BlowerWorks

SUPERPUMPER II is an eloquent, albeit expensive, 1 pipe fuel pump(s) solution that can easily support 1000 plus HP using the existing in-tank Delco fuel pump in conjunction with an in-line Bosch external fuel pump. SUPERPUMPER II is a sophisticated 3 input PID controller that utilizes fuel rail pressure, engine RPM, and manifold pressure to regulate fuel rail pressure via Pulse Width Modulated fuel pump(s). SUPERPUMPER II can easily deliver 75 GPH @ 90 PSIG utilizing the existing in-tank Delco pump and a single Bosch external pump. Free sales literature is available by e-mailing me (GREG@BLOWERWORKS.NET) your postal mailing address.

Shinobi'sZ

OK I will be first. Because this really sounds too good to be true. But I and quite a few others are going to be all on this one.

First...welcome to the forum as a Supporting Vendor.

Second...sounds like a superb product. Do you have a single working example of this on a C5 fuel system? If so will please provide some details. Details that I would be interested in would be.

Hp/tq generated
FP @peak tq-max rpm
Injector Size
Other Fuel System mods

Thanks in advance.

BlowerWorks

Hi Shinobi's Z. Thank you for the welcome. I've been selling this system since around 1995. First developed and applied to the Dodge V10. Then applied to C4's as well as many other vehicles. Sometime in 1999 I started using as part of my supercharging system for '99 and newer C5's. Somewhere around 50 of these are out there on C5's and operating flawlessly. Of those 50 most are around 500 HP. Two of them though are around 700 HP. The 700 HP versions include a 20vdc supplemental power supply with 42 lb. injectors running around 80 psig with plenty in reserve. SuperPumper is a closed loop controller and only applies as much power to the pump(s) as is required. Rail fuel pressure setpoint is dictated by a combination of manifold pressure and engine RPM. Somewhat like a graphic equalizer. On the 700 HP vehicles average applied voltage is about 16. I have a very complete fuel pump bench flow set-up capable of testing and flowing many combinations of pumps. Utilizing the C5 tank pump (good for free flow of 80 GPH @ 13.6vdc) and a single external Bosch pump on SuperPumper at an average output of 16vdc I make 79 gph @ 90 psig. The reason I say average voltage is because the power unit is Pulse Width Modulated and using a DVM measures average. Average output up to 20vdc can be supported with subsequently even more flow. My suggestion to any doubting parties is to first review my sales literature. It is very comprehensive and can be had by e-mailing me. My promise to anyone who purchases a system and is not 100% satisfied is a full refund no questions asked. I recognize I am not in the proven horsepower range of many Forum members and that is why I make the above promise to whomever may want to try using a SuperPumper II. Sincerely, Greg Carroll

Hool97

Can you give us what fuel pressures are that are seen on the 700(RWHP) vettes through the rpm range. Any problems with over heating or buring out the intank pump at 20vdc. That would be like three mile island.

Shinobi'sZ

Hey thats a great response. I am just starting to shop around for a Fuel Delivery system to match my new Twin Turbo. We have all been waiting for Racetronix, converting to 97/98, LS2 rails, and LS1 Speeds systems. Most of the aftermarkets require the retrofit labor and can get a little high priced for replacing and adding parts..but that is what we have been left with. I am usually one of the first one's around here to try new stuff...sometimes its good sometimes it has been bad. If you are offerring a 100% guarantee with this forum as your witness, I feel that it is worth giving a shot. I have even used the old Aeromotive 1000 inline pump with a FMU because it worked excellent with the FBodies but only marginal on the C5. I will go to your website and download the literature. I am interested in your system. If it works as you suggest do a GP and I am sure you will get many buyers.

QuickSilver2002

This an interesting approach and I can see how it could work rather well.

It eliminates the need for mechanical regulation at the rail because you are doing it electronically at the rail instead.

This might be a good option for high HP cars (including the 03-04s). Adding the ls2 rails might also help a bit.

The reliability of the inline pump and the electronics would be of some concern, but I guess you could get OEM reliability if enough R&D was done.

One question, is the inline pump placed between the rear mounted mechanical regulator and the rail. In other words, is the inline pump always running and the pressure it creates must be used at the rail (no return)?

MelloYellow

I haven't read up on the system yet, but how does it address the Regulator location as well as the stock fuel line sizing?

Are both replaced with a front mounted regulator and larger fuel lines? Or are you using the stock rear mounted regulator and stock fuel lines?

SR71

......and the most important question is how much does it cost since it is eloquent, albeit expensive?

NICK YOSKIN

hey guys, take a look.


http://www.carrollsupercharging.com/...MPER_II_1.html


isn't this just another version of boost a pump?? sorry not tech like some of you but....

