Methanol Install questions
11-13-2018, 05:47 PM
#1
Instructor
Thread Starter
Methanol Install questions
Going to run an AEM kit that I have laying around, looking at putting the tank on the back wall low enough to still use the privacy shade but that forces the tank to be pretty low and I cant fit the pump right under it. Anyone running a kit where did you mount your pump? I'm thinking about putting it in the storage compartment but the fluid lines might be a little difficult getting to the motor from in there? So I'm open to other ideas for placement of pump and tank if you got better ideas, as well as feeding my line through the firewall
11-13-2018, 06:52 PM
#2
Melting Slicks
Member Since: Nov 2013
Location: Greater Cincinnati Area.
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Can you put it under the car in the back bumper area or behind the wheel wells?
It'll prime down low like that and you won't have to listen to it. Run the lines right up the frame rail?
It'll prime down low like that and you won't have to listen to it. Run the lines right up the frame rail?
11-13-2018, 08:45 PM
#3
Instructor
Thread Starter
I will have to pull the wheel well down and check the area, from what I've seen the pumps aren't very water proof So I don't really want to put it somewhere it might get wet, the sound wont overly bother me. I also thought maybe under the storage tray, might be a little quieter down there as well
11-13-2018, 09:05 PM
#4
Team Owner
Member Since: Oct 2004
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St. Jude Donor '05
Drivers side under the reservoir tank ('90) ,that was not an AEM brand though.
Youre not running actual methanol inside the car are you? You probably know this but an NA car just uses 50/50 windshield washer fluid and water. Worked great on the Z to keep the pinging away.
Youre not running actual methanol inside the car are you? You probably know this but an NA car just uses 50/50 windshield washer fluid and water. Worked great on the Z to keep the pinging away.
11-13-2018, 09:19 PM
#5
Instructor
Thread Starter
Drivers side under the reservoir tank ('90) ,that was not an AEM brand though.
Youre not running actual methanol inside the car are you? You probably know this but an NA car just uses 50/50 windshield washer fluid and water. Worked great on the Z to keep the pinging away.
Youre not running actual methanol inside the car are you? You probably know this but an NA car just uses 50/50 windshield washer fluid and water. Worked great on the Z to keep the pinging away.
11-14-2018, 08:41 AM
#6
Team Owner
Member Since: Oct 2004
Location: altered state
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St. Jude Donor '05
Yes, believe I used the WW tank for mine, its been awhile.
The rest was wired to the TPS so it came on @ 3/4 throttle
The rest was wired to the TPS so it came on @ 3/4 throttle
Last edited by cv67; 11-14-2018 at 08:41 AM.
11-14-2018, 08:45 AM
#7
Going to run an AEM kit that I have laying around, looking at putting the tank on the back wall low enough to still use the privacy shade but that forces the tank to be pretty low and I cant fit the pump right under it. Anyone running a kit where did you mount your pump? I'm thinking about putting it in the storage compartment but the fluid lines might be a little difficult getting to the motor from in there? So I'm open to other ideas for placement of pump and tank if you got better ideas, as well as feeding my line through the firewall
the reservoir is only about 6" higher than the pump - zero priming issues.
disclosure: passenger seat is removed, but I bet the reservoir would still fit, you would have to get creative with the pump mounting.
11-14-2018, 11:20 AM
#8
Race Director
Going to run an AEM kit that I have laying around, looking at putting the tank on the back wall low enough to still use the privacy shade but that forces the tank to be pretty low and I cant fit the pump right under it. Anyone running a kit where did you mount your pump? I'm thinking about putting it in the storage compartment but the fluid lines might be a little difficult getting to the motor from in there? So I'm open to other ideas for placement of pump and tank if you got better ideas, as well as feeding my line through the firewall
i run a blowerworks methanol injection kit.
do not buy the snow pre-mixed methanol/ water.
its dirty and leaves behind a white residue which will clog your nozzle.
