C1ANDZR1

I have been looking for the last few days at '87 Grand Nationals maybe to pair one with the Z and was surprised that nice ones are selling for a LOT less money than a couple of years ago. I understand that everything has gone south price wise, but it seems that the GN has taken a lot worse hit than the King. Don't get me wrong, I love the GN's (I have owned three over the years), just making an observation. Any thoughts?

zr1fred

I think what you are seeing is the result of....

1. Aging of "the car culture" generation.

2. Availability of faster (and some might say) more relevant cars

3. Shift in values both generally and in the "car culture" generation

4. Results of an economy that is more of an evolution than a recession

History moves in steps or plateaus (ages, eras, generations) rather than as a straight progression that tend to mask evolving changes. JMO

8388

I would compare the ZR-1 with the GNX not the GN.

C1ANDZR1

8388, I agree 100%. I just remember the '87 GN's bringing very strong money 3 years ago, and have seemed to have crashed lately.

Aurora40

Honestly, it might be the car too... Other than some sort of nostalgia thing, they are not good cars. They aren't all that fast by today's standards, though they aren't slow. They have terrible brakes, the digital dash is like digital clock tech, the interior is ok, but not that great.

And it has little things that make it seem just old. Like the vertical windshield, the non-integrated bumpers, etc. While those things might have been somewhat common in the '80s, they make it look dated today.

I can not imagine paying $10-20k for one of them. I think they are neat cars, don't get me wrong. I am glad they were made, and glad they exist. It's cool to see one on the road or at a show. But no way in hell I'd want one for what they cost. There are so many waaayyyy better cars in the same price range.

91vettezr1

8388

The economy is kicking everyones *** here lately.

True that by todays standards a stock GN wouldn't hold a candle, but small mods make big differences on a turbo car, but then again a collector usually looks for one that is untouched. Nagatives are the aerodynamics and handling, looks and style is nothing more than a personal preference, ugly and non performance type cars sell for lots of $$, it all depends on the buyer. I see certain cars attracting certain groups of people, and sometimes the group in question for a particular type of car falls in a category where cash is not always avaliable, as the cars we're talking about are not candidates for bank loans. This is another factor that tends to drive the market up or down depending several variables including a bad economy. Inflation is on the rise, that along with collectability will most definitley have an impact in the coming years, so I see them going up, although probably not at the same rate as cars that attract buyers with lots of cash on hand.

mike100

Hard to say what will be hot 15 years from now, but as it is, there are an awful lot of semi-affordable 400-500 hp cars that are less than 10 years old. The Golden Age of HP is now, it would seem.

I generally benchmark a good used C5 Z06 as a counter point to buying an older car for similar money. Sometimes it is also a good idea to cross shop European muscle too.

ztheusa

The difference is the ZR1 NEVER went up in value, and never will.

The GN took off like a rocket in price and is now stabilizing.

I like my ZR1, but it was a total failure for GM, heavy, bloated, complicated, and mostly forgotten.

8388

Very few collectibles go up in value in less than 25 years. Take a good look at GN values and you'll see that they didn't actually rocket up, the GNX did, but with a production of just 547 it was a natural.

I still don't know of another car that can do 190 plus all day long without having some sort engine issue, and there will probably never be another Dual Cam Multi-Valve Corvette in the future, so it's way too early to call it forgotten.

I can remember when you couldn't give away a midyear vette

ScottC95ZR1

It simply amazes me that someone who owns a ZR-1 could feel that way about the car.

91vettezr1

to say the zr-1 will never go up in value is ridiculous, that statement may be true for that silver z06 you have.

drd21968

i recently traded my grand national,it was a very awesome car and mine was a super nice example.my 87 gn and my 91 zr1 ,both with the same milage are worth, and will sell for nearly the same money.it is honestly a mystery to me,as the zr1 is a way better car in any category.but they are both among my favorite cars.yet i have a typhoon that i like more than the gn

bb62

The ZR-1 is hardly forgotten and the later ZR-1s are already slowly going up in value. For comparison, the 60s big blocks were also heavy and bloated, yet they are the cars that still demand the most from that era. ZR-1s are also not complicated either (any more so than any other C4). Any low level sedan today has more technology than the ZR-1.

If anything, the ZR-1 will be remembered much like the 57 Fuelies in that they were the first significant performers of their generation. The ZR-1 is the first real performance Corvette since the late 60s and will be remembered as such. How one can take such a negative view of the ZR-1 shows a complete lack of understanding in its role in Corvette history.


Don't agree with this statement though. Midyears were already a phenomena by the early mid 70s. By the 1978, many special midyears were already going for more than twice their original price. They did go from being old car to classic very quickly, but never were really cheap.


The C5 Z06s have some significant collector car problems. While a great car themselves, they were not the first post classic high performance Corvette (the C4 ZR-1 was). The C5 Z06 was also only a marginal improvement in performance from the ZR-1. The C6 Z06 was a significant performance enhancement over the C5 Z06 (and C4 ZR-1). The C5 is thus sandwiched between the first and the better generations. The C5 is also far more numerous than the C4 ZR-1. These facts will make the Z06 far less desirable as a collector car.

8388

I was being a bit facetious, but there was a time when they were worth far less than what they sold for new. I know, I bought a few. In 1990 at a local chevy dealer, Frank Chevrolet in Irving to be exact, a 67 vert. 427 4 speed was traded in along with $100k cash money for a 1990 ZR-1. There was a time when you could not buy a brand new ZR-1 for even window. It's hard tp predict dead on what these cars will do, but based on the past, low production, record setter, super high performers in their era cars did very well. I can't see why the ZR-1 would be any different.

bb62

Back in 1990, the lowest price convertible 67 427 (the 390HP version) was probably worth about $35K (so the total deal you witnessed was a little as $135K and possibly much higher). The 435HP 67s were down from their high of about $125K in 1987-1989 to about $60K in 1990-1991. Of course if the car wasn't in great shape it could have been worth less. The 435HP 67 stayed in the $60K range from early 1990 to about 2000 when the price started to creep significantly higher. I am very close to these cars and have been for many many years. Along with my 95 Z, this is my other toy:

Aurora40

I'm always surprised by the people I talk to who know what a ZR-1 is. People that aren't exactly car guys, but they remember it. Maybe not every detail, but probably as many as they know about the new ZR1.

Aurora40

I don't think of the Z06 as a collector car, for one they made tens of thousands. But I do see it as competition for ZR-1 sales for most people. The C5Z has more performance, is newer, and is becoming cheaper and cheaper. It'd be hard to sell a 30k ZR-1 at $20k, when you can buy a 30k Z06 for the same price. C5Z's seem to be getting closer and closer to the teens for reasonable mile cars. Not good news for ZR-1 resale values.

Graybeard ZR1

Fred, that's one of the most perceptive posts I've read on here in quite a while.

8388

Some of you have been members long enough to remember the good ole' days, so when I say that you can run these cars for a prolong duration without issues, you know that I am saying that from first hand experience. Been playing with cars for a very long time, and usually get to find out what the car is capable of right away, as I don't believe in just reading about it. And I have to say that the ZR-1 still holds it's own, even against some of the newer models, and when it comes to top speed, I can only think of just a couple of cars that will pull it, and then not by much. And if it's a top speed duration run, I seriously doubt that there would be many that would make it to the finish line. Mainly because the ZR-1 does it without the aid of a turbo or supercharger, it's all engine, baby

Happy New Years all