Dealership Rip Off ?
10-11-2017, 11:53 AM
#21
Le Mans Master
A $25 code reader who have told you which of the thousands of possibilities it could be and saved you from ever having to go to a dealer. People are suggesting plug wires. The code reader would have told you which wire was loose. ECM not reading throttle body? Which code? That would tell you why.
To answer your final comments/questions, the tuners are out after your money also and, yes, you are getting ripped at the dealership.
Hint: if you are going to put diy in your name you really have to have a code reader.
To answer your final comments/questions, the tuners are out after your money also and, yes, you are getting ripped at the dealership.
Hint: if you are going to put diy in your name you really have to have a code reader.
Last edited by FortMorganAl; 10-11-2017 at 11:54 AM.
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BlindSpot (10-11-2017)
10-11-2017, 12:27 PM
#22
Le Mans Master
My suggestion is to check the plug wires at both ends. Sometimes they work loose. Slightly crimp them and reinstall. Try to get the air out of the boots by using a paperclip to lift the ends so that there is no air in the boot. The air heats up and expands the metal.
Clif
Clif
Could you explain this?
10-11-2017, 02:04 PM
#23
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
Thanks for all the tips and suggestions. And, yes.... I did check the plug wire connections and measured ohms across the leads and all was fine. I didn't think a generic "auto-zone" code reader would show all of what could have possibly been wrong. Thought that took a Tech II reader ??
Back from shop. Yeah, it was pricey for the work done, but given I've had it since 08, that is the first time it's had to have anything done to it at all. Also had a faulty TPS sensor (been acting up now for 2 years-intermittent shows FLAT - 0 Air pressure), so had them fix that too.
I got the Blackwing filter and air bridge back, and low and behold, it had a huge crack on the air bridge which I didn't see. So, that's sort of in-line with what they told me initially - to much air across the MAP sensor. I realize I probably got took to the cleaners on it, but it is what it is. And, if it does quit - have a 1 yr warranty on all parts replaced. THEY can pay to have it towed and the fix is on them.
I don't expect any more issues from it as it's now back to stock aside from cutouts which I just keep cracked a little. Rarely run them wide open. The drone is just way to loud for me.
And.... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
Back from shop. Yeah, it was pricey for the work done, but given I've had it since 08, that is the first time it's had to have anything done to it at all. Also had a faulty TPS sensor (been acting up now for 2 years-intermittent shows FLAT - 0 Air pressure), so had them fix that too.
I got the Blackwing filter and air bridge back, and low and behold, it had a huge crack on the air bridge which I didn't see. So, that's sort of in-line with what they told me initially - to much air across the MAP sensor. I realize I probably got took to the cleaners on it, but it is what it is. And, if it does quit - have a 1 yr warranty on all parts replaced. THEY can pay to have it towed and the fix is on them.
I don't expect any more issues from it as it's now back to stock aside from cutouts which I just keep cracked a little. Rarely run them wide open. The drone is just way to loud for me.
And.... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
10-11-2017, 02:26 PM
#24
Le Mans Master
Thanks for all the tips and suggestions. And, yes.... I did check the plug wire connections and measured ohms across the leads and all was fine. I didn't think a generic "auto-zone" code reader would show all of what could have possibly been wrong. Thought that took a Tech II reader ??
Back from shop. Yeah, it was pricey for the work done, but given I've had it since 08, that is the first time it's had to have anything done to it at all. Also had a faulty TPS sensor (been acting up now for 2 years-intermittent shows FLAT - 0 Air pressure), so had them fix that too.
I got the Blackwing filter and air bridge back, and low and behold, it had a huge crack on the air bridge which I didn't see. So, that's sort of in-line with what they told me initially - to much air across the MAP sensor. I realize I probably got took to the cleaners on it, but it is what it is. And, if it does quit - have a 1 yr warranty on all parts replaced. THEY can pay to have it towed and the fix is on them.
I don't expect any more issues from it as it's now back to stock aside from cutouts which I just keep cracked a little. Rarely run them wide open. The drone is just way to loud for me.
And.... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
Back from shop. Yeah, it was pricey for the work done, but given I've had it since 08, that is the first time it's had to have anything done to it at all. Also had a faulty TPS sensor (been acting up now for 2 years-intermittent shows FLAT - 0 Air pressure), so had them fix that too.
I got the Blackwing filter and air bridge back, and low and behold, it had a huge crack on the air bridge which I didn't see. So, that's sort of in-line with what they told me initially - to much air across the MAP sensor. I realize I probably got took to the cleaners on it, but it is what it is. And, if it does quit - have a 1 yr warranty on all parts replaced. THEY can pay to have it towed and the fix is on them.