premix your methanol with distilled water to keep injection nozzle clean.
my $.02
11-15-2018, 12:43 PM
#10
Instructor
Thread Starter
my methanol reservoir is mounted to the bulkhead behind the passenger seat with the pump below it mounted to the floor. Different brand, but about the same size reservoir and same pump.
the reservoir is only about 6" higher than the pump - zero priming issues.
disclosure: passenger seat is removed, but I bet the reservoir would still fit, you would have to get creative with the pump mounting.
the reservoir is only about 6" higher than the pump - zero priming issues.
disclosure: passenger seat is removed, but I bet the reservoir would still fit, you would have to get creative with the pump mounting.
I looked at putting my pump on the bulkhead behind the seat but the seat is right up against the bulkhead so not sure i'd be able to make that work really, maybe under the seat.. will have to check the underside of the seat.
11-15-2018, 01:54 PM
#11
Safety Car
I don't know how loud your pump is, it looks like the one I got from Snow Performance. They are fairly noisy and they can't be exposed to the water and stuff under the car. I have a 1988 C4 and the compartment behind the passengers seat is wide open. Pull the plastic tray out and install it below there. On my C4 there is plenty of room for the pump down there. The reservoir looks exactly like the one I have from Snow, your pump is different than mine, my pump is 150 psi not like the newer kits with their 300 psi pumps. When installing your pump be sure you bolt it to something solid but use rubber vibration absorbing material to secure the pump. (I used a set of MSD rubber mounting blocks) On my C3 the compartment in back of the passengers seat is fairly deep which allowed me to hide the tank. On your C4 is the jack stored behind the passengers seat? Pull the plastic tray out and it should be below the tray. This compartment might be big enough to hold the tank and if you insulate the noise making pump you should be set. It is real easy to quiet the system down by putting it in the storage compartment and put noise insulation on top. The control unit for mine is under the passengers side of the dashboard where it has easy access to vacuum from the engine and power.
On my C3 I have the pump in the same behind the seat compartment where my Jack is mounted. Little holes for the fluid lines are easy to make and patch if you have to. I ran my system with the plastic hoses first and now am switching over to -4 AN SS Teflon lined braided lines. I have all of my lines protected inside the car. The line to the engine goes through the firewall on the passenger side and then behind the motor over to the center and feeds two spray jets in a plate under the carburetor. I have tried to keep the Methanol/Water solution cool and away from any heat generating equipment like the exhaust system and catalytic converter. Mine came with a fluid level sensor so I have no need to see the tank and with everything in one place it made running the lines easy, when the little Blue light comes on in my dash I will refill the system.
That is the first time I have ever heard of the white powder from the Snow performance "BOOST JUICE", I have used several gallons of it and never seen any white powder. I would mix my own juice but it is so cheap to buy plain old blue windshield washer fluid at $.99 a gallon and run with that. If you start mixing methanol and water you need to be very careful. If you have too much methanol and you have a fire it will get real ugly really fast. Methanol burns clear so you won't even know you are burning until you feel it. Snow told me that I could bump a little on the methanol but to keep it close to the 50/50 mix they recommend. It works just great at this level so why change it....
The one thing you really should do is put a solenoid right before the fluid goes into the fuel system, this way your fluid can't drain into the engine. The solenoid opens whenever the system is activated and allows the fluid to flow only when you want it to. I tried this Snow system on a 1994 Cadillac STS Seville with the North-Star engine in it. It allowed the car to use regular all the time and used very little boost juice. I like driving Cadillac's (that get 12 mpg) on Regular 87 octane gasoline versus the extra .75 cents per gallon for the premium fuel in Northern Virginia.
What kind of modifications have you done to your engine that requires this Methanol/water injection system?
I use it on a C3 with it's 427 that I built with 12.25-1 compression ratio and it really wants 106 octane. I am using a set of ported cast iron heads (GM) and it very seldom makes any detonation or pinging noises. This system works very well to protect your engine and satisfy it's need for high octane gasoline.
