"Pull Key-Wait 10 Seconds" every time
12-05-2016, 12:04 PM
#21
Racer
Update #2,
While checking the battery cable system I found it all bad. Looks like original parts and battery acid got on a lot of them. All connections are corroded and high resistance, even the solenoid nut was loose so the solenoid insulator is burned. I have tried to find a solenoid but they only want to sell me a complete starter.
The ground location on the frame under the battery is severely corroded, I will have to wire brush it clean and recoat it with rust resistent paint. I got high resistance ohmmeter readings on positive and negative connections where ever they are. The ground bolt in the frame is seized and it broke off. I'll have to drill and tap for a new bolt. To get the starter off I have to drop the exhaust y pipe for bolt access. The guys who got it running after the battery acid disaster did not clean the acid off of anything, that whole area is a mess.
Battery cables for this car are hard to find at a reasonable price. I got the GM oem part # then went to acdelco to cross the # to delco. The parts I need are at amazon except for the negative cable, its backordered.
While checking the battery cable system I found it all bad. Looks like original parts and battery acid got on a lot of them. All connections are corroded and high resistance, even the solenoid nut was loose so the solenoid insulator is burned. I have tried to find a solenoid but they only want to sell me a complete starter.
The ground location on the frame under the battery is severely corroded, I will have to wire brush it clean and recoat it with rust resistent paint. I got high resistance ohmmeter readings on positive and negative connections where ever they are. The ground bolt in the frame is seized and it broke off. I'll have to drill and tap for a new bolt. To get the starter off I have to drop the exhaust y pipe for bolt access. The guys who got it running after the battery acid disaster did not clean the acid off of anything, that whole area is a mess.
Battery cables for this car are hard to find at a reasonable price. I got the GM oem part # then went to acdelco to cross the # to delco. The parts I need are at amazon except for the negative cable, its backordered.
12-05-2016, 12:08 PM
#22
Racer
Oh yeah, the LMNC5 mod has been done, but they removed the CLB and the relay along with its harness connector. If you believe the wiring diagram, that relay is necessary for the correct feedback to the BCM.
Last edited by sjhanc; 12-23-2016 at 08:48 PM.
12-05-2016, 06:56 PM
#23
Instructor
[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]Not to beat a dead horse - but here I go! Still confused, About the Pull Key, 10 seconds!
Yesterday I was sitting in the car waiting for my wife. To turn the radio on, --------- I attempted to turned the key to acc. I mistakenly thought ACC. position. was the 2nd click on ignition switch. So, I turn the key from OFF. to ON. 3 or 4 times --- then figured out ACC. is the first click of the key. In about 3 or 4 min. I started the C5 and drove about 3 feet and it died .... did this 3 time and then I saw the message "Pull key 10 Seconds". I did so! --- And then, car ran fine.???? Want caused this? Was it due to my fumbling the key on and off so many times, upset the security system? There was no problem with column-lock or shifting trans.
In WHAT situations, is this pull key message suppose to appear? Thanks for any assistants, here. If it were a 55 Chevy, I could fix it in the dark, while wearing a blindfold and full of beer. But ??? ELECTRONICS ??? [/FONT]
Bill
Yesterday I was sitting in the car waiting for my wife. To turn the radio on, --------- I attempted to turned the key to acc. I mistakenly thought ACC. position. was the 2nd click on ignition switch. So, I turn the key from OFF. to ON. 3 or 4 times --- then figured out ACC. is the first click of the key. In about 3 or 4 min. I started the C5 and drove about 3 feet and it died .... did this 3 time and then I saw the message "Pull key 10 Seconds". I did so! --- And then, car ran fine.???? Want caused this? Was it due to my fumbling the key on and off so many times, upset the security system? There was no problem with column-lock or shifting trans.
In WHAT situations, is this pull key message suppose to appear? Thanks for any assistants, here. If it were a 55 Chevy, I could fix it in the dark, while wearing a blindfold and full of beer. But ??? ELECTRONICS ??? [/FONT]
Bill
12-05-2016, 07:00 PM
#24
1/4 mile/AutoX
[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]Not to beat a dead horse - but here I go! Still confused, About the Pull Key, 10 seconds!
