'Hot' vs. cold air intake?
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2003
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Originally Posted by shurite44
I don't consider .24 huge, as a matter of fact I have had that much difference between my first run and last run of the day. I think you know as well as I do it is fun to debate on here but you almost need to try something for yourself before you will absolutely believe in it. I know I used basically three performance mods that if I would have went with things I read on the forum from many people I would have never bought them. That is the vararam, hypertech III, and a magnaflow catback. I dropped about a full second with these mods and all three of them have been heavily flamed on the forum. Now the catback just in general everyone says they add very little, the hypertech many people say do nothing and some say will hurt performance, and you have read what some say about the vararam on this thread. But I am here to tell you I have run a 12.71 with these mods with run flat tires so I know they work, prior to the mods my best was in the 13.7 area. So anyway I think you said you were thinking about trying a vararam out I will be curious to see what your resullts are over the blackwing.
A consistent 0.24 and 2mph is significant. Just ask someone who is trying to break into the 12s or the 11s or the 10s and is stuck at a best of 13.23, 12.23 or 11.23. When I say "best" I am implying that sometimes they run slower. Those people would just about kill for a consistent 0.24. Promise them a consistent quarter second and they'll jump on it faster than you can say "snake oil."
But you do introduce another good point which brings us right back to the beginning. The difference may not be entirely due to the filter.
Why do you suppose there was that difference which you speak of between your first and last run of the day???
I intend to try it. But realistically, if I want a consistent .24 (or better as some have reported in going from the Blackwing to the Vararam), with my setup I am looking at a cam or another stall converter.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; Feb 20, 2005 at 09:58 PM.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Shiloh Ohio
Originally Posted by EB20003
A consistent 0.24 and 2mph is significant. Just ask someone who is trying to break into the 12s or the 11s or the 10s and is stuck at a best of 13.23, 12.23 or 11.23. When I say "best" I am implying that sometimes they run slower. Those people would just about kill for a consistent 0.24. Promise them a consistent quarter second and they'll jump on it faster than you can say "snake oil."
But you do introduce another good point which brings us right back to the beginning. The difference may not be entirely due to the filter.
Why do you suppose there was that difference which you speak of between your first and last run of the day???
But you do introduce another good point which brings us right back to the beginning. The difference may not be entirely due to the filter.
Why do you suppose there was that difference which you speak of between your first and last run of the day???
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Shiloh Ohio
anyway
I think I am getting away from the thread topic. I have almost forgotten what it was. EB20003 you should be able to answer if there is a difference between the blackwing and the vararam after you install and try it. I bet you will see about one tenth and two mph, just a guess but let me know how it goes. By the way how is the stock twelve second thread going have not posted to that in a while?
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2003
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Originally Posted by shurite44
Well I know why there was a difference between the first and last run of the day. Better air. I agree .25 is significant. But you can pick that up with a CAI or headers and maybe just a dyno tune. Especially if you are stock.
Well Shurite 44, like I say I would like to try it, and I intend to. I would love to get into the 12.2Xs without going into my engine for a cam install or tearing down my driveline to change torque converters. Thats why I am leaning towards trying it.
A tenth??? It would be sort of hard to justify the expense and the skinned knuckles, but I would certainly take it and would be happy with it and would sell my Blackwing to recoup some of the cost.
Of course some will say that I should put the Vararam money towards a good cam.
The BONE STOCK 12 second thread does not have many takers. One guy ran a 12.X in a lowered car which was pretty impressive.
Last edited by '06 Quicksilver Z06; Feb 20, 2005 at 10:12 PM.
Le Mans Master
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From: Shiloh Ohio
Originally Posted by EB20003
Well Shurite 44, like I say I would like to try it, and I intend to. I would love to get into the 12.2Xs without going into my engine for a cam install or tearing down my driveline to change torque converters. Thats why I am leaning towards trying it.
Of course some will say that I should put the Vararam money towards a good cam.
Of course some will say that I should put the Vararam money towards a good cam.