I am really surprised how few people are using this type of injection system, on any car with serious detonation or pinging issues this solution lets you make lots of power. There are a lot of people who could use it on their muscle cars.
Good Luck with your C4 installation, be sure to tell us more when you get it working!
On my C3 I have the pump in the same behind the seat compartment where my Jack is mounted. Little holes for the fluid lines are easy to make and patch if you have to. I ran my system with the plastic hoses first and now am switching over to -4 AN SS Teflon lined braided lines. I have all of my lines protected inside the car. The line to the engine goes through the firewall on the passenger side and then behind the motor over to the center and feeds two spray jets in a plate under the carburetor. I have tried to keep the Methanol/Water solution cool and away from any heat generating equipment like the exhaust system and catalytic converter. Mine came with a fluid level sensor so I have no need to see the tank and with everything in one place it made running the lines easy, when the little Blue light comes on in my dash I will refill the system.
That is the first time I have ever heard of the white powder from the Snow performance "BOOST JUICE", I have used several gallons of it and never seen any white powder. I would mix my own juice but it is so cheap to buy plain old blue windshield washer fluid at $.99 a gallon and run with that. If you start mixing methanol and water you need to be very careful. If you have too much methanol and you have a fire it will get real ugly really fast. Methanol burns clear so you won't even know you are burning until you feel it. Snow told me that I could bump a little on the methanol but to keep it close to the 50/50 mix they recommend. It works just great at this level so why change it....
The one thing you really should do is put a solenoid right before the fluid goes into the fuel system, this way your fluid can't drain into the engine. The solenoid opens whenever the system is activated and allows the fluid to flow only when you want it to. I tried this Snow system on a 1994 Cadillac STS Seville with the North-Star engine in it. It allowed the car to use regular all the time and used very little boost juice. I like driving Cadillac's (that get 12 mpg) on Regular 87 octane gasoline versus the extra .75 cents per gallon for the premium fuel in Northern Virginia.
What kind of modifications have you done to your engine that requires this Methanol/water injection system?
I use it on a C3 with it's 427 that I built with 12.25-1 compression ratio and it really wants 106 octane. I am using a set of ported cast iron heads (GM) and it very seldom makes any detonation or pinging noises. This system works very well to protect your engine and satisfy it's need for high octane gasoline.
I am really surprised how few people are using this type of injection system, on any car with serious detonation or pinging issues this solution lets you make lots of power. There are a lot of people who could use it on their muscle cars.
Good Luck with your C4 installation, be sure to tell us more when you get it working!
The following users liked this post:
Charles.rogers1 (11-15-2018)
11-15-2018, 03:13 PM
#12
Instructor
Thread Starter
I don't know how loud your pump is, it looks like the one I got from Snow Performance. They are fairly noisy and they can't be exposed to the water and stuff under the car. I have a 1988 C4 and the compartment behind the passengers seat is wide open. Pull the plastic tray out and install it below there. On my C4 there is plenty of room for the pump down there. The reservoir looks exactly like the one I have from Snow, your pump is different than mine, my pump is 150 psi not like the newer kits with their 300 psi pumps. When installing your pump be sure you bolt it to something solid but use rubber vibration absorbing material to secure the pump. (I used a set of MSD rubber mounting blocks) On my C3 the compartment in back of the passengers seat is fairly deep which allowed me to hide the tank. On your C4 is the jack stored behind the passengers seat? Pull the plastic tray out and it should be below the tray. This compartment might be big enough to hold the tank and if you insulate the noise making pump you should be set. It is real easy to quiet the system down by putting it in the storage compartment and put noise insulation on top. The control unit for mine is under the passengers side of the dashboard where it has easy access to vacuum from the engine and power.