Yesterday I was sitting in the car waiting for my wife. To turn the radio on, --------- I attempted to turned the key to acc. I mistakenly thought ACC. position. was the 2nd click on ignition switch. So, I turn the key from OFF. to ON. 3 or 4 times --- then figured out ACC. is the first click of the key. In about 3 or 4 min. I started the C5 and drove about 3 feet and it died .... did this 3 time and then I saw the message "Pull key 10 Seconds". I did so! --- And then, car ran fine.???? Want caused this? Was it due to my fumbling the key on and off so many times, upset the security system? There was no problem with column-lock or shifting trans.
In WHAT situations, is this pull key message suppose to appear? Thanks for any assistants, here. If it were a 55 Chevy, I could fix it in the dark, while wearing a blindfold and full of beer. But ??? ELECTRONICS ??? [/FONT]
Bill
Yesterday I was sitting in the car waiting for my wife. To turn the radio on, --------- I attempted to turned the key to acc. I mistakenly thought ACC. position. was the 2nd click on ignition switch. So, I turn the key from OFF. to ON. 3 or 4 times --- then figured out ACC. is the first click of the key. In about 3 or 4 min. I started the C5 and drove about 3 feet and it died .... did this 3 time and then I saw the message "Pull key 10 Seconds". I did so! --- And then, car ran fine.???? Want caused this? Was it due to my fumbling the key on and off so many times, upset the security system? There was no problem with column-lock or shifting trans.
In WHAT situations, is this pull key message suppose to appear? Thanks for any assistants, here. If it were a 55 Chevy, I could fix it in the dark, while wearing a blindfold and full of beer. But ??? ELECTRONICS ??? [/FONT]
Bill
12-20-2016, 04:39 PM
#25
Racer
When I inspected the pcm/ecm for the acid damage issue the former owner had mentioned, I found the red and blue connectors severely corroded. Acid had eaten through the metal rim that the connector seals seat on and gotten into the pins in the 1-20 section of the red connector.
I checked on line for a salvaged harness and computer. The price was so high I decided to try repairing the connectors myself first, if it didn't work I could always get the harness. I found the red/blue connector parts on ebay, ordered them and started replacing the battery and ground cables and cleaning up the damage to the vehicle's frame under the battery. I found a chemical that would neutralize the acid, applied that, then after the rust was treated I wire brushed the frame down to bare shiny steel and painted it with black rustoleum.
The battery ground cable post on the frame was so corroded that it snapped off when I tried to loosen its nut. I had to treat that area also, then drill and tap the frame for a new bolt to fasten the ground cables to. The frame wall thickness is too thin for a large bolt so I used a 10-24 socket head bolt for the grounds to fasten to. Still only 3-4 threads so heavy torque is out.
The new battery cables arrived so I went about installing them. Found the positive cable nut on the starter solenoid loose and its insulator burned so a new solenoid was installed also. Someone has overtorqued the battery ground bolt on the block above the starter so I had to leave it alone and install the battery ground cable at a nearby hole in the right cyl head. I also ran a separate large gauge ground cable to the frame to maybe help matters.
The red/blue connector parts arrived so I spent 8 hours pulling a pin, cleaning acid damage if necessary, the transferring it to the correct hole in the new connector. One at a time. Tedious, but if I got bored I could always work on cleaning dried luv-bug juice off of the front of the car. I hadn't made up my mind about replacing the pcm so I decided that, since it actually worked I would use it until it failed. I went to harbor freight and bought a small gravity feed sand blaster and some grit, came home and blasted the corrosion off of the pcm case. When I got done it actually looked pretty good so a coat of black paint made it look much better.
Hoping it all had done some good I re-connected the new Optima Red-Top, looked for hot wires or shorts, then turned the key. It started right up and ran normally. The gages were showing 13.6 volts-up from 12.9 so I got my voltmeter out and checked voltage at the battery posts. There I get 14.6 volts, slightly high but OK. Now, somebody explain how the battery voltage is 14.6 at the battery and drops to 13.6 volts at the instruments. I have done countless charging circuit repairs on almost every type of vehicle on the road and also US and Iranian military helicopters. The voltage you read at the instruments is the same as at the battery posts.
What is going on in a Corvette electrical system that loses 1 volt. And don't try to tell me this is normal, I never had this happen on any of the Vettes I owned or worked on in Chevy dealerships. I keep reading that C5 Vettes are sensitive to low voltage. Well, if the system is wasting 1 volt somehow, and this is normal, then the electronic devices need to be set to use lower voltage.