Team Owner
Joined: Aug 2003
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Originally Posted by shurite44
I looked at your mods and best times, I do not think a vararam will put you in the 12.2s.
Le Mans Master
Joined: Sep 2004
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From: Shiloh Ohio
maybe
Originally Posted by EB20003
I'm still going to try it though. The idea of 12.29 and 111.9 mph for $325.00 is tempting.
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Burning Brakes
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 966
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From: Lansing MI
I thought I'd chime in as well, car went from 13.61 at 102 to 13.15 at 105 with addition of a VaraRam, Predator and 160 T-stat. So I pulled the programming and made passes and the car went 13.25 at 105, so the VaraRam was worth at least 3 tenths and 3 mph. Your mileage may vary but I'm convinced and with practice and cooler weather it went 12.992 at 106.73. Jeff
Le Mans Master
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From: Shiloh Ohio
yep
Originally Posted by G-lock
I thought I'd chime in as well, car went from 13.61 at 102 to 13.15 at 105 with addition of a VaraRam, Predator and 160 T-stat. So I pulled the programming and made passes and the car went 13.25 at 105, so the VaraRam was worth at least 3 tenths and 3 mph. Your mileage may vary but I'm convinced and with practice and cooler weather it went 12.992 at 106.73. Jeff
Team Owner
Joined: May 2004
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From: SoCal
Originally Posted by EB20003
0.3 improvement would equate to a lot of additional horsepower. Thats why it is hard to believe that the improvement came from just the Vararam.
The other thing is the claims made on their site, not only about the Vararam, but about the Velocity Stack as well. I have a hard time trusting anything that they say.
Having said all this, I am thinking of purchasing one and doing my own test of it vs the Blackwing. My best so far is 12.5x in the quarter.
Now to let the Vararam guys tell it, I should expect to see a drop in my ETs down to about 12.2-12.3 with no other change except the Vararam.
How many of you guys here actually believe that??????
How many of you guys would believe that it was solely due to the Vararam if I posted a 12.2 -12.3 slip?
I will admit to this. If I were to collect a 12.2 slip after the Vararam install, I would be VERY inclined to attribute the improvement solely to the Vararam and would ignore virtually any other explanation. Especially after the cost and the headache of the install.
I am very skeptical, but I feel that if I do, I won't lose much in the way of money as I could keep one and sell the other. But I will, from the looks of the install, lose a bit of skin from my knuckles.
My mods are listed below
Race Director
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 19,304
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From: San Diego CA
Originally Posted by Chrispy
2) This air will be cooler than air sucked up by the rad shroud on other systems due to radiant heat from the rad and fans.
5) A Halltech or Blackwing with the foglight mod will get nearly the same amount of cool air WITHOUT the risk of hydrolocking the motor.
And for those of you who claim that there is insufficient proof as to whether the engine bay temps get significantly warmer, even at moderate (40-60 MPH) speeds need to look at my post that states that I have the printed copies of vehicle speeds, duration, and intake air temps. The Blackwing with no CAI mod DOES suck in hot air that can reach 145 degrees, compared to ambient air of 80 degrees. The bottom line is that directing cold air to your engine's air filter will prevent losing 10+ HP.
Last edited by Dave68; Feb 21, 2005 at 12:53 AM.
Team Owner
Joined: May 2004
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From: SoCal
Originally Posted by EB20003
I think you may have overlooked this part of their information
http://vararam.com/vr1b_comparo01.html
How about if an 18 wheeler were in the processs of passing you on the driver side and doused the nose of your car with a 5 -10 second blast of standing road water during a heavy rain?
http://vararam.com/vr1b_comparo01.html
How about if an 18 wheeler were in the processs of passing you on the driver side and doused the nose of your car with a 5 -10 second blast of standing road water during a heavy rain?
Safety Car
Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Monticello MN
Just a question: I have read that picking up a tenth in the 60' time equates to 2/10's in the quarter. If that is true, and it's also agreed that a CAI holds an advantage from a standing start, due to drawing in relatively cool air (compared to underhood air at a standstill), it seems logical, to me anyway, that the Vararam claims of 3/10's in the quarter are very believable.
