[Z06] Reluctor Rattle - Crankshaft Position Sensor A out of range DTC-P0336 no start/weak
06-30-2019, 05:27 PM
#1
Reluctor Rattle - Crankshaft Position Sensor A out of range DTC-P0336 no start/weak
Car was hot, stalled from stoplight with not enough throttle, hit the Rev limiter in first, few minutes later heard a rattle, weak on power, worried it was the water pump breaking up so idled for a good half hour in 80+ degree shade, oil temp went up 10 degrees to 222 and plateaued. Tried to pull away and stalled from not enough throttle again, usually needs none on a flat surface, super-slow starter and no start, cooled to 130deg, starter hesitation, weak and very loud clatter at idle, shortly thereafter stalled at idle, starter too weak, CEL pulled P0336 code and cleared, cooled for 30m, starter couldn't turn over(few quarter cranks) let it cool completely, tried to jump-start, no cranks, P0336 code popped again, headlights strong.
Since the reluctor(timing wheel) is interference mounted to the end of the crankshaft and removed with only 200degreesF (and held on by one bolt?) I am thinking combined with the clatter and code twice that it must have dislodged or bent. Have to tow it to the shop just across the street Monday if they'll take it. I usually do my own work, but no Tech2 for relearn, hoping the engine won't need to be dismounted to get to the reluctor on the back, hopefully just disconnect the torque tube coupler.
May have warped a long time ago when oil temp went to 283 for half an hour due to radiator hole, also hit Rev limiter (3.4 sec is so damn soon) a few times since.
Any estimates on hours of labor? Looks like the part's only $22. Does the engine need to be pulled or is this not the major surgery I am expecting it to be?
Since the reluctor(timing wheel) is interference mounted to the end of the crankshaft and removed with only 200degreesF (and held on by one bolt?) I am thinking combined with the clatter and code twice that it must have dislodged or bent. Have to tow it to the shop just across the street Monday if they'll take it. I usually do my own work, but no Tech2 for relearn, hoping the engine won't need to be dismounted to get to the reluctor on the back, hopefully just disconnect the torque tube coupler.
May have warped a long time ago when oil temp went to 283 for half an hour due to radiator hole, also hit Rev limiter (3.4 sec is so damn soon) a few times since.
Any estimates on hours of labor? Looks like the part's only $22. Does the engine need to be pulled or is this not the major surgery I am expecting it to be?
Last edited by Z007; 06-30-2019 at 08:14 PM.
07-01-2019, 09:35 AM
#2
Timing Chain Instead?
I talked to a mechanic and he said it is more common for the tensioner to go bad. So maybe the chain slipped, but it wouldn't run if it had broke and it did for a while, also it was a repetitive clanging sound, not a continuous scraping.
It's going to be hard to diagnose now that it won't start or even crank. If they pull the timing chain cover they can look for witness marks, since I guess cam issues can throw that code too, seems weird how it only gradually got worse.
If I do need to replace it I might as well get a Katech chain or a double-roller Manley(w/ Torrington thrust bearing and button head bolts to reduce clearancing of the pump/cover) Is there a double-roller that doesn't require clearance-grinding: like the Cloyes 9-3167A claims "No machining required and no fumbling with offset bushings."
Car has ~73333mi.
Could I retard the timing safely while I am at it? How much, 2degrees?
It's going to be hard to diagnose now that it won't start or even crank. If they pull the timing chain cover they can look for witness marks, since I guess cam issues can throw that code too, seems weird how it only gradually got worse.
If I do need to replace it I might as well get a Katech chain or a double-roller Manley(w/ Torrington thrust bearing and button head bolts to reduce clearancing of the pump/cover) Is there a double-roller that doesn't require clearance-grinding: like the Cloyes 9-3167A claims "No machining required and no fumbling with offset bushings."
Car has ~73333mi.
Could I retard the timing safely while I am at it? How much, 2degrees?
07-01-2019, 09:55 AM
#3
The relucter wheel is interference and not held on by a bolt. If its damaged, the crank has to come out to replace it.
07-03-2019, 05:55 PM
#4
The noise is there during idle only but it seems too loud to be a spun rod bearing(or "dry" as the mechanic that heard it for a second said) but it could be a main bearing? It definitely sounds slower in repetitions than idle rpm. I guess it might throw that position sensor code if there was excess crankshaft end-play?
