captcorvette

Thank you for the information. However the starter will spin and will spin for as long as the key is twisted to the start position. If the battery is disconnected, let stand for over 15 minutes then reconnected and a start attempted the engine will start (bootstrap) but will then immediately shut down. Subsequent starting attempts will only result in the starter turning the engine over. More confusion to my already staurated mind.

captcorvette

Starter works fine now & will spin engine. Security light stays on regardless of which of the 3 keys used. Plugs getting fire. Doesn't appear to be getting fuel which further makes me think total issue is VATS. Scanner only gives code 46. However in the complete manual I received a couple of weeks back it skips having a code 42. Tried to purchase a VATs bypass from three different places and all said they couldn't help me with a '90 ZR1. Had this issue with a friends '90 coupe and one guy explained it was a difference in the '90 & 91 only in the Hz change so no one offered a replacement. How many gazillion things am I doing wrong?

DDSLT5

Something isn't adding up. If it is a VATS issue then the starter shouldn't turn over. No starter or injector with the VATS light on steady with the ignition on. You have some strange weird wacky stuff going on there.

pantera1683

[QUOTE=1510;1573296379]Your "contractual and legal relationship" is with the company, not the driver. However they employ or contract the driver is their issue.

Seriously though. I am not a lawyer.

QUOTE]

I am a lawyer and even though I am not giving him legal advice here, you are right his legal relationship is with the company. I am sure no one told you that the driver was an independent contractor and even if they did check with a lawyer in your area because I am pretty sure the wrecking company can't deny liability based on that.

Good luck to you.

ShawnZR-1

If you have a fuel pressure gauge, put it on the schrader valve and see if the fuel pumps are working. If you have pressure at the rail (40+ PSI), the next thing to check is the injectors.

captcorvette

No power going to fuel pumps even during starter operation. Security light says on steady druing cranking.

DDSLT5

I have no idea how you're bypassing the VATS with power to the starter - you should get no power to the starter OR fuel pumps, AND no pulsing of the injectors either.

Simple: FIX the vats problem and the car will run just fine.

captcorvette

That is what has me confused also as I did nothing to go around the starter. The starter shorted due to someone washing the engine thinking they were getting in good favor with "The Boss". Simple short in starter which I repaired. Starter began working again but security light stays on now.

DDSLT5

I believe you - but you're getting distracted. Buy a service manual and go to the VATS section. Troubleshoot.

DDSLT5

Okay - I got a PM from the OP. I decided to read the manual a bit. Section 6E3-A-68 discusses a code 46:

The Central Control Module (CCM) sends a signal to the ECM if the correct key is being used. If the proper signal does not reach the ECM on CKT 229, the ECM will not pulse the injectors "ON" and thus not allow the vehicle to be started.

Code 46 will set if the proper signal is not being received, on CKT 229, by the ECM when the ignition is turned "ON". Code 46 does not store in the ECM memory but is only present when the conditions stated above are met. Code 54 in the CCM will set if the CCM sends the proper signal out to the ECM, but does not see the VATS signal bit on the ECM serial data line change status from "Not OK" to "OK".

If the engine cranks but doesn't start, it indicates that the portion of the CCM which generates the signal to the ECM is not operating or the 229 CKT is open or shorted to ground. If the CCM is found to be OK, as determined from the CENTRAL CONTROL MODULE (SECTION 8D), the ECM may be at fault, but this is not a likely condition.

If the engine will not crank, it indicates that there is a VATS problem r an incorrect key or starting procedure is being used.

With the ignition "ON", the security light should be "ON" for 2 seconds then turn "OFF". If the security light stays "ON" greater than 2 seconds with the ignition "ON", there is a VATS problem.

If CKT 229 is open or shorted to ground, the ECM will set Code 46 and the CCM will set Code 54.


According to the Code 46 flowchart: Ignition "ON" - code 46 displayed: YES. Does engine crank? YES. Check for open or short to ground in CKT 229. If ok, it may be faulty CCM - refer to section 8D.



SO - find CKT 229 and see if it is open or shorted to ground. Also, check to see if you have a faulty CCM (section 8D). If yes, replace it. If no, may be faulty ECM (has happened before). If faulty ECM, send it off to get rebuilt.

