Poll of Desirability of A4 vs. A6 automatic
07-31-2005, 02:58 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
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Poll of Desirability of A4 vs. A6 automatic
Seeing that many people still prefer the A4 automatic transmission over the projected A6 (maybe in the next week) auto, I propose a poll of our interested members as to what THEY really want 
.
.
07-31-2005, 03:08 PM
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Lemme take a wild guess:
If you own a 2005 A4, the A6 will be an underperforming (despite the math) POS, just waiting to disintegrate.
If you're ordering a 2006 A6, the A4 is a has-been resale value albatross around the necks of the unfortunate owners.
If you own a 2005 A4, the A6 will be an underperforming (despite the math) POS, just waiting to disintegrate.
If you're ordering a 2006 A6, the A4 is a has-been resale value albatross around the necks of the unfortunate owners.
07-31-2005, 03:17 PM
#4
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by ProfMoriarty
If you own a 2005 A4, the A6 will be an underperforming (despite the math) POS, just waiting to disintegrate.
If you're ordering a 2006 A6, the A4 is a has-been resale value albatross around the necks of the unfortunate owners.
If you're ordering a 2006 A6, the A4 is a has-been resale value albatross around the necks of the unfortunate owners.
It's the same my 1SB is better, my Z51 is better, etc. blah, blah, blah......
07-31-2005, 03:19 PM
#5
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Well according to #s I've heard, my choice is what I have (A4 w/performance axel). But in order it would be:
1. A4 w/performance axel
2. A6 w/paddel shifter
3. A4 standard
your poll is flawed leaving out the performance axel aspect
1. A4 w/performance axel
2. A6 w/paddel shifter
3. A4 standard
your poll is flawed leaving out the performance axel aspect
07-31-2005, 03:23 PM
#6
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Change the poll to A4 with 3.15 rear end v. A6.
Do the math (A6 is faster than the A4 with performance axle) or believe the graph (A4 with performance axle has 2% better 0-60mph times).
I'll stick with the A6. .. Even if the 0-60mph times are slower, which has yet to be demonstrated. For me, the Vette is a road car, not a dragster
Excerpted from Curtis A. Franz's post on this forum:
"I have the ratios from the Caddy announcement. The GM Powertrain posting infers that performance will suffer a bit with the 2.56 differential. The two items taken together conflict as the Caddy A6 first gear is lower than the Vette A4 first gear even with the optional G90 perfromance axle. Look at the post 2 above. The implication is that maybe the Vette will have different ratios than the Caddy. Maybe we will find out this Thursday. Duplicating much of the above post but including the axle ratios ...
The various first gear thru top gear ratios are:
4L65E (A4)= [3.06,1.63,1.00,0.70] (4 speed auto)
6L80E (A6)= [4.03,2.36,1.53,1.15,0.852,0.667](6 speed auto)
T56 (M6) = [2.66,1.78,1.30,1.00,0.74,0.50] (6 speed manual)
In GM automatic tranny speak 6L80E means six speed, longitudinal mount, the 80 relates to a torque capacity, and the E means electronic shift control. A quick multiplication gives torque multiplication factors for axle ratios times tranny gear ratios. These use the Corvette axle ratios with the known Caddy A6.
2.56*x6L80E = [10.31, 6.05, 3.92, 2.95, 2.18, 1.71] (*expected axle with A6)
2.73*x4L65E = [ 8.35, 4.45, 2.73, 1.91] (*current std A4 axle)
3.15*x4L65E = [ 9.64, 5.13, 3.15, 2.21] (*current hi perf A4 axle)
3.42*xT56 = [ 9.10, 6.09, 4.45, 3.42, 2.53, 1.71] (*current M6 axle)
That big red 10.31 for the 6 speed indicates a bigger engine torque multiplication than any of the current transmission choices. It ought to be a rubber laying bitch too... if cars are female. The effective differential ratio in top gear, 1.71, matches that of the current six speed manual which has a CAFE of 28 mpg versus the current automatic 26 mpg for highway. So, the six speed gives you the best of both worlds. Now build the damn thing GM! "
Do the math (A6 is faster than the A4 with performance axle) or believe the graph (A4 with performance axle has 2% better 0-60mph times).