Last edited by Z007; 07-03-2019 at 06:33 PM.
07-03-2019, 07:39 PM
#5
Slow is the bottom end, twice crankshaft speed/frequency is going to be in the valve train.
No to the endplay, one has nothing to do with the other.
You really need to drop the oil pan and pull the valve covers off. I'd probably start at the bottom based upon your comments.
No to the endplay, one has nothing to do with the other.
You really need to drop the oil pan and pull the valve covers off. I'd probably start at the bottom based upon your comments.
07-03-2019, 11:25 PM
#6
Burning Brakes
Slow is the bottom end, twice crankshaft speed/frequency is going to be in the valve train.
No to the endplay, one has nothing to do with the other.
You really need to drop the oil pan and pull the valve covers off. I'd probably start at the bottom based upon your comments.
No to the endplay, one has nothing to do with the other.
You really need to drop the oil pan and pull the valve covers off. I'd probably start at the bottom based upon your comments.
Loose bearings would have to be catastrophic to cause it to stall I’d think.
07-04-2019, 04:52 PM
#7
Supporting Vendor
Car was hot, stalled from stoplight with not enough throttle, hit the Rev limiter in first, few minutes later heard a rattle, weak on power, worried it was the water pump breaking up so idled for a good half hour in 80+ degree shade, oil temp went up 10 degrees to 222 and plateaued. Tried to pull away and stalled from not enough throttle again, usually needs none on a flat surface, super-slow starter and no start, cooled to 130deg, starter hesitation, weak and very loud clatter at idle, shortly thereafter stalled at idle, starter too weak, CEL pulled P0336 code and cleared, cooled for 30m, starter couldn't turn over(few quarter cranks) let it cool completely, tried to jump-start, no cranks, P0336 code popped again, headlights strong.
Since the reluctor(timing wheel) is interference mounted to the end of the crankshaft and removed with only 200degreesF (and held on by one bolt?) I am thinking combined with the clatter and code twice that it must have dislodged or bent. Have to tow it to the shop just across the street Monday if they'll take it. I usually do my own work, but no Tech2 for relearn, hoping the engine won't need to be dismounted to get to the reluctor on the back, hopefully just disconnect the torque tube coupler.
May have warped a long time ago when oil temp went to 283 for half an hour due to radiator hole, also hit Rev limiter (3.4 sec is so damn soon) a few times since.
Any estimates on hours of labor? Looks like the part's only $22. Does the engine need to be pulled or is this not the major surgery I am expecting it to be?
Since the reluctor(timing wheel) is interference mounted to the end of the crankshaft and removed with only 200degreesF (and held on by one bolt?) I am thinking combined with the clatter and code twice that it must have dislodged or bent. Have to tow it to the shop just across the street Monday if they'll take it. I usually do my own work, but no Tech2 for relearn, hoping the engine won't need to be dismounted to get to the reluctor on the back, hopefully just disconnect the torque tube coupler.
May have warped a long time ago when oil temp went to 283 for half an hour due to radiator hole, also hit Rev limiter (3.4 sec is so damn soon) a few times since.
Any estimates on hours of labor? Looks like the part's only $22. Does the engine need to be pulled or is this not the major surgery I am expecting it to be?
It would explain the noise at idle and subsequently not even being able to turn it over. It would also cause the P0336 code which can happen from the motor not turning over fast enough while trying to start. A lot of people mistakenly think the code is the reason for it not starting, but it's usually the other way around.
I doubt there's anything wrong with the reluctor wheel either. In all the motors I've blown (including a couple catastrophic failures at the track) the reluctor wheel has never been even moderately hurt. Plus, it wouldn't prevent it from being able to turn over.
Sounds like you're looking at a rebuild.
07-04-2019, 11:03 PM
#8
07-12-2019, 02:57 PM
#9
I started a new thread to get better visibility for help, because I don't think I can change the thread title to BLOWN motor $16K to replace, my car hates me:
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...d-cheaper.html
https://www.corvetteforum.com/forums...d-cheaper.html
Last edited by Z007; 07-12-2019 at 03:16 PM. Reason: Started new thread for this