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View Poll Results: Would you be interested in a bulletproof IRS for the C4, assuming had a need?
Yes, i would be interested 22 68.75%
No, I'd rather just put a straight axle in 2 6.25%
Maybe, especially if it were available individually 4 12.50%
Only if it were cheaper than a straight axle 4 12.50%
Voters: 32. You may not vote on this poll

A truly Bolt in Bulletproof IRS, yes or no?

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Old 01-11-2018, 12:18 PM   #1
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Default A truly Bolt in Bulletproof IRS, yes or no?

IF a company offered a turn key setup for a bullet proof, bolt in IRS for the C4 would you be interested over a straight axle? would it depend on the price?
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Old 01-11-2018, 03:29 PM   #2
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What's wrong with the IRS that the C4 is born with? Seems like it works well and is pretty tough. We don't see a lot of C4 drivetrain failures due to design or materials, only due to the abuse some of us put them through

If you're talking bulletproof for drag racing, I think that should be mentioned.
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Old 01-11-2018, 04:34 PM   #3
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Yes, but it always depends on the cost.
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Old 01-11-2018, 11:35 PM   #4
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Bulletproof for drag racing, or the abuse we give them is exactly what I mean. No major suspension redesign, but beefier driveline Parts that would bolt right in with minimal or no modifications.
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Old 01-12-2018, 09:14 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vader86 View Post
Yes, but it always depends on the cost.
..... ^^^ This ! ^^^ .....
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Old 01-12-2018, 10:01 AM   #6
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$$$$$ - It's irrelevant!! There's NO ONE that's interested in creating such hardware for the C4. If you like IRS you make do with the few modifications that are available now.

A well maintained D44 actually should do quite well. Most D44 actually don't see much maintenance.
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:01 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by WVZR-1 View Post
$$$$$ - It's irrelevant!! There's NO ONE that's interested in creating such hardware for the C4. If you like IRS you make do with the few modifications that are available now.

A well maintained D44 actually should do quite well. Most D44 actually don't see much maintenance.
I can say, with 100% certainty, that your statement about no one being interested is wrong. If the market is there, it can be done. And I think it can be done cost effectively.
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:12 PM   #8
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Here is one aftermarket IRS
https://www.dutchmanaxles.com/irs-ho...oke-style.html

Just add a few custom made parts and its a boltin part.
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Old 01-12-2018, 12:24 PM   #9
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Price will be the MAIN selling point.
I'm interested in one. Mainly because I have a D36 and can't locate a D44 local.
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Old 01-12-2018, 05:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vetteman9368 View Post
I can say, with 100% certainty, that your statement about no one being interested is wrong. If the market is there, it can be done. And I think it can be done cost effectively.
I said NO ONE and I'm quite sure you can't show me a single vendor/manufacturer that's interested in producing and supporting an IRS that's C4 specific with the various ratios that would be required to satisfy the 'masses'.

I guess it's SHOW ME!!! time
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Old 01-14-2018, 12:02 AM   #11
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Iím working with one now. The center section is easy (and actually already available). Working on an idea right now for the outer axles/hubs, other than the Summers Brothers stuff. My goal is to try and use more readily available, heavier duty stuff to accomplish the same things that has been done with the C3 IRS stuff. But since you think you know everything, carry on!
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Old 01-14-2018, 04:48 AM   #12
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Default A truly Bolt in Bulletproof IRS, yes or no?

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Originally Posted by vetteman9368 View Post
But since you think you know everything, carry on!
If that comment was directed to me - I never mentioned "knowing everything".

I did mention "SHOW ME" so ... since you mention "easy and already available" for the differential I mention "SHOW US" with mounting options and ratio availability!!

Keep in mind you mentioned "Truly Bolt-In & Bulletproof"!!

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Old 01-14-2018, 11:47 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WVZR-1 View Post
If that comment was directed to me - I never mentioned "knowing everything".

I did mention "SHOW ME" so ... since you mention "easy and already available" for the differential I mention "SHOW US" with mounting options and ratio availability!!