I don't expect any more issues from it as it's now back to stock aside from cutouts which I just keep cracked a little. Rarely run them wide open. The drone is just way to loud for me.
And.... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
A pretty simple scan tool from just about anywhere would have read the P related faults that would have been generated by the split in the air bridge (as FtMorganAl said). Essentially you were at least getting P0171/P0174 lean banks as a result of the additional air that probably made it past the MAF. There might have been other P-Codes souch as TPS out of range, etc.
Checking plug wires comes from the army of DIYers and internet alley mechanics on CF that remedy any/all faults by checking for plug wires coming loose. They're correct about 18% of the time.
I've posted the correct way to install plug wires on another thread.
Someone on your thread copied it and embellished it so it no longer makes sense, but that is the challenge with big forums.
10-11-2017, 02:26 PM
#25
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Thanks for all the tips and suggestions. And, yes.... I did check the plug wire connections and measured ohms across the leads and all was fine. I didn't think a generic "auto-zone" code reader would show all of what could have possibly been wrong. Thought that took a Tech II reader ??
Back from shop. Yeah, it was pricey for the work done, but given I've had it since 08, that is the first time it's had to have anything done to it at all. Also had a faulty TPS sensor (been acting up now for 2 years-intermittent shows FLAT - 0 Air pressure), so had them fix that too.
I got the Blackwing filter and air bridge back, and low and behold, it had a huge crack on the air bridge which I didn't see. So, that's sort of in-line with what they told me initially - to much air across the MAP sensor. I realize I probably got took to the cleaners on it, but it is what it is. And, if it does quit - have a 1 yr warranty on all parts replaced. THEY can pay to have it towed and the fix is on them.
I don't expect any more issues from it as it's now back to stock aside from cutouts which I just keep cracked a little. Rarely run them wide open. The drone is just way to loud for me.
And.... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
Back from shop. Yeah, it was pricey for the work done, but given I've had it since 08, that is the first time it's had to have anything done to it at all. Also had a faulty TPS sensor (been acting up now for 2 years-intermittent shows FLAT - 0 Air pressure), so had them fix that too.
I got the Blackwing filter and air bridge back, and low and behold, it had a huge crack on the air bridge which I didn't see. So, that's sort of in-line with what they told me initially - to much air across the MAP sensor. I realize I probably got took to the cleaners on it, but it is what it is. And, if it does quit - have a 1 yr warranty on all parts replaced. THEY can pay to have it towed and the fix is on them.
I don't expect any more issues from it as it's now back to stock aside from cutouts which I just keep cracked a little. Rarely run them wide open. The drone is just way to loud for me.
And.... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
10-11-2017, 05:50 PM
#26
Melting Slicks
Thread Starter
My son used to work for an aftermarket speed/tuning shop locally. At the time, he had access to all the tools needed, so I never had to buy anything - just let him run things on then C5 I had at the time. Was run on their Dyno many times, but they more or less specialized in the ricer cars. His 05-STI was an absolute beast. Laid his tools down a few yrs ago to seek career in Fire and EMS service.
10-11-2017, 06:47 PM
#27
Le Mans Master
Open for suggestions. Type/Name/Where to get one.
My son used to work for an aftermarket speed/tuning shop locally. At the time, he had access to all the tools needed, so I never had to buy anything - just let him run things on then C5 I had at the time. Was run on their Dyno many times, but they more or less specialized in the ricer cars. His 05-STI was an absolute beast. Laid his tools down a few yrs ago to seek career in Fire and EMS service.
My son used to work for an aftermarket speed/tuning shop locally. At the time, he had access to all the tools needed, so I never had to buy anything - just let him run things on then C5 I had at the time. Was run on their Dyno many times, but they more or less specialized in the ricer cars. His 05-STI was an absolute beast. Laid his tools down a few yrs ago to seek career in Fire and EMS service.
10-11-2017, 10:38 PM
#28
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As Blindspot said if you are an all GM household the clone Tech II is a great deal, but if you have other non GM cars it will not work on them. I have always liked Actron scanners (Autozone), and believe it or not the Cen-Tech (Harbor Freight) works well too. You do not need a top of the line model, but I would want live data capability at a minimum. Trust me, it will be the best $100 you will ever spend.
