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What car is fastest 1965-1969 427 block with 400-435HP or C6's with a LS2 400HP?

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Old 03-11-2009, 03:59 PM   #41
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Yeah, it's the closet from hell. My wife thinks I'm nuts. I tell her that some of those magazines are older than she is and to leave my closet the hell alone!
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Old 03-11-2009, 04:40 PM   #42
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I owned a new ’69 427/390 and now have an LS2 C6. There is no question that the C6 accelerates faster, has a higher top end, stops quicker, and handles better. Sure wish I still had the ’69.
Me too, I owned a 1969 427 4 speed coupe, I think it was rated at 430 HP, and 450 torque. I thought it was the best thing since sliced bread when I bought it. It was my daily driver, after the euforia wore off, the reality of day to day use wasn't that great. It didn't have air and with a black interior and the heat that the car produced it was uncomfortable, and what a gas sucker. T-top storage with the funky strap system behind the seats wasn't any good either. Many folks wax nostalgic for the old Vettes, not me.
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:04 PM   #43
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The old engines sounded much better IMO. The exhaust smelled much better ( IMO ). The exhaust sounded much better IMO. The entire mystique of the engine was better.

Today, the manufacturer decides that engines need "beauty covers" to hide all the coils and wiring needed to wring out more hp from crummy gas ( compared to back then when avgas was pump gas etc ).

Covers to hide the engine? A 60s 427 was a thing of simple beauty nestled in the car. Very straightforward. Kinda like a B17 or even a B29 (if you are so young and ill informed that these baffle you good luck ). In fact, a 67 427 was running just about the same technology as a big radial engine except for the transistorized ignition ( and the fact that the big radials had turbochargers ).

Radial engine not radial tires.

Everything about the old 427s was cool compared to the high tech LS2 and LS3. Big heavy hunks of iron that made a statement. Loud, pure, brute ..... and slower by far than even a 400 hp LS2 in a vette.

The old cars had very poor tires, suspensions, and suffered with only 4 forward speeds. If you put an LS2 in one today, and nothing broke, the car would still not be that fast.

BUT.....torque!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Low end torque was magnificent in these cars. BTW.....and just my opinion again....Z06 owners who get all impressed with their "427s" are engaged in serious self delusion. Their cars are MUCH faster than the old "real" big block 427s. They make much more hp. But....back then, boring out a small block to 427 inches would have seemed insane....and the problems with the LS7 seem to support the idea that a 427 was better as a BIG BLOCK than as a hogged out small block.*

Because, no matter the power of the LS7, it does not sound, smell, or look as neat as a 427 / 435.

And for those of you too young to understand "smell" I remember when cats first started to be put on car. It amazed us all how bad the exhaust smelled and how different it sounds with the extra element in the gas flow.

I've had big block Camaros ( 396s ) at car shows and people would ask me if I'd fire up the car just so they could stand behind it and smell the exhaust. I remember warming up these cars on cold mornings and seeing all the water blowing out the straight pipes and at idle the gentle pulses of each cylinder firing......

No, LS2's, 3s, and 7s make much more power but they are NOTHING compared to how the old big blocks made you FEEL. You had to have been there to understand and be able to compare those old motors and the new ones. The new ones make more power but seem sterile and devoid of emotion....the old ones made a visceral impression.

ps. my "fuel rail covers" came off at about 8 miles on the car. I figure is you feel like you have to hide the engine you should not even own the car. The engine is what it is, cluttered and busy looking and not at all the clean image of an old high perf V8. But that's what it is so that's what it looks like under my 05s hood.

It's even harder to see the new engine in the ZR1 with the plastic covers. That's a shame I think considering the awesome nature of the beast. Better to have it out in the open for all to enjoy.
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:07 PM   #44
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ill tell you in about a month the differences. once the track opens up my father is going to race his 67 435hp stinray vs my 08 c6. ill post the time/speed differences when that goes down. along with a video.
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:07 PM   #45
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I did a lot of both street and strip racing in the mid 60s till early 70s. I also worked PT at my buddy’s speed shop. Those muscle cars were quick in their era, both in pure form and stock and super stock classes. I worked on, drove or raced against just about anything that was out there!

With that said they will get creamed by the stuff out there today.
Even good running C5s will move right out and when you go farther and talk about STOCK LS2, LS3, LS7 no contest.

The 6spd tranny, better engine controls, much bigger tires, it’s not even a fair contest!

