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So it's kinda like a hybrid 2 cycle engine then right?
Occams Razor say's that all things being equal the simplest explanation is usually correct...... if the oil is not leaking it's got to be burning it..... especially at those amounts.... and there are only a few reasons an engine burns oil. It's getting by the rings or leaking past the valve seals or a head gasket is blown. There may be others but those are the main ones....
Hib since you live in Kalifornia there has to be a lot of top notch engine folks who can bore scope that for you and see if the cylinder walls are glazed again or the rings never seated correctly. The idea of having to haul it all the way back to Katech would really bum me out more then I would already be bummed out by now.
Maybe this combination of parts can't be broken in without a high Zinc Dino oil and not a synthetic. In the past we were always told to break in the engine with Dino oil to take advantage of establishing a good wear pattern then switch it over after a few thousand miles. Engines are better now and I understand that all the new Corvettes have been broke in with Mobil 1 since 93........but what you have got is not a stock GM engine anymore...... but you would think the Katech guys would know what works and what does not........ right?
Raising a glass of Pappy's in your direction now and hoping for a good conclusion to this conundrum......
So it's kinda like a hybrid 2 cycle engine then right?
Occams Razor say's that all things being equal the simplest explanation is usually correct...... if the oil is not leaking it's got to be burning it..... especially at those amounts.... and there are only a few reasons an engine burns oil. It's getting by the rings or leaking past the valve seals or a head gasket is blown. There may be others but those are the main ones....
Head gaskets are not a problem and I suspect that valve guides/seals are not either.
Hib since you live in Kalifornia there has to be a lot of top notch engine folks who can bore scope that for you and see if the cylinder walls are glazed again or the rings never seated correctly.
I'd like to borescope it myself. Problem is, after trying two different "video inspection cameras" in the $300-$400 range, I've decided my expectations of tools in that price range are unreasonable. The first one I sent back. The other I sold on Craig's List. I need to be wiling to spend more so I've been looking at one that ExTech (which is part of FLIR) sells. It's a lot more money, though.
The idea of having to haul it all the way back to Katech would really bum me out more then I would already be bummed out by now.
Actually, I had to do that once already.
Maybe this combination of parts can't be broken in without a high Zinc Dino oil and not a synthetic.
That's doubtful. I don't think the level of ZDDP in the oil has as much bearing on ring seating as it does on valve gear with high spring pressures.
In the past we were always told to break in the engine with Dino oil to take advantage of establishing a good wear pattern then switch it over after a few thousand miles. Engines are better now and I understand that all the new Corvettes have been broke in with Mobil 1 since 93........
Factory-fill with Mobil 1 began with the LT1 in 1992. LT5 went to it in MY93 and since then, every Corvette engine has been factory-fill with Mobil 1, however...since 2015 GM has been putting a break-in additive in the oil and that's where the relatively new requirement of a 500-mile first oil change comes from. I've been told that this break-in additive causes oil "foaming" after about 500 miles of use.
but what you have got is not a stock GM engine anymore...... but you would think the Katech guys would know what works and what does not........ right?
Right. Totally right.
Raising a glass of Pappy's in your direction now and hoping for a good conclusion to this conundrum......
Thanks. I'll buy the next round.
Last edited by Hib Halverson; 03-14-2019 at 04:09 PM.
On Tuesday morning, I did a conference call with both Katech's President, Steve Spurr and Katech's Director of Aftermarket Operations, Jason Harding. The next major step in this adventure is likely going to be for me to ship the car to Katech, again–only this time, they have agreed to pay the freight. Katech agrees that the engine's oil consumption rate is too high.
Next week, I'm headed to B.G. to do an R8C on a C7 ZR-1 and, also, go over to the Plant to do an interview with Plant Manager Kai Spande for a Corvette Magazine article. After that, I'll drive the ZR-1 to California. When I return to work in a couple of weeks, my plan is to borescope a couple cylinders in my Katech Street Attack LS7's cylinders, then get the car ready to ship.
Once Katech's calibrator agrees that changes I have made to the engine's idle calibration do not affect oil consumption, the car goes on a truck headed for Michigan.
Wait... you futzed with the tune again on the 2nd motor? Why would you give them any kind of "out" after your first experience?
Enjoy the new ZR1!
"Tool Hoarder", that's a great question. The answer is a bit long.