On my C3 I have the pump in the same behind the seat compartment where my Jack is mounted. Little holes for the fluid lines are easy to make and patch if you have to. I ran my system with the plastic hoses first and now am switching over to -4 AN SS Teflon lined braided lines. I have all of my lines protected inside the car. The line to the engine goes through the firewall on the passenger side and then behind the motor over to the center and feeds two spray jets in a plate under the carburetor. I have tried to keep the Methanol/Water solution cool and away from any heat generating equipment like the exhaust system and catalytic converter. Mine came with a fluid level sensor so I have no need to see the tank and with everything in one place it made running the lines easy, when the little Blue light comes on in my dash I will refill the system.
That is the first time I have ever heard of the white powder from the Snow performance "BOOST JUICE", I have used several gallons of it and never seen any white powder. I would mix my own juice but it is so cheap to buy plain old blue windshield washer fluid at $.99 a gallon and run with that. If you start mixing methanol and water you need to be very careful. If you have too much methanol and you have a fire it will get real ugly really fast. Methanol burns clear so you won't even know you are burning until you feel it. Snow told me that I could bump a little on the methanol but to keep it close to the 50/50 mix they recommend. It works just great at this level so why change it....
The one thing you really should do is put a solenoid right before the fluid goes into the fuel system, this way your fluid can't drain into the engine. The solenoid opens whenever the system is activated and allows the fluid to flow only when you want it to. I tried this Snow system on a 1994 Cadillac STS Seville with the North-Star engine in it. It allowed the car to use regular all the time and used very little boost juice. I like driving Cadillac's (that get 12 mpg) on Regular 87 octane gasoline versus the extra .75 cents per gallon for the premium fuel in Northern Virginia.
What kind of modifications have you done to your engine that requires this Methanol/water injection system?
I use it on a C3 with it's 427 that I built with 12.25-1 compression ratio and it really wants 106 octane. I am using a set of ported cast iron heads (GM) and it very seldom makes any detonation or pinging noises. This system works very well to protect your engine and satisfy it's need for high octane gasoline.
I am really surprised how few people are using this type of injection system, on any car with serious detonation or pinging issues this solution lets you make lots of power. There are a lot of people who could use it on their muscle cars.
Good Luck with your C4 installation, be sure to tell us more when you get it working!
On my C3 I have the pump in the same behind the seat compartment where my Jack is mounted. Little holes for the fluid lines are easy to make and patch if you have to. I ran my system with the plastic hoses first and now am switching over to -4 AN SS Teflon lined braided lines. I have all of my lines protected inside the car. The line to the engine goes through the firewall on the passenger side and then behind the motor over to the center and feeds two spray jets in a plate under the carburetor. I have tried to keep the Methanol/Water solution cool and away from any heat generating equipment like the exhaust system and catalytic converter. Mine came with a fluid level sensor so I have no need to see the tank and with everything in one place it made running the lines easy, when the little Blue light comes on in my dash I will refill the system.
That is the first time I have ever heard of the white powder from the Snow performance "BOOST JUICE", I have used several gallons of it and never seen any white powder. I would mix my own juice but it is so cheap to buy plain old blue windshield washer fluid at $.99 a gallon and run with that. If you start mixing methanol and water you need to be very careful. If you have too much methanol and you have a fire it will get real ugly really fast. Methanol burns clear so you won't even know you are burning until you feel it. Snow told me that I could bump a little on the methanol but to keep it close to the 50/50 mix they recommend. It works just great at this level so why change it....
The one thing you really should do is put a solenoid right before the fluid goes into the fuel system, this way your fluid can't drain into the engine. The solenoid opens whenever the system is activated and allows the fluid to flow only when you want it to. I tried this Snow system on a 1994 Cadillac STS Seville with the North-Star engine in it. It allowed the car to use regular all the time and used very little boost juice. I like driving Cadillac's (that get 12 mpg) on Regular 87 octane gasoline versus the extra .75 cents per gallon for the premium fuel in Northern Virginia.
What kind of modifications have you done to your engine that requires this Methanol/water injection system?
