x-mann

just had my garage done about a month ago. had a 3 part epoxy coat done. (primer, grey epoxy w/ flake, clear polyurethane w/ texture for non-slip). i had yellow, red and black flake, to match the vette and motorcyle put in on the epoxy coat. the floor came out great (done by a contractor) i waited about 2 weeks b4 i parked on it to give it more dry time. took the vette to work and parked it for about a week. backed it out of the garage last week and the tires peeled up 4, 5" x 10" patches. i was so pissed. called the guy who did the floor and no response. left 3 messages and its been about a week now.

the rest of the floor looks great but i'm leary about parking on it. so i went to costco and bought one of the car mats w/ the diamond plate pattern. 7.5' x 17' for 179.00. i layed that over the damaged area and now have to try to find the contractor who did the work to come back out and redo a couple sections of the floor. bummer!!!

a neighbor of mine said that it is very common for hot tires to peal up epoxy flooring. i was told by contractor it wouldn't be a problem, just let it dry fully. he recommended 7 days, i gave it 14 days


there is a contractor out there in socal. the company is 5-star synthetics. I WOULD RECCOMEND "NOT" USING THEM.

VatorMan

Floor prep is the key. If the floor is not spotless and without any oil on it-it will peel up. Sounds like he didn't prep properly.

tjl5709

Besides cleaning, the floor needs to be acid etched for 2 part epoxies to stick.

Sounds like a prep issue.

pwoolford

Tell your neighbor that if hot tires pulled up expoxy floors dealerships would probably stop using it in their service bays.

Jus Cruisin

Worked in new car dealers for 20 years and the epoxy flooring came up in the service bays all the time. They were recoated every 3-5 years or so. I have epoxy in my garage (6 years) and it looks bad where the cars sit. I have even had the motorcycle tires lift it.
I just contacted the Sams supplier and am having a sample piece of the interlocking flooring sent to me. If it is not up to Sport Deck quality, I'll go with Sport Deck or Sears.
No more epoxy for me.

daegge

For eight years I was a factory rep for a mfg. that produced epoxies. For the last 12 years I have owned a distribution co. that sells epoxies for commercial and industrial applications.

Epoxy that has been correctly applied over structurally sound and dry concrete has bond-shear strength that is greater than the internal strength of the concrete itself. Simply said, if everthing was correct on your job and epoxy was peeling up.. concrete would be coming up with it.

Here are some basics that contribute to success with epoxy:

1) Contaminate free concrete. Concrete needs to be clean and dry.
Curing compound or low performance sealers, oil, soap residue, salts, acid residue, etc. etc. can all contribute to marginal or non-existent adhesion. Water vapor transmission through the pores of the concrete (under magnification concrete looks somewhat like 'swiss cheese') can play major role in coating delamination. Adequate concrete cure time coupled with a perfectly installed under-slab vapor barrier is the best hedge aginst this type of failure. Calcium chloride tests or relative humidity tests (involves core drilling the concrete) are the ASTM prescibed methods to determine if the concrete is 'dry' enough.

2) Concrete profile. Forty years ago it was common practice to acid etch concrete prior to installing epoxy. The reaction between acid and alkyline concrete would roughen the concrete surface creating profile. The greater the surface profile the geater the surface bond interface, or, more surface to bond to given a finite area. While acid does a good job in profiling (most) concrete it has a few significant drawbacks. First, water is mixed with the acid and saturates the top layer of concrete. The acid must be thoroughly neutralized or it in itself creates a bond breaker. The acid must be disposed of (difficult given todays requirements). And, acid will not react with certain sealed or contaminated concrete surfaces. Surface profiling is best accomplished by low impact bead-blast method or diamond grid (coarse grit). While epoxy may stick to slick troweled non-contaminated or sealed surfaces the bond will be much, much better over correctly profiled concrete. Bead blasting is also effective in removing contaminates and low performance sealers.

2) Performance, between coats, and cure times. Epoxy is formulated many different ways. For instance, there are epoxy products that are designed soley as primers, for chemical resistance, for u.v. stability, for abrasion resistance, etc. etc.. Make sure that you a dealing a contractor/supplier that is experienced and reputable so that the right material is utilized. Epoxy can delaminate. This means that a top coat can release off of the undercoat. This typically occurs when too much time elapses between coats (this varies by product, conditions, and intermediate prep methods). If this is occuring on your floors there will be film left on the concrete and film on your tire. Epoxy cure times are largely dictated by temperature. Epoxy cures by exothermic reaction (heat). The colder it is the slower the cure. Get epoxy cold enough, and it will stop curing altogether. Substrate temperature has more of an effect on cure rates than ambient air temperature. If you have a cure related failure, there will be epoxy remaining on the concrete.

3) Proper clear and top coat. Epoxies are generally not the best materials left exposed to u.v.. They will either yellow badly, chaulk, or discolour over time. I see that you had a urethane top coat installed. Urethane is good as long as it is aliphatic urethane. Aromatic urethane will yellow and degrade badly with u.v. exposure. Better yet, chemical reistant urethane (CRU) is u.v. stable, does a great job with gas and brake fluid, and will resist plastisizer migration from tires (epoxy does not perform well in direct contact with tires-especially hot ones).

Good luck in getting satisfaction from your contractor.

richie15

When I bought my house new in 2002 an option was to have the garage floor epoxied.The first time they just painted it on the floor.Needless to say it came right up when I parked on it with hot tires.They redid it with the acid etching ,etc. and no problems after that.

3 Z06ZR1

DAm Just ready to do my 22 by 32 garage.

0Stainless Addiction

I have resurface garage floors for over 20 years. The guy should have acid washed and pressure washed the floor. Just acid washing the floor can burn the concrete and leave a residue on the surface .