When the engine in my ZO6 was given the Street Attack LS7 treatment by Katech, early-on there was, in my opinion, evidence that it was consuming too much oil. I even have video of oil smoke spewing from the exhaust during on-road acceleration test runs from 1500-7000-rpm in third gear. That footage was shot in early January of 2018 before I made any changes to fuel or spark during high-load/high-rpm operation. I made this clear to Katech when I noticed the oil smoke–I even sent a copy of the footage to Jason Harding on 15JAN2018–and told Katech about that again some months later when it and I began discussing a rebuild. In fact, in the summer of 2018, I asked them to split the cost of rebuilding the engine, but it demurred with the explanation that the changes in WOT fuel and spark calibration which I made later (after it was already obvious the engine was consuming too much oil) was the sole cause of the engine failure. Further, Katech's position was that since I had changed calibration, its warranty was void because it specifies warranty coverage requires no user cal changes.
The problem with the Katech calibration that was in the ECM when picked-up the car in December of 2017 was that idle quality and part-throttle/low RPM drivability were poor. The idle speed was way high...so high the engine, with a 875-925-rpm idle speed, would not pass the Califronia state emissions test. When the idle is above 900-rpm you flunk, instantly. In addition, to the idle speed issue, the idle was not stable and was surging. Finally, low-speed drivability was poor–to the point of intermittent stalling at tip in when trying to start the car rolling our of an intersection after waiting to say...turn left. This happened a number of times in the drive from Katech back to California in Dec. 2017. There was no way I was going to live with that. In January of 2018, Katech did email me two additional calibrations, but neither solved the drivability problems. At that point, Steve Spurr, Katech's President, emailed me and said they were no longer able to support me with additional calibration files via email. I was in a tough spot as Katech wasn't going to help me with any more cals, but if I started calibrating with my own stuff, I'd void the warranty.
One of the reasons I selected Katech's "Torquer 116" camshaft for my Street Attack LS7 build was I believed that cam in an engine with stock exhaust manifolds and cats would pass the California emissions test, aka the "Smog Check" which is required every two years. As it turned out, the car had to pass the CA Smog Check in the Spring of 2018 and, once I recalibrated the engine's idle such that it would idle at 750 with reasonable stability, it passed easily. I won't have to test again until 2020.
After that, in the late Spring of '18, was where I f**ked-up and began changing WOT fuel and spark. I leaned the WOT fuel too much and fried the cats. Katech, also, felt that because of the lean air/fuel ratio, the cylinder walls wore out. Finally, the engine was exhibiting a ton of knock retard which I thought was due to too much advance and the 91-oct gas we have here in the West, but the KR was actually caused by a combination if the lean AFR and the oil ingestion that was occurring in the last few months before I shipped the car to Katech for the first rebuild. The problem with oil vapor is it is really low octane and when there is a lot of it in the intake charge and the air/fuel is lean, the engine will knocks big-time and then, of course, the EST function retards the spark which you see on your logs or on a scanner as "knock retard".
My position was that Katech was culpable for the high oil consumption the engine exhibited early-on and I was responsible for additional damage to the engine in the period just before Katech and I decided the car needed to be shipped back to them for repair. That's why I suggested a split in the cost of the rebuild but, unfortunately, Katech was unable to agree to that.
Ok, fast forward to the situation after the rebuild...
By the time I had 3000 miles on the engine since the rebuild, it was obvious to me, via careful checking of oil levels using the required "LS7 procedure" (run engine until oil temp is at lest 150°F, shut the engine off, wait exactly five-minutes then check the oil) starting as soon as I left Katech with the rebuilt engine that the engine's oil consumption was, once again, in my opinion, too high. Katech asked me to observe the oil use checking procedure GM dealers use when dealing with a customer complaint of high oil consumption. One facet of that procedure is there must be at least 4000 miles on a "new" engine before a dealer can conduct an oil use test. Katech and I agreed that I'd continue to monitor oil use until the 5000 mile mark. Actually, I went to over 5000 miles. Oil use worsened after the first 3000 miles and continued to gradually increase until I ended the test at 5358-miles after the rebuild. I should add that in my opinion, for the near $20,000.00 one pays for a Katech engine which is broken in on an engine dyno, from "day one", its oil use in a normal street duty cycle should stabilize at a reasonable rate and do so sooner than 4000 miles.