Oh yeah, the LMC5 kit is installed on my bcm and I still get the "Pull Key-Wait 10 Seconds" and the service column lock message frequently. I went into the steering column and found the column lock plate had been removed. I installed a new ignition switch (the old one looks brand new) and there is no lock relay, someone has cut the plug off. And, there is no sign of A/C evaporator leakage onto the bcm.
Since I read that others also get a voltage reading of 13.6 at the instrument panel gage I think this 1 volt discrepancy is related to the problem.
I checked on line for a salvaged harness and computer. The price was so high I decided to try repairing the connectors myself first, if it didn't work I could always get the harness. I found the red/blue connector parts on ebay, ordered them and started replacing the battery and ground cables and cleaning up the damage to the vehicle's frame under the battery. I found a chemical that would neutralize the acid, applied that, then after the rust was treated I wire brushed the frame down to bare shiny steel and painted it with black rustoleum.
The battery ground cable post on the frame was so corroded that it snapped off when I tried to loosen its nut. I had to treat that area also, then drill and tap the frame for a new bolt to fasten the ground cables to. The frame wall thickness is too thin for a large bolt so I used a 10-24 socket head bolt for the grounds to fasten to. Still only 3-4 threads so heavy torque is out.
The new battery cables arrived so I went about installing them. Found the positive cable nut on the starter solenoid loose and its insulator burned so a new solenoid was installed also. Someone has overtorqued the battery ground bolt on the block above the starter so I had to leave it alone and install the battery ground cable at a nearby hole in the right cyl head. I also ran a separate large gauge ground cable to the frame to maybe help matters.
The red/blue connector parts arrived so I spent 8 hours pulling a pin, cleaning acid damage if necessary, the transferring it to the correct hole in the new connector. One at a time. Tedious, but if I got bored I could always work on cleaning dried luv-bug juice off of the front of the car. I hadn't made up my mind about replacing the pcm so I decided that, since it actually worked I would use it until it failed. I went to harbor freight and bought a small gravity feed sand blaster and some grit, came home and blasted the corrosion off of the pcm case. When I got done it actually looked pretty good so a coat of black paint made it look much better.
Hoping it all had done some good I re-connected the new Optima Red-Top, looked for hot wires or shorts, then turned the key. It started right up and ran normally. The gages were showing 13.6 volts-up from 12.9 so I got my voltmeter out and checked voltage at the battery posts. There I get 14.6 volts, slightly high but OK. Now, somebody explain how the battery voltage is 14.6 at the battery and drops to 13.6 volts at the instruments. I have done countless charging circuit repairs on almost every type of vehicle on the road and also US and Iranian military helicopters. The voltage you read at the instruments is the same as at the battery posts.
What is going on in a Corvette electrical system that loses 1 volt. And don't try to tell me this is normal, I never had this happen on any of the Vettes I owned or worked on in Chevy dealerships. I keep reading that C5 Vettes are sensitive to low voltage. Well, if the system is wasting 1 volt somehow, and this is normal, then the electronic devices need to be set to use lower voltage.
Oh yeah, the LMC5 kit is installed on my bcm and I still get the "Pull Key-Wait 10 Seconds" and the service column lock message frequently. I went into the steering column and found the column lock plate had been removed. I installed a new ignition switch (the old one looks brand new) and there is no lock relay, someone has cut the plug off. And, there is no sign of A/C evaporator leakage onto the bcm.
Since I read that others also get a voltage reading of 13.6 at the instrument panel gage I think this 1 volt discrepancy is related to the problem.
Last edited by sjhanc; 12-20-2016 at 04:43 PM.
12-22-2016, 11:35 AM
#28
you need this !!http://www.complianceparts.com/lmc5whoneeds1.html
Last edited by grampi50; 12-22-2016 at 11:37 AM.
The following 2 users liked this post by grampi50:
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12-22-2016, 01:19 PM
#29
Racer
I have already removed the bcm and pulled the connectors looking for corrosion, there is none. And why are there bare wires just hanging above the bcm? GM doesn't leave cut off wires without some form of insulation to prevent shorts.