Good luck.

captcorvette

Thank you. Your explanation makes more sense than when I was reading my manual. Will try tracking this down again and post results. Thanks again

captcorvette

The joys of buying a used car. Don't get me wrong I love this car. Found where someone had "hot wired" the starter sometime in the past. Found two wires had been shunted near the steering column. Seperated those and had an "ah ha" moment. The before working starter now will not spin at all. Disconnected the battery for 24 hours. Then reconnected and used my scanner to get codes. VATs showed up same as before. Sent the cancel codes signal but VATs code will not cancel. Tried several times to cancel the code but with no success. This is the only code that appears. Cannot find any shorts on 229 or the other suggested areas.

Plugs getting fire when the starter was working when it was hotwired.

Have tried finding the car histroy but no luck so far. Only found out that it has two alert items from GM and that was for the seat belts. Perhaps that is why the seat belt light would never go out when the car was working for the few months I could drive it.

Have a Baker Electornix DFVATS bypass module that I will try unless anyone knows a reason I shouldn't? Would like to shoot the person who put VATs in production. Yeah even the ones on Dodge and BMW as have had those fail also.

captcorvette

Took a break to make sure the old noodle was clear. Started from zero. Checked every item that has been suggested. Then installed the Baker electronics bypass unit. Was giving me the red light as it stated it would if installed correctly. Car indications was still the same. No start engagement. Security light on as soon as key (all three tried, 1 original, two new correct oms value replacements) inserted into ignition. No starter engagement and when I put the scanner on it immediately comes up with the VATs code. Send the "clear codes" signal. Wait the required time and repeat the process. Same restults.

Disconnect the battery for up to one week and try again. Same results. No short in 229 and continuity confirmed. Checked ohms value of all the keys and confirmed 7490 value plus minus 5 on all keys.

Really stumped on this one. Guess it is time to send ECM off to states for checking and or replacement.

Gear Jammer

Hi
Been following along on this thread. One thing that you might want to verify, are you absolutely positively sure that you're using the correct ohm-value key? You said you have the (supposed) original key, but if the VATS was already bypassed (when the car was running), it wouldnt have mattered what resistance the key had.

On the other hand - you also said that the car wouldnt start with the VATS bypass module installed, so wrong key resistance might not be root cause.

Probably have to have a dealer decode the VIN for you, to determine what resistance the CCM is expecting.

captcorvette

Thanks. Guess I will put it in the post to the states and see what the dealership there says. At this point I am not sure of anything on this car. But I really like it too much to give up on it.

captcorvette

Guess it is time for another update. Time constraints, brain constraints and lack of patience led me to hiring a susposed "expert"---self proclamed. Cost me a small fortune and in the two weeks he worked on the car the completely removed the entire dash until just the two big paperclip looking supports were there. He removed the pleninum for the 4th time. I checked the starter and it would work when power directly applied. After two weeks and no progress I started pushing this self proclaimed genius and he promptly walks out. Haven't seen him since and yes I had paid him for the two weeks he worked? on it. Now I have been trying to put it all back. He even pulled the ecm out and tried to pry the back off the box. What a mess. I now have it almost all back to gether but lots of parts (screws and the like) are missing. The vacuum line from under the MAP? coming out the left rear side? Cannot figure out where it goes. Has the 90 degree bend on the end and is about inches long. Also have one piece from behind the instrument panel that I cannot figure out where it goes and cannot find it in the book. Looks like it is going to be a lot longer before I can get this to make noise and increase hear rate again.

bdw18_123

If you're talking about the MAP sensor mounted directly behind the plenum, there should be a metal nipple coming out of the back of the plenum near the lower part. The other end of the MAP sensor hose goes there. If the hose from this sensor comes off (sort of a common occurance), the car will run like crap. You might want to put a small zip-tie on both rubber ends to keep them from coming off.




Here is another pic showing exactly where the nipple is that the MAP sensor hose plugs into:




Post a picture of the part from behind the instrument panel and one of us should be able to identify it. If you don't know how to post pictures, email me the pic and I'll post it here for you.




.

DRM500RUBYZR-1

For half of the money these multiple so-called mechanics have stolen from this poor fellow, he could have paid someone from the states to fly over and fix it all, ordering parts from here while enjoying the sights over there while waiting for parts.
Did this not begin as another water in the tank episode, or was it just after a very heavy rain that it failed to start.
From the looks of some of the cars that were in the same garage, a good experienced real mechanic could most likely do well handling some of the needs the others must also have.
Best of luck, you will get it all resolved!

Marty
1FUNZR1

FU

What Country is he in ? I know Sam/CH ZR1 is near the Germany/Swiss border and he knows his stuff.

DRM500RUBYZR-1

dubai.

ROADTRIP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!