Now that the surface is sealed with epoxy, Acid washing is useless. With out removing the epoxy coating and doing a proper prep job, the floor will only get worse. And removing the epoxy is not going to be easy. Good luck

10mikeymike

I had a similar problem, but only with one of my vehicles. In addition to my Vette (with BFG KDW2's), I have a Lexus LS430 with Dunlop's and previously a Hummer H2 with BFG's and now a Yukon Denali with Bridgestone's on it. For some reason, the Dunlops have peeled the expoxy off the floor wherever I park the Lexus while the other tires have not caused any problems. I originally had the floor acid washed and then coated with a light tan epoxy coating. After a few weeks I decided it was too light in color so I had dark brown, black and white flecks put down and then covered with a clear epoxy. I've blamed the clear epoxy for my problems, but if that's really the problem, why does it only happen with the Dunlops? The Lexus only has 11K miles on it and is never driven hard enough to get the tires so hot that they would do more damage than the BFG's or Bridgestones on the other vehicles.

DWS44

Had mine done by Home Depot 4 years ago. Full prep work, base coat, blue, gray, black chips, then full epoxy seal. It was expensive for a two-car garage, but had been very solid...only disappointing problem is that it has already started yellowing badly in many areas...and discoloration isn't covered by the warranty.

x-mann

supposedly he did acid etch the floor. i was gone for the day, came home, and the floor was cleaned and still damp. he put up plastic on the walls and said it was for the acid etching he needed to do to prep the floor. the guy sounded knowledgable, said he couldn't apply the epoxy below 55 deg. cause it wouldn't bond. but the one thing i question is the dry time between the epoxy and the poly urethane top coat. originally he said he would apply the epoxy, wait 4 hours, then the urethane. i don't think he waited long at all to apply the poly urethane top coat. he did it all w/ 4 hours. epoxy and top coat. not enough dry time for the epoxy i think. but i am not the contractor.

Frips_Girl

Thanks for the heads up as to who to avoid. I know from experience that floor prep is everything when it epoxying floors. If the epoxy peeled, then the floor was not properly prepped, and the applicator did not know what they were doing. Dealership floors don't peel, and they get tons of traffic... why should yours be any different?

LarryMJones

Thanks for the heads up. I had not heard of these problems. I wanted a checker board tile floor anyway.
LJ

SvetteC6

I did mine over the summer. I used a concrete resurfacing machine, pressure washed and acid etched before I installed a 100% solids epoxy coat system. Not all epoxies are the same. I have not had a problem yet with the coating, yet. Couple things I did notice are humidity issues and slippery surface.

Basically the old floor was a big sponge absorbing all the humidity. Now with the epoxy the humidity seams to condense on the other surfaces, cars, walls, etc.

The floor is slippery when wet but not bad it it's just rain. The snow is another story. If there is snow on your shoes it's VERY slippery. I had to add a carpet runner for the winter.

NevadaVette

[QUOTE=x-mann; ... there is a contractor out there in socal. the company is 5-star synthetics. I WOULD RECCOMEND "NOT" USING THEM.[/QUOTE]


If the aggravation is worth it to you money wise, notify the clown in writing, file a compaint with the California State Contractors License Board, take the guy to small claims for all costs associated with your floor, including temporary remedies, removal and correct installation, assuming that the small claims dollar limitations are adequate. You will win.

Collecting is usually the difficult part. The best way is to lien his bank account (if he has one). If he is a licensed contractor, he has to have a bond posted with the state. The CSCLB will have a record of that bond and it is likely in an amout sufficient to cover your claim. Another way to collect is to file a claim against that bond. That is sometimes easier said than done. Bonding companies are like insurance companies, they often obstruct payment of valid claims.

If the clown is not a licensed contractor, have him arrested.

Here's a few real basic precautions that you should take before letting anybody work on your house:

1. Get a copy of their valid contractor's license.
2. Get a copy of their valid business license to work in your city (if they don't have one, some municipalities have been known to bill you for it).
3. Get an insurance certificate indicating adequate limits and naming you additionally insured (that gives you a claim against their insurance company if they perform their work negligently).
4. Get a recordable lien release before you pay them (they can send you bogus bills and record liens against your property which are difficult to remove and make it difficult to sell).

If they have a problem with any of those items, show them the driveway immediately. They are flakes, period.

nwc6

Thanks for the tips daegge. I am planning on putting epoxy on my garage floor this summer. I was waffling between acid etch and shot blasting as they call it here. I think I will go with the shot blasting.

wild oats

I used ..Airtechcoatings..did as they said, been 10 years, floor is still mint, zero issues , upstate ny weather,..........A friend used u-coat-it,claimed to fame, hot tire lift,...warranty? only a patch kit offered, floor was prepared eteched,etc..

daegge

Good call. Shot blasting is the way to go. Be sure to check for moisture vapor transmission through your concrete. If you don't go thru the process of Calcium Chloride testing or Relative Humidity testing at minimum tape a 24"x24" clear visquene sheet onto the concrete with duct tape (edges completely sealed). Leave a minimum of 24hrs. The nice thing about the clear is that you can monitor the presence or absence of condensation at a glance. If you have time, you may want to leave this down over a period of time since concrete usually emits more vapor during upswings in temperature.

There are waterbased or waterbourne epoxy primers that will handle higher water vapor transmission.

Cycloalyphatic cured bisphenal A epoxy 100% solids 100% reactive in general exhibit better clarity retention and are great for broadcast or flake systems.

Top coat with a CRU (chemical resistant two part polyester modified aliphatic urethane) is your best bet to minimize -or eliminate- the potential of staining.

iw172

daegge, Great write-up. Just another reason I'm glad to be on this forum!