[Z06] Z06 H/C 600 rwhp+ recipie needed
04-03-2014, 05:10 AM
#41
Le Mans Master
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As some have previously stated, the delta from a baseline on the same dyno is the most important item. 
As for trap speed, driver input and individual setups can vary the results significantly. Slow shifts, shift points, power shifting, launching with or without a bog, effective gear ratio, radials, bias ply slicks, skinnies, tire pressure, available traction all affect trap speed. We have witnessed the same car trap 4 mph higher with a different driver. The driver mod will cut ET and raise trap speed. This is the best bang for the buck.
We only dyno our cars on Tune Time's Mustang dyno. This is a great tuning tool in the right hands.
As for a 600+ rwhp car, they can be very drivable with the right intake (ITB) and tuning albeit tip in is a little touchy. Robz's LS7 based 388 made 633 rwhp on Matt's Mustang dyno. The cam is quite large but idled at 650 rpm with the ITB. It drove well on the street (IMHO and I have driven many setups that I have not liked), revved to 9000 rpm, and ran low 9.3s at 148 mph in street trim.
OP- What is the reason for 600 rwhp? Is this for 1/4, 1/2 or 1 mile racing? Will you be autocross racing or running on a road course? Is this a DD or a second vehicle? What is your specific goal? If you can honestly answer this last question, then you can build a car that meets your needs. You may or may not need 600+ depending on your answer.
As for trap speed, driver input and individual setups can vary the results significantly. Slow shifts, shift points, power shifting, launching with or without a bog, effective gear ratio, radials, bias ply slicks, skinnies, tire pressure, available traction all affect trap speed. We have witnessed the same car trap 4 mph higher with a different driver. The driver mod will cut ET and raise trap speed. This is the best bang for the buck.
We only dyno our cars on Tune Time's Mustang dyno. This is a great tuning tool in the right hands.
As for a 600+ rwhp car, they can be very drivable with the right intake (ITB) and tuning albeit tip in is a little touchy. Robz's LS7 based 388 made 633 rwhp on Matt's Mustang dyno. The cam is quite large but idled at 650 rpm with the ITB. It drove well on the street (IMHO and I have driven many setups that I have not liked), revved to 9000 rpm, and ran low 9.3s at 148 mph in street trim.
OP- What is the reason for 600 rwhp? Is this for 1/4, 1/2 or 1 mile racing? Will you be autocross racing or running on a road course? Is this a DD or a second vehicle? What is your specific goal? If you can honestly answer this last question, then you can build a car that meets your needs. You may or may not need 600+ depending on your answer.
04-03-2014, 05:24 AM
#42
Le Mans Master
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Here is a motor that would cost you around $30K to build. It may have been sold. You or anyone can contact Rob to see if it's still available.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-p...-upgrades.html
Proven: Normally-aspirated 388 ci sleeved and ERL super-decked high rpm ls7
$15,000.00
The motor is partially assembled right now.
Newly resleeved and rebuilt ls7
388ci n/a (high rpm) custom race motor capable of 9000rpms
custom cnc'd TrickFlow 245 heads hand ported by Larry Meaux
BME top shelf connecting rods
BME custom pistons by Rebco machine with all the bells/whistles mated to CC of the heads
Lifter bores and all machine work by Charlie Weston
Jesel lifters new
Assembled by MCP competition engines
Custom soild roller cam
Jesel valvetrain
Any/all wearable parts are brand new (ie. valves, springs, bearings,)
ARP hardware throughout
Callies Magnum crank with additional machine work for performance
Can be setup with a wet or dry sump oiling system.
No expenses spared. Selling for ~1/2 of what it would take to build.
Best et: 9.3
Best mph: 148+
Times were run in a 3150lb street car on a 25" drag radial, w/ 6 speed with full exhaust, stock IRS, stock c5 built rear and trans.
It has never been run after being ERL sleeved and superdecked.
Dynoed 634 rwhp on a conservative Mustang dyno.(~700rwhp dynojet)
Video, paperwork, and much more details available.
Manifold sold separately. Anyone who buys this motor will have option of buying an optimized and ported Harrop ITB manifold for $2500.
Serious buyers only please.
http://forums.corvetteforum.com/c5-p...-upgrades.html
Proven: Normally-aspirated 388 ci sleeved and ERL super-decked high rpm ls7
$15,000.00
The motor is partially assembled right now.
Newly resleeved and rebuilt ls7
388ci n/a (high rpm) custom race motor capable of 9000rpms
custom cnc'd TrickFlow 245 heads hand ported by Larry Meaux
BME top shelf connecting rods
BME custom pistons by Rebco machine with all the bells/whistles mated to CC of the heads
Lifter bores and all machine work by Charlie Weston
Jesel lifters new
Assembled by MCP competition engines
Custom soild roller cam
Jesel valvetrain
Any/all wearable parts are brand new (ie. valves, springs, bearings,)
ARP hardware throughout
Callies Magnum crank with additional machine work for performance
Can be setup with a wet or dry sump oiling system.