Keep in mind you mentioned "Truly Bolt-In & Bulletproof"!!
Ask and he shall receive. Hammerhead IRS. Bolts to D44 cover, has 12 bolt guts up to 35 spline. Workin gonnthe outer stuff now. My plan is to package it all including halfshafts. Thatís not my car in the pics btw.
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Old 01-14-2018, 12:36 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by vetteman9368 View Post
[left]Ask and he shall receive. Hammerhead IRS. Bolts to D44 cover, has 12 bolt guts up to 35 spline. Workin gonnthe outer stuff now. My plan is to package it all including halfshafts.
I don't do 'FaceBook' so I didn't do any snapshots.


The 'Hammerhead' ain't new, I don't know that I've seen a very effective way to adapt it to the C4 C-beam. User yedister a couple years ago did a 'Hammerhead' and looking at his adaption to the C-beam it looked somewhat questionable. I don't recall him posting back regarding the long term viability of his build. His comments regarding his could be quite valuable. I don't recall seeing him around regularly.

The 'Hammerhead' seems to also be somewhat limited regarding ratios.

jburnet many years ago was doing some 'cryo' and I'm quite sure many were happy with the D44 and the 'cryo'. The only D44 with a broken housing @ the pinion that I've seen was certainly a failure that a 'curb hit' aided when it broke out the web. The fracture certainly showed previous stress that couldn't be directly related to the pinion climbing.

The D44 and Summer Bros I thought had become quite reliable. The Summer Bros I thought led a person to the 'next weakest link' which was half-shafts.

Last edited by WVZR-1; 01-14-2018 at 12:37 PM.
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Old 01-14-2018, 12:49 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WVZR-1 View Post
I don't do 'FaceBook' so I didn't do any snapshots.


The 'Hammerhead' ain't new, I don't know that I've seen a very effective way to adapt it to the C4 C-beam. User yedister a couple years ago did a 'Hammerhead' and looking at his adaption to the C-beam it looked somewhat questionable. I don't recall him posting back regarding the long term viability of his build. His comments regarding his could be quite valuable. I don't recall seeing him around regularly.

The 'Hammerhead' seems to also be somewhat limited regarding ratios.

jburnet many years ago was doing some 'cryo' and I'm quite sure many were happy with the D44 and the 'cryo'. The only D44 with a broken housing @ the pinion that I've seen was certainly a failure that a 'curb hit' aided when it broke out the web. The fracture certainly showed previous stress that couldn't be directly related to the pinion climbing.

The D44 and Summer Bros I thought had become quite reliable. The Summer Bros I thought led a person to the 'next weakest link' which was half-shafts.
Tomís differential solved the half shaft issue on C3ís decades ago. We run his set-up in our AA/SA 68. The C3 actually applies a worse load than the C4 to the half shaft. It can be fixed. The summers brothers setup is good, but Iím working on what I hope will be a better way. As you see in the pics below the hammerhead bolts directly to the C beam in its current iteration, so thatís not an issue. As for gear ratios, anything you can get for a 12 bolt fits the hammerhead.
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:07 PM   #16
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If a "manufactured" batwing/cover could be produced, or a way to adapt Dana 36 batwings/covers then you really would have a winner !

All the folks that are searching for Dana 44 assemblies would then have a viable alternative.
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:22 PM   #17
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That is definitely becoming a challenge, and something I’ve discussed with a few people. It looks like a fabricated cover/batwing might be the best solution.
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:35 PM   #18
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How expensive exactly is it to have a center section like that cast?
I make 3d printed parts as prototypes and then have a local water jet company cut them out of aluminum for me.
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:39 PM   #19
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You haven't shown me the adaptation to the C4 C-beam. The only install I've seen for the C-4 C-beam required 'splitting' the spacer thickness required and mounting top and bottom to accommodate the drive-shaft positioning. I don't doubt the Hammerhead can be adapted to the C4 but ideally it would require substantially more than what's considered truly bolt-in which is what you mentioned so ...............
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Old 01-14-2018, 01:44 PM   #20
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You haven't shown me the adaptation to the C4 C-beam. The only install I've seen for the C-4 C-beam required 'splitting' the spacer thickness required and mounting top and bottom to accommodate the drive-shaft positioning. I don't doubt the Hammerhead can be adapted to the C4 but ideally it would require substantially more than what's considered truly bolt-in which is what you mentioned so ...............
Thatís not correct. It is bolt in. As for the spacers, Iíd prefer having some adjustment to account for the flex of the factory C beam. But Iím done trying to convince you. Iíll just get it all put together and prove it.
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