JUIC3D

Hey CF-FI section--I'm trying to do some research and understand the different routes I can take with my car.

It's currently a 10 sec car at 128 with bolt-ons and a cam, and I want more. I'm thinking about spraying a 100 dry but turbo is what I'd really like.

Recently, I saw a good looking single turbo kit on a Grand sport vette. It essentially looked like an A&A or ECS kit but had a turbo in place of the blower.

Would this be a good setup? Why does everyone push for twin turbos so much? I can understand why a rear-mount kit would be a no-go, but what's wrong with a bigger single turbo and a crossover pipe from the driver's side head?

I love the idea of the TT setup but with a single seems much less complex.

Am I missing something?

I've seen pictures of Nick's car and I know of the TTIx and APS kits but what is wrong with a single turbo setup on a stock bottom end LS3?

Thanks in advance.

turbotuner20v

Somebody built one in their garage... can't remember the user though.

I think part of the issue is fitment. It's easier to throw a single turbo in an f-body than a vette just due to space constraints.

There are also no pre-made parts that I'm aware of, so it would be all custom fabrication work. If you have a guy who can build it and can remove or relocate the neccssary parts based on the accessories you want to retain in the car, I say go for it.

JUIC3D

I have a guy here local is does amazing custom turbo kits and his welds are absolutely stunning. I'm talking with him to see what kind of price I'm looking at to have him fab up a kit.

I understand the space constraints, but is that the only issue? Is there something special about the LSx motor that makes it much more responsive to a TT setup versus a single?

I've seen single turbo setups in mustangs and F bodies and they move very well, but I'm wondering if there's another reason, besides space, that people don't do it in the vettes.

turbotuner20v

I think 'small' twins just help with packaging and lag, which are the two big concerns w/ the corvette market I think.

JUIC3D

So why not a medium size single that gives the rear tires a fighting chance?

JUIC3D

turbotuner20v

Depends on your goals. If you can do the same thing w/ twins in an existing kit more reliably and cheaper than a custom medium sized single setup, it might not make sense to go down that path. With a 62/62 TTi car making well over 1000whp, I'm not sure when it makes sense to go with the single, or how the power curve and efficiency compares.

I like the idea of a single, and some people might just do it for the cool factor, but there may not be performance advantages. That picture you posted looks interesting, but it looks like you can't fit a filter on it. What kind of power does that car make?

5 Liter Eater

The only single kit I know of like you're talking about is the Hinson kit. I don't think they have a production ready kit for the C6. Apparently they do for the C5 but it has never gotten much traction.

DSteck

It's mostly a packaging issue. It is a lot easier to fit a twin kit and have exhaust that will actually flow. Two 3" downpipes have the same cross sectional area as one 4.25" downpipe, which is tough to route. That's just one facet of it.

JUIC3D

I kinda figured that was the biggest reason. Thanks for the inputs guys.

What's another facet of it Dave?

I'm not talking about kits--I'm talking about a custom fabbed setup that is a 1-off piece. The picture I posted is kind of like what I'd like for it to look like.

I believe that car made 64x through the A6.

I'm not trying to have a 1000whp car or anything, I'd like 700whp or so and be able to daily drive it and run 9s at the track. Right now, the car goes 10s and I want more. My options are blower, turbo, or nitrous.

I'm partial to turbos though as I enjoy the feeling of the boost/power ramping up.

I'd love a twin turbo kit but the biggest issue for me is the substantial added cost when buying an off-the-shelf kit. I know the 6265 kits work well and are proven, but I am leaning towards a bigger single to put me in the 7xx range.

Right now, the car makes 494. Is another 200whp unrealistic on stock motor and a single turbo?

Also, the picture I posted is with the filter/housing removed. It normally looks just like the ECS/A&A filter/radiator cover setup.

DSteck

The hot side piping is the nightmare of a single setup. Fabbing up headers/manifolds that aren't going to crack takes a very skilled fabricator, not to mention the task of snaking that piping around. The cold side isn't so bad.

JUIC3D

The guy who will be doing the fab is very skilled and I feel confident in his abilities. He is local and I've seen a few different kits he's build from scratch and they are gorgeous. He builds brackets/braces for them as well so the weight of the turbo doesn't wreak havoc on the welds.

Is 700 an unrealistic goal for a smaller single? Again, it's going to be a stock shortblock/stock headed motor so I won't be going extreme in the power/tq department.

turbotuner20v

700 should be ok.

Look at this Camaro kit that's out:

http://turboneticsinc.com/store/inde...product_id=491

It should give an example of what can be done w/ a single on an LS3.