I use it on a C3 with it's 427 that I built with 12.25-1 compression ratio and it really wants 106 octane. I am using a set of ported cast iron heads (GM) and it very seldom makes any detonation or pinging noises. This system works very well to protect your engine and satisfy it's need for high octane gasoline.
I am really surprised how few people are using this type of injection system, on any car with serious detonation or pinging issues this solution lets you make lots of power. There are a lot of people who could use it on their muscle cars.
Good Luck with your C4 installation, be sure to tell us more when you get it working!
I have also heard that -45 (ish) washer fluid has a good amount of methanol in it, which is something i will probably look into running as I'm in Canada, so -45 stuff isn't very hard to find :P
You had good luck with the snow solenoid? Something i could look into
Car is a procharged car, full exhaust, stock motor at like 11psi
haha
11-17-2018, 08:26 PM
#13
Safety Car
The old standard Blue windshield washer fluid sold here in the United States is supposed to be 50% water 50% Methanol. I find it on sale regularly and have a stash. Is the tubing that you are using look like the same stuff they use for Refrigerator Water lines. Just cut it square and insert it? That was the standard setup that Snow gave me when I bought this gadget long ago. Now they offer a choice of three colors of tubing but they will if you ask them tell you what parts are needed to make the AN Hoses switch over. The switch over to SS braided lines might cost $100-125 to do it yourself. Now I am insulating the liquid lines to avoid heating up the Water/Methanol while they are under the hood.
The Snow controller is designed to have a vacuum Reference so I run a vacuum hose to it from a Full Time vacuum port, Getting it set up is a fine art, I finally bought a AEM Air/Fuel ratio gauge to finish the carburetor adjustments and then I want to set up a EGT measuring system.
My one complaint is that my car does not really make any noise until it gets HOT, Real Hot and even then only if you push it a bit to hard. The Snow Controller should not start the same flow when the engine is cold as it does under a load in Death Valley pulling a trailer.
The next gadget I am planning on buying is a device made called J&S SafeGuard. This little box will listen for knocks or pinging and then automatically retards each cylinder in particular that are knocking. It will continue to pull it back up to 20* degrees if that particular cylinder is knocking. So if Cylinder 5 and 7 are detonating it will only retard #5 and #7, and it continues to try to bring the cylinder to normal timing. This system has been used by BMW DINAN on their cars with turbos and they allow an engine to get as much timing as it can handle without making problems. A Box made by BOSCH did this very same thing on the Corvette Race cars. After breaking rings and pistons they could not finish a race. After the new Bosch Box they started going all the way to the finish.
I am glad to help, where I can. It sounds like you have one fun to drive car there!
The Snow controller is designed to have a vacuum Reference so I run a vacuum hose to it from a Full Time vacuum port, Getting it set up is a fine art, I finally bought a AEM Air/Fuel ratio gauge to finish the carburetor adjustments and then I want to set up a EGT measuring system.
My one complaint is that my car does not really make any noise until it gets HOT, Real Hot and even then only if you push it a bit to hard. The Snow Controller should not start the same flow when the engine is cold as it does under a load in Death Valley pulling a trailer.
The next gadget I am planning on buying is a device made called J&S SafeGuard. This little box will listen for knocks or pinging and then automatically retards each cylinder in particular that are knocking. It will continue to pull it back up to 20* degrees if that particular cylinder is knocking. So if Cylinder 5 and 7 are detonating it will only retard #5 and #7, and it continues to try to bring the cylinder to normal timing. This system has been used by BMW DINAN on their cars with turbos and they allow an engine to get as much timing as it can handle without making problems. A Box made by BOSCH did this very same thing on the Corvette Race cars. After breaking rings and pistons they could not finish a race. After the new Bosch Box they started going all the way to the finish.
I am glad to help, where I can. It sounds like you have one fun to drive car there!