No expenses spared. Selling for ~1/2 of what it would take to build.
Best et: 9.3
Best mph: 148+
Times were run in a 3150lb street car on a 25" drag radial, w/ 6 speed with full exhaust, stock IRS, stock c5 built rear and trans.
It has never been run after being ERL sleeved and superdecked.
Dynoed 634 rwhp on a conservative Mustang dyno.(~700rwhp dynojet)
Video, paperwork, and much more details available.
Manifold sold separately. Anyone who buys this motor will have option of buying an optimized and ported Harrop ITB manifold for $2500.
Serious buyers only please.
04-03-2014, 05:40 AM
#43
Drifting
OP- What is the reason for 600 rwhp? Is this for 1/4, 1/2 or 1 mile racing? Will you be autocross racing or running on a road course? Is this a DD or a second vehicle? What is your specific goal? If you can honestly answer this last question, then you can build a car that meets your needs. You may or may not need 600+ depending on your answer.
04-03-2014, 08:42 AM
#46
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That will depend on your fuel. If you go E85, you should do an upgrade no matter the combination. If you stick with 93, it would best to swap them out when your DC is above 90%.
Ok, now you can back into that number. What type of DA do you wish to run 9s? Will you do this without any weight reduction? (Passenger seat and front sway bar removed?) Will you run a drag pack? Will you run bias ply or radials? If you only intend on putting a DR on the rear and not change the front tires, you will about 15 hp to compensate. A good bang for the buck, is a rear gear change or trans ratio swap. The 1/4 is all about the first 330'. If you crush the 60' and hit your first two shifts, you are almost there. Granted, running a 9 second pass is not easy and hp does help to a certain extent; however, there is much more to the setup than just a peak HP number. A great mod is to swap out the clutch for a lighter clutch with a smaller MOI. You gain rwhp. The proper clutch will need to be slipped, allow for high rpm launches and can shift at higher rpm.
Ok, now you can back into that number. What type of DA do you wish to run 9s? Will you do this without any weight reduction? (Passenger seat and front sway bar removed?) Will you run a drag pack? Will you run bias ply or radials? If you only intend on putting a DR on the rear and not change the front tires, you will about 15 hp to compensate. A good bang for the buck, is a rear gear change or trans ratio swap. The 1/4 is all about the first 330'. If you crush the 60' and hit your first two shifts, you are almost there. Granted, running a 9 second pass is not easy and hp does help to a certain extent; however, there is much more to the setup than just a peak HP number. A great mod is to swap out the clutch for a lighter clutch with a smaller MOI. You gain rwhp. The proper clutch will need to be slipped, allow for high rpm launches and can shift at higher rpm.
04-03-2014, 01:50 PM
#47
If this is a street car, I would focus on how much torque a certain cam makes in the low-to-mid RPM range vs just peak HP. I had 3 different cams in my C6 (ranging from pretty big to OH MY GOD WTF IS THAT?!) and I can tell you that even though the peak HP difference between the 3 was less than 20 (they were all pretty big cams), the low-to-mid RPM torque difference (and as a consequence, the throttle response and FUN) was HUGE. I ultimately was MUCH happier with a cam that sacrificed a little top end power to have one that gave me a better torque curve.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
04-03-2014, 03:12 PM
#48
Pro
If this is a street car, I would focus on how much torque a certain cam makes in the low-to-mid RPM range vs just peak HP. I had 3 different cams in my C6 (ranging from pretty big to OH MY GOD WTF IS THAT?!) and I can tell you that even though the peak HP difference between the 3 was less than 20 (they were all pretty big cams), the low-to-mid RPM torque difference (and as a consequence, the throttle response and FUN) was HUGE. I ultimately was MUCH happier with a cam that sacrificed a little top end power to have one that gave me a better torque curve.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
I have to 100% agree to this^^^^
04-03-2014, 04:33 PM
#50
x1000
If this is a street car, I would focus on how much torque a certain cam makes in the low-to-mid RPM range vs just peak HP. I had 3 different cams in my C6 (ranging from pretty big to OH MY GOD WTF IS THAT?!) and I can tell you that even though the peak HP difference between the 3 was less than 20 (they were all pretty big cams), the low-to-mid RPM torque difference (and as a consequence, the throttle response and FUN) was HUGE. I ultimately was MUCH happier with a cam that sacrificed a little top end power to have one that gave me a better torque curve.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
04-03-2014, 04:41 PM
#51
If this is a street car, I would focus on how much torque a certain cam makes in the low-to-mid RPM range vs just peak HP. I had 3 different cams in my C6 (ranging from pretty big to OH MY GOD WTF IS THAT?!) and I can tell you that even though the peak HP difference between the 3 was less than 20 (they were all pretty big cams), the low-to-mid RPM torque difference (and as a consequence, the throttle response and FUN) was HUGE. I ultimately was MUCH happier with a cam that sacrificed a little top end power to have one that gave me a better torque curve.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
Hitting a specific power number is fun, for a while, but flooring the throttle and getting pinned back in your seat is more fun in my experience.