10-12-2017, 07:20 AM
#29
Le Mans Master
As Blindspot said if you are an all GM household the clone Tech II is a great deal, but if you have other non GM cars it will not work on them. I have always liked Actron scanners (Autozone), and believe it or not the Cen-Tech (Harbor Freight) works well too. You do not need a top of the line model, but I would want live data capability at a minimum. Trust me, it will be the best $100 you will ever spend.
I probably have a dozen hand held scan tools, some of them going back to the OBD I days. I've tried a lot of them.
My most favorite one, and gets carried around in one of my vehicles, is the Actron 9575. It is a few years old now, but a great tool for around $100. It sees P-Codes, Live Data, Erases fault codes, and has a "State Emissions Readiness" test option. This is slick as it basically runs the same test the State runs in those states where an OBD readiness test is all they do.
MOST IMPORTANTLY, it is CANBUS compatible. Some of the cheaper and/or older scan tools are not CANBUS capable and will not connect to a CANBUS engine management system which all C6s are.
10-12-2017, 07:39 AM
#30
Race Director
10-12-2017, 07:44 AM
#31
Le Mans Master
10-12-2017, 09:06 AM
#32
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10-12-2017, 09:15 AM
#33
Le Mans Master
10-12-2017, 09:28 AM
#34
Le Mans Master
...I didn't think a generic "auto-zone" code reader would show all of what could have possibly been wrong. Thought that took a Tech II reader ?? ... I still do some DIY stuff, not near to the extent I used to 10+ years ago. Father time has taken a toll over the years. Not as easy as it used to be....
I have an Actron CP9180 which has way more features than I have ever needed.
10-12-2017, 03:08 PM
#35
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I love old stuff like this. Sometimes I go out of the way to use it, I kept the points in an old Galaxie just so I could set the dwell. Even tuning a carb is becoming a lost art. When I built my 68 Caprice I did not go FI just so I had something to mess with under the hood.
Of course, the Q-jet has not given me a reason to touch it.
10-13-2017, 08:43 AM
#36
Le Mans Master
...Any simple code reader should be able to read all P-Codes. P-0xxx codes are all generic and assigned by the SAE so those always mean the same on all OBD II EMSs. P-1xxx and P-2xxx codes start to become manufacturer specific. Although many of them have become standardized to mean the same thing, every once in a while I'll run into a P-2xxx code that comes up with a meaning different from the specific mfgrs description.
Here are the C6 P-codes any scan tool should read. These comprise about 1/3rd of the total codes the C6 EMS can generate in B,C and U-codes. ...
Here are the C6 P-codes any scan tool should read. These comprise about 1/3rd of the total codes the C6 EMS can generate in B,C and U-codes. ...
Last edited by FortMorganAl; 10-13-2017 at 08:43 AM.
10-13-2017, 09:00 AM
#37
Le Mans Master
That's not all of them. Just a quick look shows your list doesn't include P0301 through P0308 which identify specific cylinders that are misfiring., P060F indicating an issue with the ECM computer memory, etc. And, yes, any inexpensive code reader should give you at least a number to look up which would also include the manufacturer specific codes. A generic code reader may not be able to give a description in words for every code but the number is coming from the BCM computer so it should at least display that number even for the non-P codes.
Good catch Al - I took the post down too. Hate inaccuracies that get posted where someone searching someday might rely on.
Last edited by BlindSpot; 10-13-2017 at 09:04 AM.
10-13-2017, 09:15 AM
#38
Le Mans Master
Ha, funny, true. Don't know what happened to those individual misfires. They are standards. This came from one of three different list sources I have on the C6. I'm going to delete it from my files.
Good catch Al - I took the post down too. Hate inaccuracies that get posted where someone searching someday might rely on.
Good catch Al - I took the post down too. Hate inaccuracies that get posted where someone searching someday might rely on.
I wouldn't have taken down your list. It was correct as far as I could see, just not complete. And if someone some day relies on an incomplete post without reading the rest of the thread postings, I feel that is their problem. There is SO much misinformation in this forum that doesn't get corrected immediately and turns into urban legend that even a partial post that is correct as far as it goes is valuable.
10-13-2017, 08:17 PM
#40
Melting Slicks
serious question now (apologies PatsG),
will Actron CP9180 or Harbor Freight scanners kill a code? I was having issues with the EVAP on mine. I close it and it comes back in a few weeks.
I'd like to kill it at my house rather than bother the auto parts stores.
will Actron CP9180 or Harbor Freight scanners kill a code? I was having issues with the EVAP on mine. I close it and it comes back in a few weeks.
I'd like to kill it at my house rather than bother the auto parts stores.