JoeNova

It's a 'tube' car if anything. Pipe is never used to do chassis work or build roll cages.
Nearly all of the tubing fits inside of the stock body assuming interior panels are removed. If it had a body on it, it wouldn't be any less of a tube car.
And where do you see tall off road tires on it? I have C6 Z06 wheels/tires, and slicks for track use.
Body and interior don't make the car. I'm sure you would agree that Lamborghini body/interior on a Fiero chassis still makes it a Fiero, not a Lamborghini. Don't be such a hypocrite.


From my point of view, its the best possible way to modify a C4
Toss out the 80s styling, the cheap interior, the underpowered engine, the gimmicky electronics. Keep the parts that work, even though the rear suspension leaves a LOT to be desired.
The chassis itself is a good platform, and now that your average run-down C4 can be had to $1500-2000, they're as affordable as a cheap running and driving Honda Accord.

tpi 421 vette

Hi Joe, I'm using a Deist bellhousing blanket

anesthes

^^^ He's got a point hahaha

I wonder if you could get a cobra-ish body to mount on a C4 chassis.

-- Joe

93 ragtop

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNova

It's a 'tube' car if anything. Pipe is never used to do chassis work or build roll cages.
Nearly all of the tubing fits inside of the stock body assuming interior panels are removed. If it had a body on it, it wouldn't be any less of a tube car.
And where do you see tall off road tires on it? I have C6 Z06 wheels/tires, and slicks for track use.
Body and interior don't make the car. I'm sure you would agree that Lamborghini body/interior on a Fiero chassis still makes it a Fiero, not a Lamborghini. Don't be such a hypocrite.


From my point of view, its the best possible way to modify a C4
Toss out the 80s styling, the cheap interior, the underpowered engine, the gimmicky electronics. Keep the parts that work, even though the rear suspension leaves a LOT to be desired.
The chassis itself is a good platform, and now that your average run-down C4 can be had to $1500-2000, they're as affordable as a cheap running and driving Honda Accord.

Would you mind sharing some of the specs. HP and TQ? Gearing? Have you run on a drag strip? If so, what times?
FWIW, In my home town, there is a VW sandrail? with a license plate. The plate says 2 idiots. I laughed, figured he is in trouble if he wrecks!! But I do think its cool!! Yours is better.

JoeNova

Car made 573/454 to the wheels on 11 PSI. Tried dynoing at 17 PSI, made ~600whp at 5000 RPM (rev limiter is 7200) and the trans took a dump. I've had the engine over 20 PSI a few times.
TH400 with 1 & 2 gear leave brake (buttonless reverse) 3.07 rear gear in a Dana 36. Has held up fine for almost 3 years of street abuse. I'm making an attempt at the 10.97 record for the fastest stock Dana 36 in a couple of weeks.
MS3Pro has more than enough functions to help me keep the rear end alive during launch.

Kevova

Interesting , the best way to modify a C4 is to cut it up and throw almost all of it away. Save the front suspension, everything else is optional. Kit cars are called kit cars. With no body is there some reason only car tires mount on it.

cv67

Pretty much..is it really worth it?
Start with a straight axle car, 4 link, watts, or? C4s arent known for weight transfer, stuff that counts you have to go after it $
Many passes years, trial and error etc. Nobody orders up a motor, gears, slicks and rips off low times just not realistic.

Wheres is the op, was this hit/run troll thing?

JoeNova

Yes, exactly that. Most people buy/own C4s for Nostalgia reasons. Nobody wants to spend as much money as people are asking for good condition C4s without that Nostalgic value to them. They're just not spectacular performers, and even though they have more power, they don't have that muscle car look that a C3 offers. They offer almost nothing to the general public.
Once it is in bad shape, its just not worth restoring to your average car owner.

You can be as sour as and bitter as you want. It doesn't change the fact that I once had a White 80k mile 1989 corvette myself. Once the top began falling apart and it got rained in repeatedly before anyone noticed, it just wasn't worth the effort to restore it. In a single day I removed all of the body panels and interior. I didn't suddenly not have a Corvette anymore. Removing 25% of something doesn't make it 100% less of what it was. Its still a C4 corvette. Its registered and insured as one. Mechanically, that's still what is it. Just because I molded a turd into something else doesn't mean its not still a turd . Its just much faster than your turd.

jayjones

Dang man I really like what you created, but you're on a c4 forum. Why crap all over it just to make whatever point you're going for? I think my black on red '95 is the best looking car in the lot when I drive it to work. I'm not setting any records getting there, but it's a great-looking, well-performing, fun car with IRS, ABS, airbags, T/C, 3-point seatbelt, that can be driven in the rain. For $7k, that's win/win

JoeNova

I didn't start it. Anywhere I take the car, a corvette guy immediately starts in on me. If you can't appreciate it, then I can't return the favor.

93 ragtop

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNova

Car made 573/454 to the wheels on 11 PSI. Tried dynoing at 17 PSI, made ~600whp at 5000 RPM (rev limiter is 7200) and the trans took a dump. I've had the engine over 20 PSI a few times.
TH400 with 1 & 2 gear leave brake (buttonless reverse) 3.07 rear gear in a Dana 36. Has held up fine for almost 3 years of street abuse. I'm making an attempt at the 10.97 record for the fastest stock Dana 36 in a couple of weeks.
MS3Pro has more than enough functions to help me keep the rear end alive during launch.

