What did Mercury Marine learn...
03-21-2011, 02:34 AM
#1
Team Owner
Pro Mechanic
Thread Starter
What did Mercury Marine learn...
...when they participated in the building of the LT5 engine? I've read that GM learned many thing about engines/engine building, from the LT5, and that those lessons have been exploited in the LSx engines and Northstar among others. But what was Mercury Marine's take-away from their roll with the LT5?
How many of you have seen this BAD, ****....
http://marinetechnologyinc.com/2011/...ercury-racing/
That^ is some pretty bland marketing stuff, but here is a vid of two in action in a 31' cat in Havasu. Watch the tach(s), and the Speedo. Unfreakin believable! 7000 RPM from a 9L V8. 170+ mph in a 31' boat. PUMP GAS. Warranty! The thing is FBA.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6C3Xm...layer_embedded
So I began to wonder, what features from the ZR-1, found their way in to the 1350 QC4v? Hard to say b/c info is limited so far, but it looks like the cam drive and cam bearings may be the same idea, looking at the pics and the compactness of the package, adn this picture;
Also, here is some interesting reading where they mention "GM Institute"?
http://www.mercuryracing.com/blog/“y...221;/#more-971
Anywa, I was read about, and lusting over this new engine, and I couldn't help but wonder how Mercury's past experience w/the LT5 helped contribute to this new monster.
How many of you have seen this BAD, ****....
http://marinetechnologyinc.com/2011/...ercury-racing/
That^ is some pretty bland marketing stuff, but here is a vid of two in action in a 31' cat in Havasu. Watch the tach(s), and the Speedo. Unfreakin believable! 7000 RPM from a 9L V8. 170+ mph in a 31' boat. PUMP GAS. Warranty! The thing is FBA.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6C3Xm...layer_embedded
So I began to wonder, what features from the ZR-1, found their way in to the 1350 QC4v? Hard to say b/c info is limited so far, but it looks like the cam drive and cam bearings may be the same idea, looking at the pics and the compactness of the package, adn this picture;
Also, here is some interesting reading where they mention "GM Institute"?
http://www.mercuryracing.com/blog/“y...221;/#more-971
Anywa, I was read about, and lusting over this new engine, and I couldn't help but wonder how Mercury's past experience w/the LT5 helped contribute to this new monster.
Last edited by Tom400CFI; 03-21-2011 at 02:46 AM.
03-21-2011, 10:41 AM
#2
NCM Lifetime # 982
Incredible. M/M sure put together a heck of an engine.
03-21-2011, 04:31 PM
#3
Team Owner
Very cool 
but I didn't see a valet key 
Listening to it in the boat it sounded like an outboard, but the videos from shore definitely sounded all V8 car muscle
but I didn't see a valet key Listening to it in the boat it sounded like an outboard, but the videos from shore definitely sounded all V8 car muscle
03-21-2011, 06:16 PM
#4
Team Owner
Pro Mechanic
Thread Starter
All I could hear in the in-boat vid was the turbo's spooling. When he poured on the throttle after that gentle turn, from :53-1:10....I wondered if the turbos were ever going to stop cranking more boost!
You aren't kidding. That thing is awesome.
You aren't kidding. That thing is awesome.
03-21-2011, 10:06 PM
#6
Drifting
Member Since: Jun 2007
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I second that 'Holy Crap' part! The shots from the shore in the video sounded just awesome!! 
And that boat has TWO of those gigantic engines?? No wonder it can do 170MPH at 6800 RPM on the water! 
I'd love to have a ride on that thing at those speeds, what a rush that would be!
And that boat has TWO of those gigantic engines?? No wonder it can do 170MPH at 6800 RPM on the water! I'd love to have a ride on that thing at those speeds, what a rush that would be!
03-22-2011, 06:51 AM
#9
Le Mans Master
certainly the special tooling and high tolerance manufacturing was not "new" to mercury marine but as the first "boat motor" to go into a car the LT5 built some special comradere and pride that was "different" than working exclusively on boat engines
MM got the contract due to their expertise with close tolerance work and I don't think they "learned" as much as chevy did about the passion of putting together one of the best engines in the world.
the engineering and design work certainly carried over, and chevy learned how to get the good bottom end strength and build the cheap hp they crank out today
but IMHO, ford has "showed them up" with the 5.0 coyote engine
light, cheap, good hp, and best of all a nice DOHC design time will tell how durable it is but the mustang boys are already turboing and dropping TVS blowers on them
sure like to see GM do something like this for the C8 pushrod technology has reached the limit IMHO of refinement and variable cam timing with all 4 cams phasing based on the most efficient setup (or even better still, full variable valve lift) is going to have to happen to get more power and efficiency going forward
I still like the coates rotary valve concept and wish gm would get off the schied and do that. seems like it would flow a ton and rev to the moon, and parts "left out" don't break
MM got the contract due to their expertise with close tolerance work and I don't think they "learned" as much as chevy did about the passion of putting together one of the best engines in the world.
