Mcrider

I'm new to the forum, but have built Harley's for almost 40 years now, and done a considerable amount of drag racing, including a few years with a very competitive Top Alcohol Funny Car team on the NHRA circuit, so I am no novice to horsepower and vehicles. Starting in the late 90's, the world of Harley's began a climb to bigger and bigger engines that continues today.I watched completely unskilled riders purchase these bikes, especially during the chopper craze, and crash them left and right. The chopper fad is over but now it's moved onto uber high horsepower baggers, with the same results.

Today's cars are on an even quicker escalation into horsepower in street cars that is becoming mind boggling. In the early 70's, insurance companies stepped in and quickly killed the musclecars of the day, and they don't hold a candle to what a person can buy off a dealers lot today. Cadillac advertises on TV they make a 200MPH sedan! What used to be the rare air of the super cars is now commonplace with many cars capable of hitting 200MPH, and yet are fully street legal and driven.

Will the mix of this super horsepower in street driven "race cars" once again cause the insurance companies to step in and drop the hammer?

Reckedhim

No.

Bruze

As I recall, the insurance companies didn't kill musclecars, the government did with its emission and fuel mandates.

So over time, the auto companies learned how to work around all that and we have the modern, unbelievably fast cars -- some of which even get great mileage! The insurance companies don't seem to care.

6SpeedTA95

Your profile says you live in the US. You should know it was the EPA and the oil crisis that killed muscle cars.

Welker1

Mcrider

It wasn't the EPA that killed muscle cars, they didn't even exist until Nixon proposed them in December of 1970, so there wasn't any legislation from them to dictate their demise which had already begun. The gas shortage didn't hit until 73, well after the heydays of the muscle cars. My father worked in insurance all his life and his company, along with many others began to refuse insuring them in 1970.

The last Boss Mustang was in 71 I believe.

I remember my insurance TRIPLING on my 69 Camaro, and I had a clean driving record. Gas prices damn sure hurt, but the money just went into the car instead of being spent on the girlfriend.

Bruze

The mandated "smog" stuff started in 1968. I bought a new Camaro that year and it had the air pump injector thingy that pumped air into the exhaust manifold, one tube on each exhaust port.

That was more or less the beginning of it, as I recall. They just got more and more choked down until the mid-late '70 Vettes were a joke.

Insurance: I had a '70 440 3x2 Roadrunner (a pretty fast car in its day) and sold it in '72 when I got married. Insurance was not high nor the reason I sold it.

You say your insurance tripled. How many tickets/accidents did you have? Musta been a lot.

TxLefty

It seemed to be a combination of both. Once autonomous cars are the norm I could see where the old "fully manual" vehicles might have a pretty significant surcharge added on.

ontime

autonomous takes all the fun out of aiming at something. good grief when will this all stop. blame the machine not my fault syndrome is why nanny's are being put on everything it just keeps adding ridiculous costs and draining away any cash you might have for future retirement. Sorry just had to say that. if you can't pay attention while driving then don't get in a car. this autonomous mentality is saying we cant be trusted to make decisions. Not a good position to be in folks.

Bruze

That's one nice thing about being old: I'll be dead or at least senile before this nonsense affects me.

GREENKAR

It was the Government that added on all the smog items on the high HP engines. Not

Cherokee Nation

If my vette was a manual State farm would charge more to insure it...It has been that way even back in the muscle car days.

Landru

Wondered the same thing while watching HP #s climb.
Something's very different this time around, though.
Checked the price on the Cad in the above example?
To the moon. Ditto Z06, ZR1, 500, GT, GTR etc.

Today OTD price is a controlling factor as opposed to muscle car era. 'HP' vehicles could be had for comparative peanuts which naturally xlated to a LOT more HP cars.

It's not relative either, what GM charges today for a top tier Corvette (or Cad-Buick FTM) c/would've easily bought a very nice home in '69-'70.

It's the large numbers of HP vehicles, many driven by idiots young and old, which mandated insurance company involvement so they w/could cover their azz so IC response didn't kill the era, drivers did.

Mcrider

When I was a kid in the 60's and early 70's, we grew up on dirt bikes, we learned how to ride and even lay a bike down. Jump ahead 30 to the late 90's and later and first time HD owners are buying bikes for the first time that are large and high horsepower, and crashing in high numbers. Insurance companies are already taking a very hard look at "superbikes" and a local dealer told me he has heard of some insurance companies refusing to insure some bikes.

I can see a parallel with cars today. Because of the older ages of most buying these cars, because of their costs, the insurance companies haven't seen to have "hit" yet, keyword YET. As these cars age and go down in value, how long will it be until they end up in the hands of young, inexperienced drivers?

I bring this up because of an incident that happened here in 2004. Daddy bought his 17 year old son a new Viper and the accident happened less than 1 mile from home on the maiden drive of the young man and his new car. The results were tragic beyond belief.

http://www.kcci.com/article/van-mete...-crash/6833056

reasonable suspicion

Insurance is killing the Hellcats. I would have bought a hellcat for my daily, ended up getting a scat pack instead more because of insurance rates than the initial cost differential.

Turbo6TA

I agree ... A combo of government air regs (resulting in low compression / choked engines) along with high insurance rates for 'Muscle Cars' both killed them off.

Landru

Does it surprise you?
Look whenever I'm in the boonies enjoying mild twisties & I see headlight of a bike coming at me 'round turn I nearly come to a stop.
New to bikes idiots know-not physics, centripetal/centrifugal force, whaaaa?
Damned things piloted by morons & carrying way too much speed have drifted into my lane often enough I now expect it.

I too grew-up w/ dirt bikes, DT-250...later XT-550.
Cheap fun, all day for 50cts gas & best of all off road didn't need a DL.
As a kid it'd be the first time experiencing real freedom, later replaced w/ vehicles.
Whatever I learned re laying it down was OJT, pain's a powerful deterrent.

Absolutely spot-on, our experience has switched polarity.
W/ a clean record, no DUIs etc insurance is reasonable, especially good if car's garaged & secure.


Fair question to which all I can say is one thought.
IF a 'youngster' (you define 'youngster') gets their hands on a C6, and they are able to keep it roadworthy w/ either $ and/or their own skill set?
Might turn out these ones will be more responsible than either of us would ever have guessed. Or not & if so enter insurance co w/ rates reflecting the demo risk pool & cost of Corvette ownership goes way up. IIRC it isn't exactly cheap getting insured for those under 25, anyway.

Yea they sure are, and there're many others few other than local ever hear about. Roadway carnage isn't new.
However in instance cited ol' Dad overindulged his progeny & paid the ultimate price.
Think what's going through the old man's head, eh?
"But he PROMISED ME he'd drive responsibly!"

I personally should've died a half dozen times in various vehicles.
Screwing around, Lord knows mindset, was young w/ other idiots ready to die w/ me. 'Nuff said.
Truth is?
NONE of said vehicles where eternity might've been met were remotely close to a Corvette, too.

zzjakect

I found that insuring my 2006 Corvette was less expensive than my 2004 Jaguar XJ8. Insurance rep said it was due to much higher replacement and repair costs of Jaguar. GO AMERICAN!!!

Mike's LS3

especially when parts consist of carbon fiber, expensive motors, addition of electronics and the mark up cost of imported parts.


My 2008 at corvette is less expensive to insure than my wife's 2006 325i BMW, both of us with clean records.

RobJoy

I'm from the muscle car era of the 1960's. Yep, I'm telling my age. To answer the question: The factor that drove up insurance costs in that time period was the number of tickets and accidents. Drive sanely and maybe we all can keep insurance rates down. I guess we have a responsibility to each other.