A bit off topic but just for giggles throw in gas mileage of today Vs yardage of that time.
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Old 03-11-2009, 05:18 PM   #46
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Old 03-11-2009, 06:01 PM   #47
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Default 0-60 and 1/4 mile Times

0-60 and 1/4 mile times from Car & Driver, Motor Trend, Road & Track.

http://www.albeedigital.com/supercou...0-60times.html - 16k

1957 Chevrolet Corvette 6.6 14.2
1965 Chevrolet Corvette 6.2 14.9
1967 Chevrolet Corvette L71 5.6 13.8
1968 Chevrolet Corvette 327 7.7 15.6
1968 Chevrolet Corvette 427 6.3 14.1
1969 Chevrolet Corvette 427ci 435hp 5.3 13.8 (C&D Sep '69)
1970 Chevrolet Corvette 427 6.1 14.3
1973 Corvette 350ci L82 6.7 15.1 (C&D Dec '72)
1973 Corvette 454ci 6.4 14.6 (C&D Dec '72)
1975 Chevrolet Corvette 350 9.6 16.4
1976 Chevrolet Corvette 350 8.1 16.5
1977 Chevrolet Corvette 8.8 16.6
1979 Chevrolet Corvette L82 7.3 15.7
1980 Chevrolet Corvette L82 7.4 15.4
1982 Chevrolet Corvette 9.2 16.6
1984 Chevrolet Corvette 6.7 15.1
1985 Chevrolet Corvette 5.7 14.1
1986 Chevrolet Corvette 5.8 14.4
1986 Chevrolet Corvette Convertible 6.0 14.5
1988 Chevrolet Corvette Convertible 6.0 14.6
1988 Chevrolet Corvette Z51 6.0 14.6
1990 Chevrolet Corvette 5.7 14.3
1990 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 4.4 12.8
1991 Chevrolet Corvette L98 5.3 13.9
1991 Chevrolet Corvette Roadster 5.6 14.1
1992 Chevrolet Corvette LT1 5.7 14.1
1992 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 5.6 13.9
1993 Chevrolet Corvette LT1 5.3 13.9
1993 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 5.2 13.6
1994 Chevrolet Corvette LT1(auto) 5.5 14.1
1994 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 4.7 13.1
1995 Chevrolet Corvette LT1 5.2 13.7
1995 Chevrolet Corvette ZR-1 4.9 13.1
1996 Chevrolet Corvette Collectors' 4.9 13.3
1996 Chevrolet Corvette Grand Sport 4.7 13.3
1997 Chevrolet Corvette 4.7 13.3
1998 Chevrolet Corvette Convertible 5.1 13.5
1999 Chevrolet Corvette Hardtop 4.8 13.3
2001 Chevrolet Corvette C5-R 3.5 10.3
2001 Chevrolet Corvette Z06 4.6 13.0
2001 Chevrolet Corvette Coupe 4.8 13.1
2002 Chevrolet Corvette Z06 4.1 12.5
2002 Chevrolet Corvette (Lingenfelter 427 twin turbo) 1.97 9.24
2003 Chevrolet Corvette (50th Anniversary) Manual, 4.9 13.4 (R&T Aug. '02)
2005 Chevrolet Corvette C6 4.2 12.5 (chevrolet.com)
2006 Chevrolet Corvette ZO6 3.5 11.5 (MT Oct '05)
2007 Chevrolet Corvette Z06 3.7 11.8 (MT Oct '07 Vol. 59, NO. 10)


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Old 03-11-2009, 06:32 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by LarryMJones View Post
The old 427's were rated without water pumps, or fans, at the flywheel. So the stock HP was overrated.
..........
There is probably an exception. The C3 L88 engines (67,68,69) were advertised at 430 HP. But in small print, you could see that advertised HP was at a low engine rpm. Folklore is that the L88, factory stock, would produce 550 real flywheel HP. The L88 option in the years sold just about doubled the cost of the car and that cost plus the falsely advertised low HP discouraged all buyers except those who knew the L88 was marketed for racing. These BB's had aluminum heads and a C3 Vert w/o AC would probably weigh about 3300 lbs and with modern tires could keep up with a C6, I'm not sure they would be faster than a Z06 however.

I have a 68 Vert that weighs around 2850 lbs and has a new 390 HP ZZ4 Hot Cam engine (4 spd manual). I plan to take it and the C6 08 auto to a drag strip just to compare them. I think the 68 will put up a good showing, but it's nowhere the sophisticated car the C6 is. It's noisey and with it's bone hard suspension it's hard to control on a bumpy freeway at speeds of 80 mph or so.
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Old 03-11-2009, 06:45 PM   #49
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The pre 1971 horsepower ratings were gross hp w/o water pumps or exhaust. The horsepower ratings now are net.