Power under the curve is where its atIm JK op.
04-03-2014, 06:33 PM
#52
Premium Supporting Vendor
Interesting thread.
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Last edited by SteveDoten@ARH; 05-06-2014 at 09:15 PM.
04-03-2014, 06:57 PM
#53
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If you put your car on 100 different dyno's you will probably get 95 different readings. A car may make 570 rwhp on one dyno and then make 605 rwhp on another dyno.
A true 600 rwhp Z06 will trap 138-140 mph in the 1/4.
A guy earlier in this thread said his car did 596 rwhp and trapped 133 mph....while thats not a bad trap by any means....its not even close to a true 600 rwhp car. Looks like it was just ran on a high reading dyno.
Hell my car ran 129 mph in the 1/4 and my car made 463 rwhp on my local dyno.
Just some food for thought.......
A true 600 rwhp Z06 will trap 138-140 mph in the 1/4.
A guy earlier in this thread said his car did 596 rwhp and trapped 133 mph....while thats not a bad trap by any means....its not even close to a true 600 rwhp car. Looks like it was just ran on a high reading dyno.
Hell my car ran 129 mph in the 1/4 and my car made 463 rwhp on my local dyno.
Just some food for thought.......
04-03-2014, 07:38 PM
#54
Pro
The stock injectors will work at 600rwhp N/A.
You mentioned Livernois earlier...Their S3 cars regularly make 600+ rwhp on 93 octane, with quite a few documented on their YouTube page. They are a no BS shop. If it doesn't work, they don't use it. They consistently deliver on numbers, quality, reliability, and customer service. I personally can't say that about many places.
Anyway, here is what worked for me:
Livernois ported/milled heads w/ stock valves and their dual springs
Livernois S3 cam - it's around a 24X/25X .675"
Livernois tuned
FAST 102 - deburred and port matched
Ported stock TB
Kooks...or ARH 2" headers...I'd go ARH because they fit better
Offroad X pipe
Halltech MF107
I haven't had my car to the track yet, but several of their S3 cars have gone 138-140 in the 1/4. I agree with the posts above, that a REAL 600 rwhp Z should be capable of those trap speeds.
Last edited by MyLS1Hauls; 04-05-2014 at 08:37 PM.
04-04-2014, 02:05 AM
#56
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Nice im trying to be up the same range as you and bigbronco id be happy with 570-590 range, im also doing the wcch stage 2 heads, AR longtubes, no cats, and cam that i cant figure out yet, maybe a custom or torquer 110 and a nice tune
04-04-2014, 02:28 AM
#57
Drifting
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04-04-2014, 05:59 AM
#58
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
yeah as others have said if you pull a trap speed of 138-140mph thats a no bs method of the power output.
Last edited by Z06 Steve; 04-04-2014 at 05:24 PM.
04-04-2014, 12:20 PM
#59
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The stock injectors will work at 600rwhp N/A.
You mentioned Livernois earlier...Their S3 cars regularly make 600+ rwhp on 93 octane, with quite a few documented on their YouTube page. They are a no BS shop. If it doesn't work, they don't use it. They consistently deliver on numbers, quality, reliability, and customer service. I personally can't say that about many places.
Anyway, here is what worked for me:
Livernois ported/milled heads w/ stock valves and their dual springs
Livernois S3 cam - it's around a 244/254 .675"
Livernois tuned
FAST 102 - deburred and port matched
Ported stock TB
Kooks...or ARH 2" headers...I'd go ARH because they fit better
Offroad X pipe
Halltech MF107
I haven't had my car to the track yet, but several of their S3 cars have gone 138-140 in the 1/4. I agree with the posts above, that a REAL 600 rwhp Z should be capable of those trap speeds.
You mentioned Livernois earlier...Their S3 cars regularly make 600+ rwhp on 93 octane, with quite a few documented on their YouTube page. They are a no BS shop. If it doesn't work, they don't use it. They consistently deliver on numbers, quality, reliability, and customer service. I personally can't say that about many places.
Anyway, here is what worked for me:
Livernois ported/milled heads w/ stock valves and their dual springs
Livernois S3 cam - it's around a 244/254 .675"
Livernois tuned
FAST 102 - deburred and port matched
Ported stock TB
Kooks...or ARH 2" headers...I'd go ARH because they fit better
Offroad X pipe
Halltech MF107
I haven't had my car to the track yet, but several of their S3 cars have gone 138-140 in the 1/4. I agree with the posts above, that a REAL 600 rwhp Z should be capable of those trap speeds.
This does not guaranty that it will produce a 9.9x timeslip.
04-04-2014, 01:45 PM
#60
Drifting