I cleaned the connectors to the ignition switch when I replaced it and have disconnected every plug I can find to check for corrosion or other damage. I also removed all of the fuses and relays in both fuse blocks to check for corrosion and have taken voltage readings across each fuse. there is not much else to do except look for the reason the full battery voltage is not getting to the instrument panel. The voltage readings at the ignition switch is measured 1 volt lower than at the battery posts. I plan to run a temporary parallel ignition feed from the battery to the ignition switch rather than go into the wiring harness looking for a bad wire or connection. If this works I will do a permanent installation. I need to see the wiring diagrams for the charging system and main power feeds to the body and instrument panel. I have already located the body grounds, cleaned them down to bare metal, and have installed large gauge ground cables between the engine block and frame and both battery cables.
I didn't like the new oem small gauge battery cables, I had used much heavier cables on my 66-67 big block Vettes along with 1000 cca amp truck batteries and a mix of Pontiac 421 starter armature and field case bolted to a Chevy nose case to get faster cranking speed with modified high compression 402, 427, and 454 Chevy big port engines. These engines would not even turn over with the tiny starters the current Vettes use.
And the wonderful LCM5 is supposed to work even with low voltage, why is it not doing its job here?
The only part of the dash I have not been into is removal of the upper dash pad to replace the r/h blend door actuator, which I have on hand. I also will remove the driver's SIR to repair the shorted horn membrane switch. I am familiar with airbag safety, I replaced many airbags when I worked for Chevrolet. The body shop sent all of their airbag jobs to me and even some of the interior disassembly and drivetrain removal work to check for hidden structural damage to vehicles with impact damage.
I am checking into the possibility of replacing the bcm with a later version from a Vette that did not have the column lock. I used to do some work for a Vette builder-restorer who would take 2 Vettes wrecked at opposite ends, cut them in half and weld the good ends together to make an undamaged car. He frequently got into wiring mis-matches when he used cars from different years, I got to straighten out the electrical and mechanical problems from his mistakes.
Thanks for all of the input, I appreciate everyone responding with advice. This car was built on Sep. 4th, 1997, It is 19 years old, why is this problem not solved already? It has the Chevy service bulletins applied and aftermarket fixes also done. My suspicion is that the problem lies with the bcm programming, or circuitry, and a fix would require GM admitting that an expensive part is at fault and replacing it.
I cleaned the connectors to the ignition switch when I replaced it and have disconnected every plug I can find to check for corrosion or other damage. I also removed all of the fuses and relays in both fuse blocks to check for corrosion and have taken voltage readings across each fuse. there is not much else to do except look for the reason the full battery voltage is not getting to the instrument panel. The voltage readings at the ignition switch is measured 1 volt lower than at the battery posts. I plan to run a temporary parallel ignition feed from the battery to the ignition switch rather than go into the wiring harness looking for a bad wire or connection. If this works I will do a permanent installation. I need to see the wiring diagrams for the charging system and main power feeds to the body and instrument panel. I have already located the body grounds, cleaned them down to bare metal, and have installed large gauge ground cables between the engine block and frame and both battery cables.
I didn't like the new oem small gauge battery cables, I had used much heavier cables on my 66-67 big block Vettes along with 1000 cca amp truck batteries and a mix of Pontiac 421 starter armature and field case bolted to a Chevy nose case to get faster cranking speed with modified high compression 402, 427, and 454 Chevy big port engines. These engines would not even turn over with the tiny starters the current Vettes use.
And the wonderful LCM5 is supposed to work even with low voltage, why is it not doing its job here?
The only part of the dash I have not been into is removal of the upper dash pad to replace the r/h blend door actuator, which I have on hand. I also will remove the driver's SIR to repair the shorted horn membrane switch. I am familiar with airbag safety, I replaced many airbags when I worked for Chevrolet. The body shop sent all of their airbag jobs to me and even some of the interior disassembly and drivetrain removal work to check for hidden structural damage to vehicles with impact damage.
I am checking into the possibility of replacing the bcm with a later version from a Vette that did not have the column lock. I used to do some work for a Vette builder-restorer who would take 2 Vettes wrecked at opposite ends, cut them in half and weld the good ends together to make an undamaged car. He frequently got into wiring mis-matches when he used cars from different years, I got to straighten out the electrical and mechanical problems from his mistakes.
Thanks for all of the input, I appreciate everyone responding with advice. This car was built on Sep. 4th, 1997, It is 19 years old, why is this problem not solved already? It has the Chevy service bulletins applied and aftermarket fixes also done. My suspicion is that the problem lies with the bcm programming, or circuitry, and a fix would require GM admitting that an expensive part is at fault and replacing it.