In reality, since it was rebuilt, in 5358 miles, my Street Attack LS7 has used 7.4995-qts for an average of 714 miles per quart. In the last 764 miles of this test, it used 2 ⅛-qts or 359.5 miles per qt.
When I picked up the car after the rebuild at Katech at the end of October 2018, I promised Katech President, Steve Spurr, that I would not make any changes in calibration for the first 4000 miles. Once the rebuilt engine reached 4000 miles, I began working on idle quality, again. You have to understand that when it comes to tuning, I'm much more into idle and part-throttle drivability that are most DIY "tuners". I started with the calibration Katech put in the ECM after the rebuild, which, I might add, was better idle-wise than was the first Katech cal. The only tables I changed were idle spark advance, tables controlling adaptive spark and adaptive throttle opening, along with re-enabling DFCO. The result was a relatively smooth, 700-rpm idle...not as smooth as a stock LS7, but considering the Torquer 116 cam has a bit more overlap and 5.5° less lobe separation, the idle is pretty nice.
Other than that, I've made no changes to Katech calibration. I did install my wideband O2 sensor and ran some on-road acceleration tests (uphill, third gear, 1500-7000 rpm) which seem to indicate the engine is rich at wide-open throttle but, if that's the way Katech wants it's Street Attack LS7s calibrated, it is what it is. Also, while I've not been able to confirm it so far, I've wondered if my wideband, an Innovate Motorsports LC2 is accurate. I was going to check it against the wideband my chassis dyno service, Westech Performance Group in Mira Loma CA, uses but decided to forgo any chassis dyno testing until I have the oil use issue sorted out.
Back to your original question, "Tool Hoarder"...
While it is true that, technically, I've voided Katech's warranty, again, I'm confident that there is no freakin' way that modestly changing the tables for idle spark and adaptive idle functions would cause oil consumption to skyrocket. I defy anyone who feels otherwise to prove that it will.
I am hopeful that Katech will arrive at the same conclusion.
I've had some PMs from other ZO6ers on this forum about pistons which suggest maybe the type of piston, ie: Mahle forged in combination with the required piston-to-bore clearance is causing the problem. I'm not going to speculate whether that is or is not an issue.
I can only say that GM is using a forged Mahle piston in the 2018 ZR-1's LT5. Over 2000 ZR-1s are on the road at this point. My guess is, of the first 1500 or so, there are enough cars with 4000 or more miles on the engines that if the LT5 had an oil consumption problem because of its pistons in normal street use, we'd have known about it by now. Also, GMs Performance and Racing Center builds 5.5L V8s for Corvette Racing. The cylinder case in the 5.5 is an LS7 block and GM uses a forged piston. At LeMans in 2018, those engines used half a quart of oil in the 3000 race miles run over 24-hours in that race.
My belief is that getting reasonable oil consumption from a Katech Street Attack LS7 is not "rocket science". Lastly, my definition of "reasonable" is half or better of the oil use a stock LS7 exhibits. When it was stock, my LS7 used a quart of oil every 8000-10,000 miles of "normal" driving, so my hope would be that a Katech Street Attack LS7 could exhibit oil consumption of 4000-5000-miles per quart in a "normal driving" duty cycle.
Let me know what you think.
Last edited by Hib Halverson; 03-17-2019 at 06:14 PM.
Hib, sad to say, the more I read your in-depth reports the more I'm losing faith in Katech being the end all, be all of the LS world. I honestly feel they're grabbing at straws and looking for ways to dodge their warranty responsibilities. I totally agree with you that your relatively minor changes to their totally FUBARed tune WOULD NOT contribute to oil consumption, especially in light of the fact that your engine was proverbial "2 stroke" before you did anything. It also troubles me that all I hear is crickets when it comes to a response from Jacob. Just saying...
Hib, sad to say, the more I read your in-depth reports the more I'm losing faith in Katech being the end all, be all of the LS world. I honestly feel they're grabbing at straws and looking for ways to dodge their warranty responsibilities. I totally agree with you that your relatively minor changes to their totally FUBARed tune WOULD NOT contribute to oil consumption, especially in light of the fact that your engine was proverbial "2 stroke" before you did anything. It also troubles me that all I hear is crickets when it comes to a response from Jacob. Just saying...
I'm not going to go as far to say that Katech's "tunes" were FUBAR but I do feel that the first one needed some improvement with idle and drivability. The second one would likely have been "ok" to some folks, however, the **** type I am about idle and drivability; it wasn't exactly what I wanted.