I'll stick with the A6. .. Even if the 0-60mph times are slower, which has yet to be demonstrated. For me, the Vette is a road car, not a dragster
Excerpted from Curtis A. Franz's post on this forum:
"I have the ratios from the Caddy announcement. The GM Powertrain posting infers that performance will suffer a bit with the 2.56 differential. The two items taken together conflict as the Caddy A6 first gear is lower than the Vette A4 first gear even with the optional G90 perfromance axle. Look at the post 2 above. The implication is that maybe the Vette will have different ratios than the Caddy. Maybe we will find out this Thursday. Duplicating much of the above post but including the axle ratios ...
The various first gear thru top gear ratios are:
4L65E (A4)= [3.06,1.63,1.00,0.70] (4 speed auto)
6L80E (A6)= [4.03,2.36,1.53,1.15,0.852,0.667](6 speed auto)
T56 (M6) = [2.66,1.78,1.30,1.00,0.74,0.50] (6 speed manual)
In GM automatic tranny speak 6L80E means six speed, longitudinal mount, the 80 relates to a torque capacity, and the E means electronic shift control. A quick multiplication gives torque multiplication factors for axle ratios times tranny gear ratios. These use the Corvette axle ratios with the known Caddy A6.
2.56*x6L80E = [10.31, 6.05, 3.92, 2.95, 2.18, 1.71] (*expected axle with A6)
2.73*x4L65E = [ 8.35, 4.45, 2.73, 1.91] (*current std A4 axle)
3.15*x4L65E = [ 9.64, 5.13, 3.15, 2.21] (*current hi perf A4 axle)
3.42*xT56 = [ 9.10, 6.09, 4.45, 3.42, 2.53, 1.71] (*current M6 axle)
That big red 10.31 for the 6 speed indicates a bigger engine torque multiplication than any of the current transmission choices. It ought to be a rubber laying bitch too... if cars are female. The effective differential ratio in top gear, 1.71, matches that of the current six speed manual which has a CAFE of 28 mpg versus the current automatic 26 mpg for highway. So, the six speed gives you the best of both worlds. Now build the damn thing GM! "
Last edited by ProfMoriarty; 07-31-2005 at 03:29 PM.
07-31-2005, 04:00 PM
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Burning Brakes
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My Z51 has the A4 and the low rear end. I'm happy but I know how the powerglide guys felt when the turbo-hydromatic hit the road.
There's nothing wrong with better performance on the low end and better gas mileage too.
There's nothing wrong with better performance on the low end and better gas mileage too.
07-31-2005, 04:10 PM
#10
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Poll not flawed. well not too flawed LOL
I am just wondering if the A6 or the A4 is desired. This is a very simple poll.
It is a given that performance rear ends, etc. are desired also. Heck it wouldn't bother me if they included a supercharger option (maybe the rumored BLUE DEVIL). Just imagine if you could order the 1959 body style option
.
The more options , the better we can build a C6 to our dreams.
It is a given that performance rear ends, etc. are desired also. Heck it wouldn't bother me if they included a supercharger option (maybe the rumored BLUE DEVIL). Just imagine if you could order the 1959 body style option
.The more options , the better we can build a C6 to our dreams.
07-31-2005, 04:33 PM
#11
Team Owner
Originally Posted by 2000 green hornet
I am just wondering if the A6 or the A4 is desired. This is a very simple poll....
BTW, I'm not voting because there is no automatic in my plans for a vette. But for the record, this poll should be a no-brainer. A6 would be my vote. It's a "win-win" (performance & economy). For those who think new "technology" will have first year problems, and nobody should buy first year - try to find a Model T Ford and see how you like it. That's what we would all be driving if nobody believed in buying first year cars or changes (Okay, maybe something in a quarter horse).
