Amethyst643

The check engine light isn't on so it's not giving me any codes... Is there a special way to check it for the ANTI LOCK light?

jhammons01

We've been through this before....once you've locked up the brakes or activated the ABS, the pads have done their job.......stopping distance will be determined by your tires and the traction to the pavement.....the pads are no longer part of that equation.

So if your brakes won't get to the point of lock up, then yes there is a problem with your brakes.

which brings us full circle, if $20 brakes are getting to lock up or ABS activation.......$150 pads are just a waste of money....

jaa1992

You'll need someone with a Tech I with the BCM module to read the ABS code on your 87.
Maybe a friendly mechanic at your local dealer can read it for you?

Before you do that check your brake fluid level - it needs to be pretty full to turn off the light.

Aardwolf

And that is exactly the point I'm making, dunno if you can't read or what. I've had cheap pads that can't make enough torque to activate ABS, as I said in post 14.

OP make sure when you bed those pads that they make enough stopping power.

jhammons01

^^And you fail to read what it is I am saying...if the $20 pads are grabbing...why go with $150 pads?

Your experience leads me to think that your older (plastic diaphragm) brake booster may have had a leak....where as my '84 (Steel Diaphragm) brake booster may be doing it's job.

My $20 pads reach lock up when I ask them to......as I stated in my earlier post, if your brakes do not reach lock up or ABS activation, there is a problem.....scrutiny of the pads may be just a band aid.

Of course there is the ABS module reset technique that you may have failed to perform......how many "hard brake pedal" threads are cured by a simple resetting of the ABS module found in later cars?

NO ONE in this thread has mentioned this to the OP......the main advice in 24 replies has been "spend more money".

Buying more bling bling to fix your ills is not always the answer. It makes the person spending the money feel like they are doing the right thing due to so many folks on here telling them lay out more cash.....Then, unfortunately when their original problem still exists (but only after they've purchased new rotors, Booster, Master Cylinder, calipers and $150 pads) then they actually start looking to diagnose.....then we get the "Hard brake pedal" thread where the OP details all the money and time spent trying to address this issue of poorly grabbing brakes......and a simple ABS module reset would have addressed the problem.....

But hey, what do I know??

jhammons01

Here is a guy that "finally" diagnosed properly his brake issue....just a coincidence that I typed all that ^^^out and then saw the title to this thread....lol....but what do I know

http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c4-t...xpectedly.html

Aardwolf

Just to be clear, when I wrote vehicles I meant many of them and not all Corvettes. I worked on one car with a set of cheap pads that were so bad it looked like junk slopped together. There were steel wires throughout the compound, which looked like broken bristles from a wire brush. I think those were the cheapest NAPA pad, I should have taken a picture and captioned it bubba pads.

I am glad yours are working out for you!

jhammons01

and that is why I post alternate controversial solutions.....

Group think is not always the correct solution. Sometimes issues with our cars can be fixed by correct diagnoses and spending very little money.

The brake issue is just one myth that I like to bust....If the OP's goal is to fix his brakes, I have advice to give that addresses actually fixing the issue, if the OP's goal is to make his car look really cool with red calipers etc...then that is another type of advice....but commingling the advice often times lead to frustration and money spent needlessly.

I grew up very poor.....so my advice usually has a frugal bias.

Aardwolf

Mine too! I like to work on cars though. Take care of your brake systems! I remember driving my father's car as a teen and it had crappy brakes. I thought that was just normal. I ended up getting in an accident (couldn't slow down for a deer) that may have been avoidable with better brakes. I didn't realize just how bad they were till I started my road course track hobby.

RedLS1GTO

So would you recommend the cheapest pads I can find for my track car that has to repeatedly stop reliably from 160+? The alternative of course is hitting something very hard.

There is a huge variation in brake pad performance from one compound to another, even within the same manufacturer.



Will the El Cheapo pads work on the street? Probably. You might never have an issue with them and you can walk away with a smile and money saved but saying that the type of pads doesn't matter and that the $20 pads are just as good because you can lock them up is pure crap.

jhammons01

160+MPH??? LOL....mkay.....it is EXACTLY the SAME thing (not)

I thought we were talking about a car that drives down the street......whatever...

RedLS1GTO

Is that an extreme case? Absolutely... but the point remains the same. The type of brake pads matter. You are saying that the $20 ones are just as good which is 100% wrong. I also very clearly said that the cheap ones would most likely be good enough on the street.

Do you run your car on 87 octane gas or 93? Do you put Wal-Mart tires on your Vette? If you needed paint work would you go to Maaco? Do you buy the cheapest replacement parts you can find if something breaks or do you look for quality replacements? Do you use the cheapest generic oil you can find?