Katech has said they want to see this problem to an end and my goal is to help them facilitate that.
I think there is something to be learned by all in getting a Street Attack LS7 to perform they way they have in the past but do it with less oil consumption.
I’m also curious what piston/ring package they’re going to put in Poor-shas build. He sure knows how to drive and he’ll wring the motor out...
It will be a good comparison because he has raced every C7 platform without mentioning oil consumption.
jason
One common thread I have found in talking with those who mainly track their cars but do not use them for a lot of street driving is that track rats don't give much thought to putting in a quart of oil or so after each track day. If they don't do a lot of street miles they may never see oil consumption in normal driving as an issue. For example, let's say you have a track car that gets maybe 1000 miles on the street in six months. Add a quart of oil in six months of street driving and some are likely not going to notice it.
On the other hand, if you're like me and drive a lot on the street then a quart every 700 or 1000 miles begins to add up.
Now, I don't track my car much, but if I did, my bet is oil use would be quite high. Track engines which use a lot of oil sometimes end up having problems with detonation because oil vapor is low octane. If mine was mainly a track engine, I'd like to see oil consumption of, say...a quart every thousand track miles or so and that's using something like 5W40 or 15W50. Corvette Racing gets 6000 race miles to a quart of oil...probably some special 15W50, Mobil 1.
We continue to follow this thread and have been since inception. We asked for, and he agreed to send us, his latest calibration file so we can fully understand his latest tune. We also offered Hib the option of transporting his vehicle back to Katech so we can again examine the engine, both at our cost.
For the record, we drove this vehicle for 500 miles and used 1/4 quart of oil (1qt/2000mi) prior to delivery.
We agree, this current rate of oil consumption is unacceptable.
We value our customers, and work with them to solve any issues they have with our products and workmanship.
Steven Spurr
President – Katech
Last edited by Katech_Zach; 03-19-2019 at 02:21 PM.
Katech did drive my car for about 500 miles after the rebuild before I arrived at the end of last October to pick up the car. In fact, it was Chris Mezaros, who no longer works at Katech, but at the time, was the guy who oversaw the rebuild of my engine, who drove the car to and from Katech each day until it had 500 miles on the rebuilt engine.
Interestingly, both the original build and the rebuild developed similar problems, ie: their oil consumption in the first 5000 miles started out ok but, over that period, increased substantially
The engine after the original build used 11-quarts of oil in about 5000 miles with oil use towards of end of the period deteriorating to about 200-miles per quart.
The engine after the rebuild used about 7.5-quarts in about 6350 miles with the last 750 miles or so using 2 ⅛ qt.
I'm on a road trip right now doing some work for Corvette Magazine, but when I return from this trip, I look forward to working with Katech to solve this "oil consumption mystery".
We continue to follow this thread and have been since inception. We asked for, and he agreed to send us, his latest calibration file so we can fully understand his latest tune.
(snip)
Steven Spurr
President – Katech
Yesterday, I got an email from Steve which said....
Hib,
For the cal, we did not see any large changes that would cause engine failure. Some small idle changes and other modifications that would not actually make any “real” change in the calibration.
(snip)
At this point, my plan is to ship the car to Katech as soon as I am done stripping the car of some radio equipment and associated wiring and antennas original installed for my work on the team which is organizing National Corvette Caravan from southern California this summer. Originally, my C6 ZO6 was the car I'd use for the trip, however, I've picked a different car to use so I need to transfer all that equipment to the other car.
Last edited by Hib Halverson; 03-30-2019 at 06:55 PM.
Have you pulled the spark plugs and looked at them? (takes 20 minutes)
Have you pulled the CAI, removed the TB and looked inside? (takes 30 minutes)
Have you popped off the valve covers and verified that the valve seals are in tact? (takes 30 minutes)
Have you performed a leak down? (takes a few hours) or a simple compression test?
Is there any evidence of oil anywhere UNDER the car, inside of the exhaust tips or on the rear end? (takes 10 minutes)
I would do all of these before shipping my car back to Katech, which will take weeks or longer. If it is a PCV issue or a valve seal issue then the oil will be found in the intake tract or on the plugs and you have found the problem yourself. Yes of course none of this should have happened and Katech needs to fix it, but I myself would want to know what the problem is before blindly sending it back for the third time.