07-31-2005, 04:39 PM
#12
Le Mans Master
Originally Posted by jschindler
You've been on this forum long enough to know that it was not going to be "simple"
BTW, I'm not voting because there is no automatic in my plans for a vette. But for the record, this poll should be a no-brainer. A6 would be my vote. It's a "win-win" (performance & economy). For those who think new "technology" will have first year problems, and nobody should buy first year - try to find a Model T Ford and see how you like it. That's what we would all be driving if nobody believed in buying first year cars or changes (Okay, maybe something in a quarter horse).
BTW, I'm not voting because there is no automatic in my plans for a vette. But for the record, this poll should be a no-brainer. A6 would be my vote. It's a "win-win" (performance & economy). For those who think new "technology" will have first year problems, and nobody should buy first year - try to find a Model T Ford and see how you like it. That's what we would all be driving if nobody believed in buying first year cars or changes (Okay, maybe something in a quarter horse).
07-31-2005, 04:40 PM
#13
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It's not that simple...there's always outside factors. if it is just about the amout of gears and paddles....yes A6 it is.
But there are other things effecting the performance.
Simple sure, do I want $100 or $1,000,000. ya more is better when ya just look at 4 vs 6.
If that is all you wanted to know....seems like a no brainer no poll needed to be posted type question.
But there are other things effecting the performance.
Simple sure, do I want $100 or $1,000,000. ya more is better when ya just look at 4 vs 6.
If that is all you wanted to know....seems like a no brainer no poll needed to be posted type question.
07-31-2005, 05:00 PM
#14
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Originally Posted by ProfMoriarty
Lemme take a wild guess:
If you own a 2005 A4, the A6 will be an underperforming (despite the math) POS, just waiting to disintegrate.
If you're ordering a 2006 A6, the A4 is a has-been resale value albatross around the necks of the unfortunate owners.
If you own a 2005 A4, the A6 will be an underperforming (despite the math) POS, just waiting to disintegrate.
If you're ordering a 2006 A6, the A4 is a has-been resale value albatross around the necks of the unfortunate owners.
07-31-2005, 06:00 PM
#15
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Look at it like this...if you hired a pro driver to race your car, would you want him to have 4 gears...or 6? It really is a no-brainer...that you would want the guy to have all six gears, along with a performance axle ratio.
So...with that said, anyone getting a six speed automatic, WILL have a six speed pro-shifter riding with him...24/7.
Like someone said above...it's a win/win deal to be sure!
So...with that said, anyone getting a six speed automatic, WILL have a six speed pro-shifter riding with him...24/7.
Like someone said above...it's a win/win deal to be sure!
07-31-2005, 06:07 PM
#16
Le Mans Master
I believe the new A6 has a 2:56 rear end. But you really need to look at the final drive ratio to estimate how the performance will compare to the A4. Most posts I have seen that seemed knowledgeable put the A6 well ahead of the A4 in performance despite the rear end ratio.
07-31-2005, 06:37 PM
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I posted the following on another thread about this topic:
A word to the wise about the A6. I have had three different cars with paddle or steering wheels button shifters (a Ferrari 355, a Porsche 911 and a BMW M3) and only the BMW worked very well at all. Of course, none had a clutch.
The Ferrari and the Porsche were very jerky both in the manual shift mode and the automatic mode. The Ferrari F1 trans was the worst...had to replace it 3 times under warranty. The Porsche Tiptronic slowed the car way down in my opinion as compared to the stick shift and it was not smooth at all.
The BMW SMG was great. Maybe it slowed the car down some but it sure was smooth.
As to the Vette, be careful with a first year transmission of this type, particularly if it is 6 speed. Find out who is really making the thing and whether it has ever been used on real life cars in real life situations.
Speaking from experience, a paddle type shifter that does not work right is worst of all possible worlds.
That is why I went ahead and got a 2005 A4 C6.
Good luck to all.
A word to the wise about the A6. I have had three different cars with paddle or steering wheels button shifters (a Ferrari 355, a Porsche 911 and a BMW M3) and only the BMW worked very well at all. Of course, none had a clutch.
