle Speed' (or 'Fan Temp Hysteresis - High Vehicle Speed' depending on vehicle speed) constant value.


Best regards,
TC

STL94LT1

Wow, some people just can't admit when they are WRONG!!!

95BLKVette

Yah, we're all waiting for you to fess up




It's just nice to know we finally know that the tables match the LT-1 definition, so Forum Members can basically reference the LT-1 Edit User Guide on the Tune It Up Website as a referenece point until TC updates the help file