DOUG @ ECS

Hey Greg,
That lookes like the old Paxton, Paxta map controller box,

Just kidding with ya, I know of the history on that deal.

QuickSilver2002

I'm no expert on this system but I think you guys are missing the general idea. A normal fuel system uses a mechanical regulator to regulate fuel pressure at the rail (it is a real long rail in the case of 99 and up ls1s). The pump runs full out all the time and the regulator maintains the desired pressure by allowing the extra fuel to flow back to the tank. Think of it as a simple spring loaded valve where the pressure eventually overtakes the spring and the extra fuel is released back to the tank. These regulators are sometimes boost referenced, which basically means the valve is mechanically assisted with manifold pressure (it opens more with vacuum and less with boost). A BAP is used in these systems to increase the speed of the pump so that it can supply enough fuel to keep the rails filled with the desired pressure when demands are high and the regulator is already shut (not diverting any fuel back to the tank).

I’m speculating here, but I think the idea with this setup is much different. You place an electronic fuel pressure sensor on the rail (the same one as you use with an isolated gauge) and it feeds real time FP information to a controller. The controller then varies the speed of an inline pump to control the fuel pressure on the rail and obtain the desired pressure curve (based on rpm and MAP). So the controller basically slows the pump down when the pressure is above the desired point and speeds it up when it is below. Pulse Width Modulation (which seems to be what this controller uses to drive the pump) allows for very fine grained control of the pump speed/rpm. Again, I’m speculating here, but I think all this would allow for and require the elimination of a return forward of the inline pump. You would have the intank pump feeding a regulated supply to the inline pump, but the inline pump would be totally responsible for actually regulating pressure at the rail. It sounds a little spooky, but I guess it could work.

Size/restriciton can almost always be overcome with pressure, so it seems plausible that these two pumps working together could move enough fuel to overcome any existing restrictions. If the pressure is maintained at the rail, the volume is a given.

Hopefully, BlowerWorks will chime in with more explanation. I’m just guessing at this point.

Shinobi'sZ

I hope so because I am ready to purchase...at least I think I am..I don't know what is considered expensive with regards to this thing.

jbsblownc5

You got some good bites here Greg!!

Reel em in!!!

JB

BLOWNZO6

Nearly $1200 ?

Seriously?

Steve'01

I purchased a Superfueler from Greg for my single turbo LT1 Trans Am several years ago. I can attest that he puts together top-notch products that work as advertised. The Superfueler adds three additional fuel injectors with a trick boost sensitive controller. The superpumper looks interesting.

Greg thanks for the literature on the Alky set up. The Superpumper along with your C5 Alky set up would be a tempting group purchase.

How well will it work with a return style system using an Aeromotive regulator and billet rails? Does the Bosh pump come in the kit?

BlowerWorks

OK guys here I go (notice lack of all caps - LOL). First let me say thank you for all the interest in SuperPumper. It is a unique and exceptional product, albeit expensive which I will address last. Many years of engineering went into it but because of its' price I was never able to sell many outright other than those included in my C5 kit. It is one of the reasons my C5 kit is so damm expensive!

1. I've never made 700 RWHP. Sorry but the most I've made was 600 RWHP and that was 3 years ago. The 700 was derived from the 600 rwhp. I apologize for the confusion. I'm not in the league of the likes of ECS and A&A. My hat is off to those two shops. You've accomplished something I could only wish to. My absence from the Corvette scene for the last two years was due to financial woes; I went broke with non-competitive hardware and too much engineering. Sometimes being first has its' price! Enough of that s..t, let's get to the good stuff.

2. QUICKSILVER is right on the money. SuperPumper is a closed loop controller. The Kenne Bell is an open loop adjustable power supply. SuperPumper in fact because it is a solid state device has an insertion loss of .25vdc using state of the art low loss FET's. By itself SuperPumper cannot increase a pump(s) output. However, in conjunction with the in-line Bosch fuel pump (modulated by SuperPumper) and the stock GM in-tank fuel pump (operating @ battery voltage) SuperPumper can support 600 HP or 50 GPH @ 100 PSIG.

3. I like to always leave the in-tank pump, whether stock or aftermarket, operating @ battery voltage. By doing this you've got ultimate 'get home' reliability. Regardless of what happens to the in-line pump you'll always have the 55-60 psig reguated GM pressure to get home.

4. Adding the optional 30amp @ 20vdc power supply to the above set-up the in-line Bosch pump can easily deliver 80 GPH @ 90 PSIG or enough to support about 900 HP.