The Ferrari and the Porsche were very jerky both in the manual shift mode and the automatic mode. The Ferrari F1 trans was the worst...had to replace it 3 times under warranty. The Porsche Tiptronic slowed the car way down in my opinion as compared to the stick shift and it was not smooth at all.
The BMW SMG was great. Maybe it slowed the car down some but it sure was smooth.
As to the Vette, be careful with a first year transmission of this type, particularly if it is 6 speed. Find out who is really making the thing and whether it has ever been used on real life cars in real life situations.
Speaking from experience, a paddle type shifter that does not work right is worst of all possible worlds.
That is why I went ahead and got a 2005 A4 C6.
Good luck to all.
07-31-2005, 06:54 PM
#18
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Originally Posted by mss8022
A word to the wise about the A6. I have had three different cars with paddle or steering wheels button shifters (a Ferrari 355, a Porsche 911 and a BMW M3) and only the BMW worked very well at all. Of course, none had a clutch.
The Ferrari and the Porsche were very jerky both in the manual shift mode and the automatic mode. The Ferrari F1 trans was the worst...had to replace it 3 times under warranty. The Porsche Tiptronic slowed the car way down in my opinion as compared to the stick shift and it was not smooth at all.
The BMW SMG was great. Maybe it slowed the car down some but it sure was smooth.
Speaking from experience, a paddle type shifter that does not work right is worst of all possible worlds.
That is why I went ahead and got a 2005 A4 C6.
It's an automatic transmission that allows you to, within limits, select gears with push buttons on the steering wheel rather than a plus/ minus gate off to the side of a typical PRNDL selector.
07-31-2005, 07:13 PM
#19
Team Owner
Originally Posted by mss8022
I posted the following on another thread about this topic:
A word to the wise about the A6. I have had three different cars with paddle or steering wheels button shifters (a Ferrari 355, a Porsche 911 and a BMW M3) and only the BMW worked very well at all. Of course, none had a clutch.
The Ferrari and the Porsche were very jerky both in the manual shift mode and the automatic mode. The Ferrari F1 trans was the worst...had to replace it 3 times under warranty. The Porsche Tiptronic slowed the car way down in my opinion as compared to the stick shift and it was not smooth at all.
The BMW SMG was great. Maybe it slowed the car down some but it sure was smooth.
As to the Vette, be careful with a first year transmission of this type, particularly if it is 6 speed. Find out who is really making the thing and whether it has ever been used on real life cars in real life situations.
Speaking from experience, a paddle type shifter that does not work right is worst of all possible worlds.
That is why I went ahead and got a 2005 A4 C6.
Good luck to all.
A word to the wise about the A6. I have had three different cars with paddle or steering wheels button shifters (a Ferrari 355, a Porsche 911 and a BMW M3) and only the BMW worked very well at all. Of course, none had a clutch.
The Ferrari and the Porsche were very jerky both in the manual shift mode and the automatic mode. The Ferrari F1 trans was the worst...had to replace it 3 times under warranty. The Porsche Tiptronic slowed the car way down in my opinion as compared to the stick shift and it was not smooth at all.
The BMW SMG was great. Maybe it slowed the car down some but it sure was smooth.
As to the Vette, be careful with a first year transmission of this type, particularly if it is 6 speed. Find out who is really making the thing and whether it has ever been used on real life cars in real life situations.
Speaking from experience, a paddle type shifter that does not work right is worst of all possible worlds.
That is why I went ahead and got a 2005 A4 C6.
Good luck to all.
07-31-2005, 07:20 PM
#20
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St. Jude Donor '05-'06-'07-'08-'09
Much ado about nothing in my opinion.
I have two Mercedes with 7-speeds (S & SL) and one with a 5 speed (SL). The 7-speeds are shifting all the time around town.
I have two Mercedes with 7-speeds (S & SL) and one with a 5 speed (SL). The 7-speeds are shifting all the time around town.