Assuming the ring package is correct and everything sealed/set properly, it could still be ring flutter. If it is in fact a piston ring seal issue then you have a bigger problem, and unfortunately this can be hard to diagnose, as it could be the rings fluttering under high rpm but low load (part throttle) scenarios. This can result in an oscillation of the rings due to an imbalance in the various pressures in the chamber and ring inertia. The system is a dynamic system and as the conditions inside the chamber change (combustion pressure, crankcase pressure, ring radial expansion pressure etc) the rings sometimes may not seal properly due to a natural imbalance in the combustion chamber and not enough ring tension.
So for example at 5000rpm, but PART-THROTTLE, the rings can oscillate/flutter and then they can't scrape the piston walls properly of the oil and you get blow-by and massive oil consumption. Under full throttle the flutter goes away as the pressures balance, the rings then seal/scrape better and oil consumption is lessened. You could tear the entire engine down, measure piston to bore clearance, examine cylinder walls, inspect rings and not see any problem, and that is the problem. The only real answer is increased oil ring tension and a different ring profile to mitigate the blow by. You could test this by taking it to a race track and driving aggressively (HIGH RPM, FULL CONTINUOUS THROTTLE) and see if you still consume oil. If you don't use as much, then your rings are fluttering under certain conditions (high rpm, low load). If you still consume the same (or more) amount of oil then a full tear down is in order.
Have you pulled the spark plugs and looked at them? (takes 20 minutes)
Not since I changed the plugs shortly after driving the car from Katech home. That's on my list to do before I ship the car but I haven't done it yet.
Have you pulled the CAI, removed the TB and looked inside? (takes 30 minutes)
Yes. There was oil in the manifold but no more than I'd expect from an engine with no catch can
Have you popped off the valve covers and verified that the valve seals are in tact? (takes 30 minutes)
Changed from aluminum to CF covers a month ago and when I did, there was no evidence of missing or faulty stem seals.
Have you performed a leak down? (takes a few hours) or a simple compression test?
No and No.
Is there any evidence of oil anywhere UNDER the car, inside of the exhaust tips or on the rear end? (takes 10 minutes)
No evidence of oil anywhere external to the engine.
I would do all of these before shipping my car back to Katech, which will take weeks or longer. If it is a PCV issue or a valve seal issue then the oil will be found in the intake tract or on the plugs and you have found the problem yourself. Yes of course none of this should have happened and Katech needs to fix it, but I myself would want to know what the problem is before blindly sending it back for the third time.
Assuming the ring package is correct and everything sealed/set properly, it could still be ring flutter. If it is in fact a piston ring seal issue then you have a bigger problem, and unfortunately this can be hard to diagnose, as it could be the rings fluttering under high rpm but low load (part throttle) scenarios. This can result in an oscillation of the rings due to an imbalance in the various pressures in the chamber and ring inertia. The system is a dynamic system and as the conditions inside the chamber change (combustion pressure, crankcase pressure, ring radial expansion pressure etc) the rings sometimes may not seal properly due to a natural imbalance in the combustion chamber and not enough ring tension.
So for example at 5000rpm, but PART-THROTTLE, the rings can oscillate/flutter and then they can't scrape the piston walls properly of the oil and you get blow-by and massive oil consumption. Under full throttle the flutter goes away as the pressures balance, the rings then seal/scrape better and oil consumption is lessened. You could tear the entire engine down, measure piston to bore clearance, examine cylinder walls, inspect rings and not see any problem, and that is the problem. The only real answer is increased oil ring tension and a different ring profile to mitigate the blow by. You could test this by taking it to a race track and driving aggressively (HIGH RPM, FULL CONTINUOUS THROTTLE) and see if you still consume oil. If you don't use as much, then your rings are fluttering under certain conditions (high rpm, low load). If you still consume the same (or more) amount of oil then a full tear down is in order.
I'm aware of ring flutter but I tend to think that's not a problem.
If it was, I would think the engine's oil use would have been more consistently bad, rather than starting out an acceptable 2000-mi per quart, then deteriorating to about 700-mi/qt. Also, I would think if ring flutter was present at low-load/moderate rpm, oil use would actually be far worse than 700-mi/qt...maybe twice or ever three times that.
Let me know what you think.
Last edited by Hib Halverson; 04-01-2019 at 10:08 PM.
I'm aware of ring flutter but I tend to think that's not a problem.