In a video I saw it advertised for the Corvette too... but I haven't seen any info yet. Maybe call Turbonetics?

JUIC3D

Thanks for the link TT. I appreciate it. That's a nice kit for sure.

Dragracer_Art

I've owned three different single-turbo cars in the last 6 years...
An 86 Buick T-type and two 87 Grand Nationals.
The T-type ran 11.15 @ 120 on a stock motor and small shot of nitrous.
The 1st GN ran 10.90's on a stock unopened motor with bolt-ons only.
The 2nd GN was a 9-sec combo with a 70GTQ turbo.

I'm absolutely convinced that a single turbo setup can be very efficient and powerful.

I honestly believe the potential from these LS series motors has not been experimented with enough yet.

The factory Buick GN's were running 12-15psi of boost way back in 1986/87... using 80's technology and substandard parts.
With simple bolt-ons, fresh technology and conservative tuning, these same (231 cubic inch) engines are seeing 25+psi of boost and staying together at 500-600RWHP.

I'd LOVE to see a quality single turbo kit put on an LS2/3 Corvette... and I'd love to see it run at the same boost levels that so many Buick V6's are running. (well North of 20psi)

Under the hood of my last GN:

5 Liter Eater

Not sure what it was about the block/heads that allowed the GN/T-Types, and Supras for that matter, to run that much boost but stock LSn heads start to lift north of ~20#.

OP, is it just a cost thing that is driving the single? If so haev you looked at the UPP kit?

JUIC3D

It is almost exclusively a cost thing. If I had deeper pockets, I'd opt for an APS kit and have it professionally installed but it's just not in the cards right now. I wanted more and I was going to just spray it and be done, but turbos are my favorite power adder. The sound, the torque, the surge--it's all addicting and I really want that to be the next mod I do.

I've followed the SpinMonster TT project and the resulting UPP kit--my biggest thing is the necessary oil pump that can fail and the substantially more complicated hot/cold side piping. You also have 2x the parts (turbos, wastegates, bovs) and I would prefer to keep it simple.

I built my car in my garage on jackstands, on a budget. It's not the fastest thing in the world, but I'm very satisfied with how it performs for a relatively small amount of money. (~$3300 total)

I want more though and the ability to grow. I was thinking a bigger single with low boost for my stock motor and when I get bored/sick of that, build the shortblock, turn up the boost and go from there.

I have a lot to learn but I'm trying to get all my ducks in a row before pulling the trigger.

I researched, called, PMed, texted, and emailed for months before finally deciding on a cam choice and I'm glad I did. The car performs exactly as I expected it to and I am very pleased with the results.

ysb02

Twins just means twice as many headaches

I think you can fit a 76mm or so turbo in that location which should give you the 700rwhp. If you want a monster single that will do 1000+ rwhp you have to get real creative with where you mount the turbo (front,side,rear).

I think the big thing is how much heat the turbo / pipes give off. You may be able to keep the wires / acc from melting but over time the high heat can cause a lot of damage. You may want to go with an extractor hood to help.

Dragracer_Art

To touch briefly on the subject of nitrous... I don't think you will find a better HP vs $$$ solution.
I was never a fan of the dry kits.
If I were in your shoes, I'd probably throw a 100-150hp Nitrous Outlet kit on the car and call it good.
If you are already seeing 128mph trap speeds... a nitrous kit should put you well into 9-sec territory.
Getting the car to 60ft will be your biggest challenge... but the HP should be there to do it.

I've always preferred the stand-alone kits with dedicated fuel systems though. It adds to the complexity and expense, but in my opinion it's the best route to go.
You can drive around on the main tank of 93 octane and hit the nitrous with C16 from a separate fuel cell.

JUIC3D

Thanks for the info--In the back of my mind, I've added in the extra cost of a lightweight heat-extractor-style hood to help with the added heat, especially in the Summer heat that Florida brings.

I think a 76mm will be the perfect size for a daily driver street/track friendly stock motor vette. 700rwhp/750tq will be lots of fun.

I've gone back and forth between nitrous and turbo setups and I'm almost certain I'll end up going with a turbo setup.

While nitrous isn't as much of an up-front cost, the added cost of the extra fuel system, safety measures, and the cost of the nitrous itself really adds up. At $3.50/lb, a 10lb bottle is $35 and lasts roughly 60-70 seconds? That's enough for 6-7 passes and then you're having to deal with lower bottle pressure as it empties. Sure you can run a bottle heater or a NANO kit but again, that's extra expense and another bottle that needs to be filled.