Last edited by sjhanc; 12-23-2016 at 05:10 AM.
12-22-2016, 01:46 PM
#31
Racer
In case anyone thinks I am just down on this car, I have only owned it for 4 months, but I think it is the best Vette ride I have experienced. I like it better every time I drive it. I started out working on Vettes as a hobby but after I began working on them for a living I didn't look at it as a hobby any more. I sold the two I owned and wasn't impressed by the C3-C4 versions that I worked on for customers. Now that I am retired I can look at it as a hobby again, and I don't mind spending hours working on it. I will never race it or even drive it more than 10 mph over speed limits but I know what it is capable of and I respect its ability to get me into serious trouble if I make a stupid mistake driving it.
The former owner told me that he had got it up to 140 mph once, that is enough for me to know. When I was 19 years old I owned a 57 Pontiac that I hopped up and raced. I would drive the entire length of the Florida keys, never letting the speed get below 100 mph except for the Spanish harbor bridge's south end, where 89 mph worked but 90 would get you off into the swamp. Most of the rest of the trip was at 130-140 or even faster on the 7 mile bridge, and, I did this trip almost every day until I went into the Army. I never crashed, but several of my friends and relatives were buried after they crashed on that road, four in one car, 3 in another, and a relative and his friends in another crash.
The former owner told me that he had got it up to 140 mph once, that is enough for me to know. When I was 19 years old I owned a 57 Pontiac that I hopped up and raced. I would drive the entire length of the Florida keys, never letting the speed get below 100 mph except for the Spanish harbor bridge's south end, where 89 mph worked but 90 would get you off into the swamp. Most of the rest of the trip was at 130-140 or even faster on the 7 mile bridge, and, I did this trip almost every day until I went into the Army. I never crashed, but several of my friends and relatives were buried after they crashed on that road, four in one car, 3 in another, and a relative and his friends in another crash.
Last edited by sjhanc; 12-22-2016 at 01:51 PM.
12-23-2016, 03:08 AM
#32
Melting Slicks
Member Since: Aug 2013
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St. Jude Donor '15-'16-'17-'18-'19-'20-'21-'22
I used to do some work for a Vette builder-restorer who would take 2 Vettes wrecked at opposite ends, cut them in half and weld the good ends together to make an undamaged car. He frequently got into wiring mis-matches when he used cars from different years, I got to straighten out the electrical and mechanical problems from his mistakes.
12-23-2016, 05:02 AM
#33
Racer
He had to get each car registered with a junk title and through the state inspection which included a vin search of each part for possible stolen parts. Every customer new exactly what he was buying and I never got any comebacks on the work I did. This method of salvaging wrecked cars and returning them to the road is done by every body shop on all type of vehicles, I am sure you have seen flat bed trucks loaded with car front and rear ends on their way to a body shop.
What did you think happened to all of the Vettes (or any car) with body damage that was repairable in some way but had been totaled by the greedy insurance company anxious to pay the owner off with a token settlement, then have the car towed to their company salvage yard to be disasssembled and all usable and valuable parts sold to body shops at prices that guarantees big profits? There are probably more Vettes on the road than were ever built by GM since 1953. A car that has been put together in this way is not a problem unless someone tries to sell it as an original or "classic", then it is "buyer beware". There is a reason that the vin number is on every major part of each car, it makes it easy to detect wreck repairs, you just have to look. It is possible, but extremely expensive, to build a "new Vette" from parts obtained from suppliers and have no "wreck parts" in it. All that the states require is that proof of legal parts is provided to get a junk title.
I did once do work for a customer who later tried to trade his Vette in on a new car and the car was impounded for stolen parts. I had to answer questions about the front end suspension repair (ball joints and bushings and rewelding a poorly done frame crack) I did for him (which was all legal) and the car's source was traced back to some mechanics working at a body shop who were running a "chop shop" on the side. They stole enough parts to put together a car using a wrecked car's title that had not been turned in to the state as "wrecked, off the road". They got tripped up by vin numbers on a list of stolen cars that any legitimate dealer can check.
Needless to say, my shop was watched for some time after and the undercover guys even tried to buy my personal car, which I was glad to sell to them but they backed out when I produced the legit title for the car. It was a shame though, they offered me much more than the car was worth. I would have liked to have seen the looks on faces when they told their boss they had used department money to buy a legal car, and had paid way too much for it. Do you think they would have put blue lights and a radio in it and chased speeders? I checked with a lawyer about the deal and was advised that if they had given me the money and accepted the title they were in a binding sale and me giving the money back was not required.