11-18-2018, 05:07 PM
#14
Instructor
Thread Starter
The old standard Blue windshield washer fluid sold here in the United States is supposed to be 50% water 50% Methanol. I find it on sale regularly and have a stash. Is the tubing that you are using look like the same stuff they use for Refrigerator Water lines. Just cut it square and insert it? That was the standard setup that Snow gave me when I bought this gadget long ago. Now they offer a choice of three colors of tubing but they will if you ask them tell you what parts are needed to make the AN Hoses switch over. The switch over to SS braided lines might cost $100-125 to do it yourself. Now I am insulating the liquid lines to avoid heating up the Water/Methanol while they are under the hood.
The Snow controller is designed to have a vacuum Reference so I run a vacuum hose to it from a Full Time vacuum port, Getting it set up is a fine art, I finally bought a AEM Air/Fuel ratio gauge to finish the carburetor adjustments and then I want to set up a EGT measuring system.
My one complaint is that my car does not really make any noise until it gets HOT, Real Hot and even then only if you push it a bit to hard. The Snow Controller should not start the same flow when the engine is cold as it does under a load in Death Valley pulling a trailer.
The next gadget I am planning on buying is a device made called J&S SafeGuard. This little box will listen for knocks or pinging and then automatically retards each cylinder in particular that are knocking. It will continue to pull it back up to 20* degrees if that particular cylinder is knocking. So if Cylinder 5 and 7 are detonating it will only retard #5 and #7, and it continues to try to bring the cylinder to normal timing. This system has been used by BMW DINAN on their cars with turbos and they allow an engine to get as much timing as it can handle without making problems. A Box made by BOSCH did this very same thing on the Corvette Race cars. After breaking rings and pistons they could not finish a race. After the new Bosch Box they started going all the way to the finish.
I am glad to help, where I can. It sounds like you have one fun to drive car there!
The Snow controller is designed to have a vacuum Reference so I run a vacuum hose to it from a Full Time vacuum port, Getting it set up is a fine art, I finally bought a AEM Air/Fuel ratio gauge to finish the carburetor adjustments and then I want to set up a EGT measuring system.
My one complaint is that my car does not really make any noise until it gets HOT, Real Hot and even then only if you push it a bit to hard. The Snow Controller should not start the same flow when the engine is cold as it does under a load in Death Valley pulling a trailer.
The next gadget I am planning on buying is a device made called J&S SafeGuard. This little box will listen for knocks or pinging and then automatically retards each cylinder in particular that are knocking. It will continue to pull it back up to 20* degrees if that particular cylinder is knocking. So if Cylinder 5 and 7 are detonating it will only retard #5 and #7, and it continues to try to bring the cylinder to normal timing. This system has been used by BMW DINAN on their cars with turbos and they allow an engine to get as much timing as it can handle without making problems. A Box made by BOSCH did this very same thing on the Corvette Race cars. After breaking rings and pistons they could not finish a race. After the new Bosch Box they started going all the way to the finish.
I am glad to help, where I can. It sounds like you have one fun to drive car there!
Yea i am going to be using the 1/4 nylon style hard tubing, Running the aem pump, the pump itself wont accept AN fittings, the only type of line you are able to use running their pump in the 1/4 nylon lines, which sucks! I looked at buy a snow pump because of their adaptive-ness to switch to AN fittings but then im looking at like 150$ for the pump plus all the fittings and lines.. I will eventually possible go and do that but for now I will make the nylon line work.
AEM controller also runs off of a vacuum source, going to run an independent line off the manifold as if have a few blocked off ports. just need to locate a good firewall hole to make for a good boost line/ meth line cross over.
Are you still running a stock ECU? does the J&S SafeGuard just piggyback itself on, or do you need to be running aftermarket equipment for it to work?
11-20-2018, 10:03 PM
#15
Melting Slicks
not sure if you're interested, but I believe I have a blower works brand flexible sack/tank that mounts on the dog house. I'll dig around and see if I can get a pic of it.
On my setup, I use the ww tank and have the pump mounted on the dog house.
On my setup, I use the ww tank and have the pump mounted on the dog house.