the engineering and design work certainly carried over, and chevy learned how to get the good bottom end strength and build the cheap hp they crank out today
but IMHO, ford has "showed them up" with the 5.0 coyote engine
light, cheap, good hp, and best of all a nice DOHC design time will tell how durable it is but the mustang boys are already turboing and dropping TVS blowers on them
sure like to see GM do something like this for the C8 pushrod technology has reached the limit IMHO of refinement and variable cam timing with all 4 cams phasing based on the most efficient setup (or even better still, full variable valve lift) is going to have to happen to get more power and efficiency going forward
I still like the coates rotary valve concept and wish gm would get off the schied and do that. seems like it would flow a ton and rev to the moon, and parts "left out" don't break
03-22-2011, 07:29 AM
#10
certainly the special tooling and high tolerance manufacturing was not "new" to mercury marine but as the first "boat motor" to go into a car the LT5 built some special comradere and pride that was "different" than working exclusively on boat engines
MM got the contract due to their expertise with close tolerance work and I don't think they "learned" as much as chevy did about the passion of putting together one of the best engines in the world.
the engineering and design work certainly carried over, and chevy learned how to get the good bottom end strength and build the cheap hp they crank out today
but IMHO, ford has "showed them up" with the 5.0 coyote engine
light, cheap, good hp, and best of all a nice DOHC design time will tell how durable it is but the mustang boys are already turboing and dropping TVS blowers on them
sure like to see GM do something like this for the C8 pushrod technology has reached the limit IMHO of refinement and variable cam timing with all 4 cams phasing based on the most efficient setup (or even better still, full variable valve lift) is going to have to happen to get more power and efficiency going forward
I still like the coates rotary valve concept and wish gm would get off the schied and do that. seems like it would flow a ton and rev to the moon, and parts "left out" don't break
MM got the contract due to their expertise with close tolerance work and I don't think they "learned" as much as chevy did about the passion of putting together one of the best engines in the world.
the engineering and design work certainly carried over, and chevy learned how to get the good bottom end strength and build the cheap hp they crank out today
but IMHO, ford has "showed them up" with the 5.0 coyote engine
light, cheap, good hp, and best of all a nice DOHC design time will tell how durable it is but the mustang boys are already turboing and dropping TVS blowers on them
sure like to see GM do something like this for the C8 pushrod technology has reached the limit IMHO of refinement and variable cam timing with all 4 cams phasing based on the most efficient setup (or even better still, full variable valve lift) is going to have to happen to get more power and efficiency going forward
I still like the coates rotary valve concept and wish gm would get off the schied and do that. seems like it would flow a ton and rev to the moon, and parts "left out" don't break
There is an actual working theory behind it that works.
More than just mean airflow.
Ferrari does it one step better I hear.
Use no valvesprings.
Brian
03-22-2011, 11:39 AM
#11
Safety Car
Poppet style engine valves are superior to any other design in 4 cycle V-8 engine. DOHC or pushrod layout.
There is an actual working theory behind it that works.
More than just mean airflow.
Ferrari does it one step better I hear.
Use no valve springs.
Brian
There is an actual working theory behind it that works.
More than just mean airflow.
Ferrari does it one step better I hear.
Use no valve springs.
Brian
Imagine a car where you can completely change the engine dynamics at the push of a button. VVT at its highest form...everything computer controlled.
You want high mileage? The computer gives you lift, overlap and duration for that condition and injects JUST the right amount of fuel to give it a lean-burn condition.
You want a track car? Another push of the button and it becomes a snarling, loping beast. Nothing to change inside the motor...just software changes to make it do what you want.
F1 cars fixed the valve spring problem by using pneumatics or hydraulics.
The only problem with electro-mechanical valves is with ALL the other electronics in the car, this will call for an even larger alternator to keep all the electronics running. Soon they'll need a hydrogen fuel cell just to power the car, and then the motor can drive it
But think of the possibilities
03-22-2011, 03:46 PM
#12
Le Mans Master
Tom,
"Also, here is some interesting reading where they mention "GM Institute"?"
I'm a graduate of GMI. Now called Kettering University. Was a wholly owned subsidiary of GM.
"Also, here is some interesting reading where they mention "GM Institute"?"
I'm a graduate of GMI. Now called Kettering University. Was a wholly owned subsidiary of GM.
03-24-2011, 03:56 PM
#13
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Member Since: Oct 2001
Location: Do or do not there is no try YODA
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That's going to be the next revolution...electro-mechanical valves. It has been in the works for years, and the reliability is what they are working on before releasing to the general public.
Imagine a car where you can completely change the engine dynamics at the push of a button. VVT at its highest form...everything computer controlled.
You want high mileage? The computer gives you lift, overlap and duration for that condition and injects JUST the right amount of fuel to give it a lean-burn condition.
You want a track car? Another push of the button and it becomes a snarling, loping beast. Nothing to change inside the motor...just software changes to make it do what you want.
F1 cars fixed the valve spring problem by using pneumatics or hydraulics.
The only problem with electro-mechanical valves is with ALL the other electronics in the car, this will call for an even larger alternator to keep all the electronics running. Soon they'll need a hydrogen fuel cell just to power the car, and then the motor can drive it
But think of the possibilities
Imagine a car where you can completely change the engine dynamics at the push of a button. VVT at its highest form...everything computer controlled.
You want high mileage? The computer gives you lift, overlap and duration for that condition and injects JUST the right amount of fuel to give it a lean-burn condition.
You want a track car? Another push of the button and it becomes a snarling, loping beast. Nothing to change inside the motor...just software changes to make it do what you want.
F1 cars fixed the valve spring problem by using pneumatics or hydraulics.
The only problem with electro-mechanical valves is with ALL the other electronics in the car, this will call for an even larger alternator to keep all the electronics running. Soon they'll need a hydrogen fuel cell just to power the car, and then the motor can drive it
But think of the possibilities
I posted in O/T....that should get interesting!
Last edited by WydGlydJim; 03-24-2011 at 04:14 PM.