The Fla Hwy patrol used a Vette they took from a drug dealer like this for several years.
What did you think happened to all of the Vettes (or any car) with body damage that was repairable in some way but had been totaled by the greedy insurance company anxious to pay the owner off with a token settlement, then have the car towed to their company salvage yard to be disasssembled and all usable and valuable parts sold to body shops at prices that guarantees big profits? There are probably more Vettes on the road than were ever built by GM since 1953. A car that has been put together in this way is not a problem unless someone tries to sell it as an original or "classic", then it is "buyer beware". There is a reason that the vin number is on every major part of each car, it makes it easy to detect wreck repairs, you just have to look. It is possible, but extremely expensive, to build a "new Vette" from parts obtained from suppliers and have no "wreck parts" in it. All that the states require is that proof of legal parts is provided to get a junk title.
I did once do work for a customer who later tried to trade his Vette in on a new car and the car was impounded for stolen parts. I had to answer questions about the front end suspension repair (ball joints and bushings and rewelding a poorly done frame crack) I did for him (which was all legal) and the car's source was traced back to some mechanics working at a body shop who were running a "chop shop" on the side. They stole enough parts to put together a car using a wrecked car's title that had not been turned in to the state as "wrecked, off the road". They got tripped up by vin numbers on a list of stolen cars that any legitimate dealer can check.
Needless to say, my shop was watched for some time after and the undercover guys even tried to buy my personal car, which I was glad to sell to them but they backed out when I produced the legit title for the car. It was a shame though, they offered me much more than the car was worth. I would have liked to have seen the looks on faces when they told their boss they had used department money to buy a legal car, and had paid way too much for it. Do you think they would have put blue lights and a radio in it and chased speeders? I checked with a lawyer about the deal and was advised that if they had given me the money and accepted the title they were in a binding sale and me giving the money back was not required.
The Fla Hwy patrol used a Vette they took from a drug dealer like this for several years.
12-23-2016, 08:44 PM
#35
Racer
I spent all day with an ohmeter looking for a circuit with high resistance that could cause a voltage loss. I finally decided to go back over work already done and right away found a 7 ohm resistance across the brand new ground cable from the battery terminal to ground at the frame and block. After trying unsuccessfully to get a fix by cleaning and tightening the bolt threads and battery and cable end surfaces I removed the bolt from the cable end and noticed that it had been plated with a coarse metal that is probably cadmium or zinc. I took my Dremel with a grinding wheel and removed the plating from the bolt and the cable end, then cleaned it and reassembled it for another ohms check. The resistance had dropped to .01 which is as low as the meter can read, Another voltage check with the engine running gave me a 14.76 volt reading across the battery posts. It had never been that high before.
I moved the meter inside and got close to the same voltage across the fuses. This is some progress but the instrument panel voltmeter is still reading 13.1 to 13.5, the same as before. I would think that a higher voltage at the battery would also give a higher voltage at the ins. panel. This is looking like there is some component that is independently regulating voltage to the electronics. The security system is looking for battery voltage but is only getting a lower voltage that is close to the cutoff level that causes the "pull key" msg.
Anybody got any ideas?
I moved the meter inside and got close to the same voltage across the fuses. This is some progress but the instrument panel voltmeter is still reading 13.1 to 13.5, the same as before. I would think that a higher voltage at the battery would also give a higher voltage at the ins. panel. This is looking like there is some component that is independently regulating voltage to the electronics. The security system is looking for battery voltage but is only getting a lower voltage that is close to the cutoff level that causes the "pull key" msg.
Anybody got any ideas?
12-23-2016, 09:08 PM
#37
1/4 mile/AutoX
Rich found out that some of the Vettes still displayed the pull key message so the brown wire was a improvement on the first design !
12-31-2016, 09:21 PM
#40
Racer
After too many attempts to get the various solutions to work on my 98 C5, a conversation with some local guys who are into mud bogging and street racing Camaros against Mustangs at midnight on distant country roads, they gave me their solutions for the vats problem that also plagues some of their older vehicles. One fix involves cutting and splicing a couple of underhood wires but completely disables the anti-theft system. Another, one that allows future return to the vats is as simple as installing a resistor (from Radio Shack) in the vats key switch circuit. I decided to try the second, reversible fix. I measured the resistance of the key switch harness with the key in the ignition at 2.98K ohms. A trip to town to get a resister matching the key pill's ohms reading and I found that the local mechanics had bought out the value I needed.