There are a lot of things that are "good enough" for some people. Using the cheapest brake pads you can find is no different than any of the other ways to cheap out on your car.

Crepitus

Andrew
800-442-0335

jhammons01

Interesting how you avoid the inevitable.....

What if the $20 pads are the same compound that you think is the best...what would say to that?

What if Wal-Mart oil was made by Castrol or Mobile and packaged for walmart, what would you say?

What if I do run 87 octane?? I have no valve clatter....

What If I cross reference Corvette 4x3 tranny O/D filters and buy the exact same filter that is sold for a Ford FMX....now what??

And yes, if I can find a cross reference or a manufacturers part number and figure out that a part on the vette is the same as one from a Chevy corsica.....I'll buy the Corsica part and save a dime.

You say you don't know what the compound of the $20 brakes is made up of?? mkay....

next....

RedLS1GTO

If it was the same compound I would be all for it. It isn't. One look at them and you can figure that out. If they were exactly the same, why would you say that using them at 160+ was any different than on the street? I have no problem using a Hawk pad on the street and then turning around and using it on a track. Do you think your $20 pads are capable of that?

Almost all of the generic oil is made at the same plant and by the same companies. It doesn't mean it is the same product. The additives are different, the content of different materials is just a little bit off of spec, all sorts of differences. Again, if you want to run it... go for it. It is good enough for you, not for me.

If audible valve clatter is your measuring stick by all means, save a few cents.

Exact same parts? Go for it.

Who said I didn't know? I know I didn't say that. I have researched just about every type of caliper and pad out there for C4 Corvettes during the building of my track car.

All you have to do is look at a $20 pad next to a Wilwood, Carbotech, Hawk, etc to be able to see the difference in materials used.

Next what?

What if What if What if What if... You said WHAT IF on all of your arguments. That is great. If the cheap parts were the same then by all means use them. The problem with your theory is that 99% of the time they aren't the same.


All I have learned from your posts is to NEVER buy a car that you have owned. mkay.

93Rubie

I am not very familiar with 87's but some quick research shows that you WILL need some sort of compatible scan tool to access the ABS codes. A GM Tech 1 will work or maybe a better OBD-1 capable scan tool, like a good Snap-On scan tool or other. Seek out local repair shops/dealer that you trust.

jhammons01

Then you are unable to learn....not my problem.

Amethyst643

Geez people. I already bought brakes and installed them. They were a grand total of $120 ($60 for front and $60 for rear). I live on a long curvy mountain road in Arkansas. I do drive the car fast so I didn't want the CHEAPEST of all brakes. But it's not like I race it, so there's no need to buy some high-performance super expensive brand. I wanted them with a warranty, to last longer, and not to be too expensive. I am HAPPY with them.

I'm NOT happy with the fact that my ANTI LOCK light is on and my Emergency brake doesn't work. Jhammons01, you said something about resetting the ABS module..?

RedLS1GTO

I learn very well. In fact, what I have learned is that 99.9% of the time you get what you pay for with car parts. Usually the good name brands are the good ones for a reason.

That doesn't mean blindly going and buying the most expensive thing you can find. It means doing the research and finding the best part at the best price. Usually I end up somewhere at the top-middle of the price range. A perfect example is K&N oil filters. They are very expensive but if you cut one apart it is pretty easy to see that they aren't nearly as good as the AC Delco, Wix, and other filters that are less expensive. I had to replace a water pump at the track earlier this year. Because nobody had a Delco in stock, I had to use a Chinese made Duralast pump instead. It lasted less than a day at 7,000 rpm. When I pulled it apart the difference in construction quality was unbelievable. The same goes for almost every part you buy. There is good, and then there is the cheap alternative. I'm putting brand new Michelin PS2 tires on the Z06 this weekend. If you ever compare them on the same car with the cheap tires (and I have) it is no contest. There are a million more examples just like these...

It's 100% your choice. If you want to keep using the cheapo Chinese parts, go for it. That is obviously good enough for you. I don't want them anywhere near my cars. Maybe I am obsessive with it but personally, I think that anything worth doing is worth doing right. I work as a Quality Engineer for a Fortune 5 company and I deal with the balance of cost vs. quality every single day but hey, I guess that really doesn't mean that I have the slightest clue as to what I am talking about.

RedLS1GTO

There are a lot of things that can cause the ABS light to come on. The sensors on each of the hubs is a culprit many times. Try unplugging each of them and cleaning any crud that might be in there.