Have you weighed it? Looks evil!!! What was your mph? I would think it would not take much to put it deep in the 9's or better.
I will admit, it is not what I would build, but I like seeing variety.
I am not a purist, nor am I only a corvette fan. I like all cars......
Now if you want to meet a bunch of purist, go on some of the mopar forums.

JoeNova

I haven't weighed it since a few changes. It was 2100 lbs before cage, wing, C5 brakes, C6 wheels. I'm thinking about ~2450.
It also does an excellent job in the corners. Extremely flat and controlled. Last year the TH400 was paddle shifted and I was setting it up for road racing/AutoX.
I'm not sure if that's going to pan out this year because I still need the oil pan swapped out and the Accusump installed, maybe next.

The Dana 36 won't likely let me go 9s. Mid 10s is all I can hope for unless I just start adding boost after the 330' until I get there.

I've designed a batwing and C-beam bracket to mount an Explorer 8.8 into the back. Explorer 8.8s with a 3.73 Posi are only $100 here.
Machine the inner stubs for a C4 type C-clip retainer. 33 Spline hubs and 4340 outer stub axles are $500 for the set ($150 cheaper for the non-forged stubs), and I'll have 2 3.5" chromoly axle shafts made to replace the aluminum ones, so the 8.8 conversion for 800+ horsepower will be cheaper than swapping in a straight axle and I get to retain the IRS. That will get me deep 9s on the current setup, and still be able to carve through corners with ease.

obijohnkenobe

Come on, dude! Your kart IS cool... but tell me how you will fit that powertrain inside a stock C4 and have it still appear mostly stock. It's not physically possible. Yes, I can believe that 900 HP can be stuffed under the hood of a stock-looking C4, and it can sound like a stock C4... but not for $12K. We're talking a built, blown engine. It will have to be large displacement with a mild cam to sound like a stock C4, say a 500 HP 427 ci SBC or LS-based engine, and have at least 16 lbs of boost either by turbos or a blower. You can do that for under $12K? I'd like to buy that powerplant from you and have it installed for $12K!

JoeNova

I could remove the quad setup, replace it with 2 turbo and mount it under a stock hood. In my entire engine/turbo setup I have $3500. Boosted LS engines are like magic.

obijohnkenobe

I think the difference between my thinking and JoeNova's (and perhaps the OP's also) is that I certainly want a C4 that looks like a C4 instead of something that survived the Apocalypse and is roaming the wastelands with Mad Max driving. Sure, you can stuff anything into anything, but tell me that what you have is less steampunk and more polished engineering. Yes, it works, and if that's what you want then good on ya. It's just not what I want. Something else, and I'm not getting on you... but these cars can be thrashed and trashed, or they can be well-maintained as what they are and were. GM isn't making any more of them, and sometimes a car is more than just the total value of its parts. I understand, not everyone feels this way, but at the way people are parting out perfectly fine C4s there won't be many of them left in a few years, and that's a shame. I've recently found a '90 ZR1 that looks to be in good running condition that is destined to be parted... why? Once you destroy it, it's gone.

Tom400CFI

X2. I took mine to a car show last week. 90% of the people there went GA-GA over the thing. LOVED IT! But I was parked next to a low mile, clean ZR-1 and that guy spent the whole time, making digs, poking fun, disparaging comments....******* lame. I'd guess that he was jealous that my car was getting way more attention than his "quad cam, blah blah blah". What ever his motives....damn I'd like to embarrass him at the track.


Because...many of these cars? They're already destroyed. MY kart project started out as a $2k '89 that had been wrecked. It had a bent frame and every, and I mean EVERY body panel on the car was damaged. Wheels were bent, even the ROOF was broken. On top of that, the interior was trashed. I could have put $15k into it, and had a $6-7k car.





OTOH, it was a "late" car with the later susp, brakes, ZF, D44. So...great platform for performance. It could have been parted...or it could have been turned into something usable and fun. I chose usable and fun. That's WHY.

Capt Mike

JoeNova,

Well, I'll probably get blasted with negative rhetoric, but a very nice creative build. Maybe she's a C4 Cart or ?? I've got no room for Four Turbos, I can just barley squeeze in two Turbos and only because their mirror image. I've got many Q's re your BOV's etc, later on that.. Wicked look you've created !!

Back to 9 second builds and all the pesky little items that seem to POP UP during build...

In your research, whats your recommendation for the "33 Spline hubs and 4340 outer stub axles" ??

This is my main concern in the IRS, or Weak Link, next to u-joints. So I'm highly considering better stub axles, now is the time. I already fabricated all of the control rods. Toe bars, and lower strut bars and completed the preliminary assembly and alignment check including the Camber changes during body roll, all good. The primary reason to Fab all these parts is that the Dutchman's 9 inch IRS housing is over an inch wider at the inner u-joints,, So no other choice. I'm also not a big Fan of Polymer bushings, So I used Spherical lined rods ends.

What's you plans with a 8.8 re control arm, strut rod etc ??

We designed this frame and roll cage to better than NHRA rules. As soon as I have the IRS fully bolted up with the Half Shaft Hoops I'm going to call for a chassis inspection. This will be very interesting. But I'm more concerned about driving on the street roads and getting hit by someone not paying attention !! I see that in your Roll Cage

I'm now reading and re-reading many of the other rules. The SFI engine & trans safety items ,, Man do these items add the $$ up fast.

There seems to be some contradictions regarding several areas and items . Myself, I'm not planing on a specific Class for this car ever., just some Fun Local ET bracket racing and maybe drive once or twice in the Indy track course here in Portland OR.

Anyone had a full Tech Inspection running in ET bracket or Handicap ???

Michael...