It seems that only professional car thieves can get a car with a vats problem started and drive it off.
I bought a couple of packs of 3.9K ohms and 4.7K ohms, went back home and ganged 3 of one value and 2 of the other in parallel, then joined the two in series to equal 3.16K ohms. This is slightly higher than the 3.1K ohms values the Vats chart shows for my car. I soldered the resisters up and then soldered them (with proper heat shrink applied) to a hobby connector I have on hand. I wired the proper female hobby connector into the pigtail created when I cut the key switch connector off of the lead going to the ignition lock cylinder.
I chose this connector (DEANS, or "T" connector) because I can get a mount from the local hobby shop that will fit in an accessible but hidden location inside the Vette's center console compartment. Both the connector and the mount are cheap and easy to find and replace if needed ( I have had the mount break in a crash of a model airplane, but the connectors are very durable).
I hauled the new Vats harness out to the car, plugged the original vats connector into the lead going to the car's bcm, plugged in the resistor DEANS to the female DEANS, inserted the ignition key and turned it on, and got the "wait 10 seconds" msg., removed the ign. key, waited 10 seconds then re-inserted the ign. key.
This time, when I turned the ign. on, there was no "wait ten" msg, the gauge reading for battery voltage was in the DIC display. Subsequent tries gave the same result, after removing the key. If the resistor DEANS is left in, there is no "wait ten" msg.
When I park the car in my yard I can leave the resistor DEANS in its plug and remove the key. If I think more security is needed I can lock the console lid, or pull the DEANS plug and clip it on my key fob and take it with me. Even if a car thief breaks in (and defeats the key lock) there is no way to drive it with out a DEANS plug and resistor of the correct value, the car will only run at idle or less than 2 mph.
DEANS connectors are designed to withstand a continuous 75 amps and countless plug removals without wear. I buy them at RC Hobby shops for a few bucks for a male and female pair or on ebay for around $10 for 10 pairs. As soon as the holiday is over I will buy the mount (around $10). The mount can be had with or without the plugs.
It seems that only professional car thieves can get a car with a vats problem started and drive it off.
I bought a couple of packs of 3.9K ohms and 4.7K ohms, went back home and ganged 3 of one value and 2 of the other in parallel, then joined the two in series to equal 3.16K ohms. This is slightly higher than the 3.1K ohms values the Vats chart shows for my car. I soldered the resisters up and then soldered them (with proper heat shrink applied) to a hobby connector I have on hand. I wired the proper female hobby connector into the pigtail created when I cut the key switch connector off of the lead going to the ignition lock cylinder.
I chose this connector (DEANS, or "T" connector) because I can get a mount from the local hobby shop that will fit in an accessible but hidden location inside the Vette's center console compartment. Both the connector and the mount are cheap and easy to find and replace if needed ( I have had the mount break in a crash of a model airplane, but the connectors are very durable).
I hauled the new Vats harness out to the car, plugged the original vats connector into the lead going to the car's bcm, plugged in the resistor DEANS to the female DEANS, inserted the ignition key and turned it on, and got the "wait 10 seconds" msg., removed the ign. key, waited 10 seconds then re-inserted the ign. key.
This time, when I turned the ign. on, there was no "wait ten" msg, the gauge reading for battery voltage was in the DIC display. Subsequent tries gave the same result, after removing the key. If the resistor DEANS is left in, there is no "wait ten" msg.
When I park the car in my yard I can leave the resistor DEANS in its plug and remove the key. If I think more security is needed I can lock the console lid, or pull the DEANS plug and clip it on my key fob and take it with me. Even if a car thief breaks in (and defeats the key lock) there is no way to drive it with out a DEANS plug and resistor of the correct value, the car will only run at idle or less than 2 mph.
DEANS connectors are designed to withstand a continuous 75 amps and countless plug removals without wear. I buy them at RC Hobby shops for a few bucks for a male and female pair or on ebay for around $10 for 10 pairs. As soon as the holiday is over I will buy the mount (around $10). The mount can be had with or without the plugs.