Ed
Ed
Team Owner
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Originally Posted by C5XTASY
Just a question: I have read that picking up a tenth in the 60' time equates to 2/10's in the quarter. If that is true, and it's also agreed that a CAI holds an advantage from a standing start, due to drawing in relatively cool air (compared to underhood air at a standstill), it seems logical, to me anyway, that the Vararam claims of 3/10's in the quarter are very believable.
Ed
Ed
0.2sec improvement sounds like quite a stretch.
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,367
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Originally Posted by EB20003
I always heard that 0.1 sec improvement in 60ft time equated to 0.1- 0.15 sec improvement in ET.
0.2sec improvement sounds like quite a stretch.
0.2sec improvement sounds like quite a stretch.
It's not a stretch at all, 0.1 in your 60ft. should carry to 0.2 at the end of the 1/4 mile.
Drifting
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,419
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From: Oceanside, CA
Originally Posted by 90 droptop
It's not a stretch at all, 0.1 in your 60ft. should carry to 0.2 at the end of the 1/4 mile.
Heres an example:Last time I had an Automatic it was an LTI. On the stock converter I was pulling high 12.9's on 1.9 60ft's. Changed to a Vig 2800 converter and 60 ft's went to 1.6 and E/T went to low 12.40's with no other changes to the car............
Thread Starter
Le Mans Master
Joined: May 2002
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From: Still cruising the BVI in my head.
St. Jude Donor '08
Originally Posted by 90 droptop
Easy killer.
So does that mean you can make a decision and this thread can die?
So does that mean you can make a decision and this thread can die?
Haha! Wow, one glass of wine and i'm ready to jump into the fight...
There was someone earlier who said he'd be willin got try a vram against his 12.5 best 1/4 time (i think that was the time) and see how it does. That's a great idea! If it actually works, like yours has, I bet they'd sell a hundred more of the things. I know Id buy one for .3 sec on the track...
Melting Slicks
Joined: Aug 2000
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Originally Posted by RacrX
Haha! Wow, one glass of wine and i'm ready to jump into the fight...
There was someone earlier who said he'd be willin got try a vram against his 12.5 best 1/4 time (i think that was the time) and see how it does. That's a great idea! If it actually works, like yours has, I bet they'd sell a hundred more of the things. I know Id buy one for .3 sec on the track...
There was someone earlier who said he'd be willin got try a vram against his 12.5 best 1/4 time (i think that was the time) and see how it does. That's a great idea! If it actually works, like yours has, I bet they'd sell a hundred more of the things. I know Id buy one for .3 sec on the track...
They have no problem selling these things, believe me.
Advanced
Joined: Jul 2004
Posts: 58
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From: Moose Jaw Saskatchewan
ram air effect from a pilots view
Every aircraft is equiped with what is called a pitot tube. It is used to determine airspeed by measuring the air pressure inside the tube. It's very simple: the higher pressure - the higher airspeed (actually it is exponential)
I know that air intake design and positioning is very important on jets and turboprops. Especially when approaching supersonic speed the effect is enourmous.
Corvettes, off course, don't go supersonic, but I'm sure ram air still has an effect.
A little experiment on your own body:
Go on the highway and stick your head out of the window and open your mouth. The air will be FORCED into your lungs at high pressure, and it is very hard to exhale. You can even feel the same effect standing outside on stormy days.
I don't have a ram air intake on my Z06, but the physics behind it makes perfect sense to me. Especially the colder air drawn from outside makes a huge difference!
I know that air intake design and positioning is very important on jets and turboprops. Especially when approaching supersonic speed the effect is enourmous.
Corvettes, off course, don't go supersonic, but I'm sure ram air still has an effect.
A little experiment on your own body:
Go on the highway and stick your head out of the window and open your mouth. The air will be FORCED into your lungs at high pressure, and it is very hard to exhale. You can even feel the same effect standing outside on stormy days.
I don't have a ram air intake on my Z06, but the physics behind it makes perfect sense to me. Especially the colder air drawn from outside makes a huge difference!