5. Changing the in-tank GM pump to something bigger you can easily achieve 1000+ HP. I'm not familiar with the aftermarket in-tank pumps you all are using but I have a very small feroscious Japanese in-tank pump that can flow 102 GPH @ 20 PSIG. In conjunction with the above set up (SP & Bosch & Power Supply) this system can flow 100 GPH @ 100 PSIG.

This set up still leaves the in-tank pump running at battery voltage to maintain longevity and reliability. PWM (pulse width modulation) applies full supply voltage to the pump during each pulse. Higher voltage shortens a pumps' life. Hence I never set the power supply voltage higher than necessary to meet peak demand. This is also why I don't like to 'juice' the in-tank pump.

6. I have a very comprehensive fuel pump(s) flow bench and can flow anybody's pump(s) combination at whatever voltage you want. When I flow pump(s) I always have a DVM wired directly to the pump(s) so I measure pump voltage and not supply voltage.

7. Again QUICKSILVER is right on with fuel line size. It doesn't matter if you have enough 'pump head'. A 3/8"id line vs. a 1/2"id line given the line length in a C5 has a pressure drop of about 2 psi at 100 GPH.

8. For the C5 my system uses a Bosch in-line pump complete with #7 SS lines and quick connect fittings. It mounts up front to the drivers' side door hinge. Unplug the GM lines, click-click and off you go. You don't touch the GM filter/regulator or pump. Even if you change the in-tank pump the filter/regulator remain unchanged.

9. Now the bad news. First I had to pull the on line S/P II pricing. Sorry but it was over 5 years old and did not reflect numerous changes and price increases. Nor did it include any C5 application info. I simply completely forgot about it. What the hell I wasn't selling anything off the Website.

Each SuperPumper system requires over 40 hours to assemble and test if you count PC board assembly, numerous wiring harnesses, potting the output modules, and finally bench testing as complete systems with all the components that ship. My experience with complex electronic systems that are being sold to end users who are not electronic wizards is that each system MUST be bench tested and calibrated to the user's needs. Even though the documentation that goes with each system is very complete (I have been accused of including too much documentation) one wiring error or miscalibrated controller or loose wire will drive the purchaser and subsequently me crazy with the end result being an unhappy customer.

A basic SuperPumper system sells for $1605.00 The in-line Bosch pump with the C5 install kit (pump mounting bracket, quick connect fittings, SS lines, pump banjos', & hydraulically crimped ends) goes for $300 when purchased with SumperPumper. By itself it's $350.00.

The 30amp @ 20vdc (output adjustable to application) power supply complete with installation kit (50amp power relay, #10 wire, etc., etc.) goes for another $300.00.

Anybody got sticker shock yet ? I hope this answers most of your questions. Sincerely, Greg Carroll

PS - I almost forgot to include Dennis & Carmen of "The Vette Doctors" in the group of awesome horsepower shops. I also want to thank them here for letting me come to their shop about a month ago and letting me work on a customer's C5 with my S/C kit. Thanks Carmen & Dennis!

Also I see no reason why the Kenne Bell 'Boost-A-Pump' couldn't substitute for the power supply in a SuperPumper system. If someone buys a SuperPumper and has a Kenne Bell simply send me the unit and I will bench test with the SuperPumper as a complete system.

Shinobi'sZ

So are you saying that this thing will work if we already have an intank pump and Kenne Bell BAP?. And that it will work without a return line system? If so that means we would only have to buy the unit for $1600? Assuming that we have the in tank and Kenne Bell BAP installed already. This combination would support up to 1000hp and you would give a 100% refund if it didn't?
Thanks

BlowerWorks

Yup - Almost. You Still Need The In-line Bosch @ $300 And You've Got To Send Me A Bap And Your (or Equivalent) In-tank To Check For Output Etc. Assuming The Bap Is Ok And The In-tank Is Ok Your Cost Would Be $1905.00.

NICK YOSKIN

received liteture from superpumper ii today. very detailed and proffesional looking, to the point were its over my head

BLOWNZO6

I am still having a hard time understanding why you guys are considering buying this for nearly $2000.. and this is not all a shot at what he is selling, the product looks great, this is also not a shot at what it costs.. people can price anything for whatever they want.

But I am sure you could have a custom fuel system built for much less that that. I would bet for $2000 someone could build you a custom drivers side fuel cell with a sump in it. Still use and feed the passenger one into it like the stock setup is. Use a large Aeromotive external OR dual external Walbro pumps, with new feed and return line and not have that much into it.

Anyone checked into having someone fab them a drivers side tank with a sump in it? Fuel pump is easy.. there are plenty of options around for that.

Just some additional ideas I have ben thinking about.. for me is a non issue.. my car is not going to go much beyond where it is now. I have a car I am going to do some work on soon that may need some serious fueling soon.