If it was, I would think the engine's oil use would have been more consistently bad, rather than starting out an acceptable 2000-mi per quart, then deteriorating to about 700-mi/qt. Also, I would think if ring flutter was present at low-load/moderate rpm, oil use would actually be far worse than 700-mi/qt...maybe twice or ever three times that.
Let me know what you think.
As you already know, there aren't any good, easy answers (or you would already have found and fixed it). If the rings are fluttering then the amount of oil consumption will change depending on driving habits. It occurs specifically when there is low crankcase pressure, low engine load, medium/high RPM and insufficient ring tension and incorrect ring profile. I suspect Katech understands these things very well though and is using the correct ring package for what they did. When I have seen it the oil consumption was around 1 quart per 600-800 miles and could be controlled/lessened by driving more aggressively. It is during the down-stroke of the piston that the issue occurs and the rings lose the ability to control the oil as they oscillate due to a pressure imbalance and not enough ring tension. It does not leave any wear marks that one can see when everything is torn apart. The bore looks fine, the rings appear aligned correctly and not sticking in the grooves, the clearances are good, there is no damage or wear. It is simply the rings fluttering in this circumstance and the only solution is a different ring package. If a tear down shows no wear and all other systems/parts are functioning properly, then a possible culprit is ring flutter.
If it isn't ring flutter or a ring/piston clearance issue (and everything else I mentioned checks out), then it is a mechanical breakdown somewhere due to either faulty assembly/installation, incorrect clearances, contaminants present during installation, premature wear/breakage and the evidence will be obvious when the bores are examined. For example the bore could be getting scored by the rings if ring end clearance is wrong (that little gap you see on the rings is to allow for this expansion). The ring expands faster than the cylinder walls and if the ring ends butt together then they cannot expand properly and the rings will deform, scuff the walls and blow-by will increase over time as the rings sealing and scraping ability is compromised due to damage to both the ring and the bore. Oil consumption will increase over time just as you are seeing. When oil is left present in the combustion chamber to burn, it will show as rapidly accumulating carbon deposits on both the piston top and valves.
I would also do a thorough inspection of the PCV system, looking for any leaks or blockage, and put a vacuum gauge on the PCV system to determine crankcase pressure at idle and under load.
Most of the duty cycle during the period I carefully measured oil use was low load and low-to-medium RPM. The oil use began as about 2000-mi/qt and was about 700-mi/qt when I stopped running the oil use test Katech requested.
I have inspected the PCV system a couple of times and observed no leaks to the outside. In fact, I separated some of the external PCV pipes/hoses and cannot see any liquid oil at all. My belief is the engine is passing oil vapor from the crankcase into the intake.
My plan is to bore-scope the engine before I ship the car to Katech but that may end-up not happening due to the cost of the borescope.
Yes. I sent an oil sample to Blackstone Labs a couple of months ago. The report is attached. The one issue not addressed by the report is that the engine oil had been changed after Katech ran the engine on their engine dyno to both break-in the engine as well as validating it's power and torque. The oil analyzed was not the first fill after the rebuild.
Whereas most of the "wear metal" numbers seemed nominal, the high chrome number attracted my attention. I believe the only place chromium is used is in the oil rings, but I'm not 100% sure.
Last edited by Hib Halverson; 05-01-2019 at 01:46 PM.
Yesterday morning, Pilot transport picked-up the "Blue Bullet" and will take it to their yard in Brighton MI by way of Arizona and Indiana, two stops the driver must make to pick-up other vehicles.
Pilot Transport's, Ann Ruble, first put paper floor mats in the car then covered the seat with plastic.
Pilot Transport driver, Phil Ruble, loading the Blue Bullet for it's third trip to Katech.
I should add that, this is the second time I've worked with Pilot Transport. This time my driver was Phil Ruble who has his Wife, Ann, along with him to assist in loading cars and doing clerical work. Pilot Transport personnel have done an excellent job for me in getting this car back to Katech, twice, now. Pilot also has some of the best rates for closed trailer transportation of collector and special interest vehicles. Anyone needing to have a car shipped should consider Pilot Transport.
Phil Ruble told me the car will arrive at Pilot's yard in Brighton a week from today. Once it arrives, Katech's people will pick the car up and take it to their facility on Clinton Township.
Hopefully, after a few months and a third rebuild, my Street Attack LS7's days of oil ingestion will be over.
Last edited by Hib Halverson; 05-01-2019 at 02:09 PM.
03-09-2019, 02:58 PM