I have a 1969 427-400hp coupe. The car is a beast and gets attention where ever I drive it. Side pipes make it sound awesome. It is incredibly mean sounding and looks tough as heck also. That being said, my '07 convertible will eat it alive. The general public would probably say the '69 would be fastest, but those who know cars know how good the new cars are. Both cars are completely different driving experiences. Both are incredible corvettes.
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Old 03-11-2009, 07:26 PM   #50
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I have a 68 390hp coupe i ran b/sa that turned 12.20s with 7" slicks,headers,etc. When I changed over to ss/fa with 11" slicks it would run 11,20s at Gainesville.
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Old 03-11-2009, 07:47 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by loflite View Post
The pre 1971 horsepower ratings were gross hp w/o water pumps or exhaust. The horsepower ratings now are net.

I have a 1969 427-400hp coupe. The car is a beast and gets attention where ever I drive it. Side pipes make it sound awesome. It is incredibly mean sounding and looks tough as heck also. That being said, my '07 convertible will eat it alive. The general public would probably say the '69 would be fastest, but those who know cars know how good the new cars are. Both cars are completely different driving experiences. Both are incredible corvettes.
I had a 69 L-88 430 HP when it wasn't over heating it would run the mid 13's fun to drive in its day but always tinkering with it. The L-88 cars had special calipers which made the pads very expensive It was a radio delete car so didn't even have tunes. Even with all the problems and expense I would love to have that car back in my garage and then sell if for what they are going for today....


I still own a 69 350 350 conv. which is a side pipe car.. There is just no comparison between the cars. They both draw attention no matter where you go even though the 69 seems to draw more.

To answer the original question C-6 is faster!

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Old 03-11-2009, 07:48 PM   #52
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I believe the old muscle cars were rated at gross hoursepower, and someplace along the manufacturers changed to net hoursepower. Apparently the difference is about 0.8. I have 67 350 HP Corvette which by those rules should compare to a 280 HP car today. I think that feels reasonable when I drive them. But my 400HP C6 is difinitely faster.
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:08 PM   #53
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C6 will out run a big block due to the advances in technology that allows the power to get to the ground.

It is possible the big blocks were underrated too!
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:39 PM   #54
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Here is my input...I had a 74 Vette with a LT1 engine that I built putting out 250 hp and ran it at Texas World Speedway. I replaced the vette with a stock 1984 Z28 Camaro with a stock engine putting out 155 hp. The Camaro ran much better lap times than the vette. The older vettes had lots of hp but just could not turn. The new vettes have the hp and they do turn...
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:43 PM   #55
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Originally Posted by DonBuralli View Post
ill tell you in about a month the differences. once the track opens up my father is going to race his 67 435hp stinray vs my 08 c6. ill post the time/speed differences when that goes down. along with a video.
Be nice and bring a few cleanex for him.
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:44 PM   #56
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With that said they will get creamed by the stuff out there today.
Even good running C5s will move right out and when you go farther and talk about STOCK LS2, LS3, LS7 no contest.

The 6spd tranny, better engine controls, much bigger tires, it’s not even a fair contest!

A bit off topic but just for giggles throw in gas mileage of today Vs yardage of that time.
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Old 03-11-2009, 08:58 PM   #57
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I'm not sure where the disagreement is
Many of those times were on factory rubber........
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Old 03-11-2009, 09:31 PM   #58
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I loved the sound and rush of speed (read roughness) of the older Vettes. But even back the late 70s when I drove my brothers 68 Vette for a few days, I was tired of driving it after more than 45 minutes at a time. The damn thing drove like an old farm truck...though way faster and a LOT more fun.

I wouldn't really care if the C6 was slower. It is so much fun to drive, is so much more livable, and I think much better looking than all but the '59...flame on!
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:34 PM   #59
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Me too, I owned a 1969 427 4 speed coupe, I think it was rated at 430 HP, and 450 torque.
Probably 435. The only 2 that were "rated" at 430 were L88 and ZL1. L71 was rated at 435.

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The L88 option in the years sold just about doubled the cost of the car...
You're thinking of ZL1, which retailed for $4718 in 1969 (with only 2 ordered). L88 retailed for $948 in 1967 and 1968, $1032 in 1969.
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Old 03-11-2009, 11:52 PM   #60
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Actually I was reading a book today at my dentist: "American Legends"
As I remember this book stated 13.9 secs 1/4 mile for 427 C2s.
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